Silk Road forums

Discussion => Silk Road discussion => Topic started by: chasezip2201 on December 14, 2012, 07:27 am

Title: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: chasezip2201 on December 14, 2012, 07:27 am
Now I want it to go on as much as you do, but we need to be realistic about this.  It will be shutdown by the U.S. government eventually and there is little we can do about it.

Everyone knows it's being looked into.  When the U.S. government "looks into" something 99% of the time it ends bad.  They shut down the farmers market a much more shitty version of SR and that was an over 2 years investigation.

Do I think they guy going and buying a quarter of bud is going to have his door kicked in anytime soon?  No, but there is no way DPR god bless his soul is running this place alone.  At least a handful of people are helping him and it only takes one ex girlfriend or one do right brother ect. to make the whole thing go under.

Anyways, whats your estimate especially with the growing popularity only more and more attention will fall on it.  It won't be long before we see CBS reporting about this "guy who overdosed on whatever bought from the mysterious underground website SR run by the most dangerous criminals" ect. 

Those who have been around the block a few times knows how this shit goes.
 

Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: KING on December 14, 2012, 07:30 am
Why you talkin all this bullshit man? Are you a bitch.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: KING on December 14, 2012, 07:34 am
You can the the GOVERNMENT to go fuck themselves.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: berry13 on December 14, 2012, 07:50 am
Why are you guys insulting him? He's right in that it's only a matter of time before it goes down, but still...there's no point in speculating because we don't know. Could be tomorrow and it could be years.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: firehawk on December 14, 2012, 07:58 am
It's just one guy insulting him, who double posted because he's a boss...

Anyway. I agree that the attention SR is getting from authorities is not good, but I think the intelligence value of the site could almost outweigh the "benefits" of LE taking the site down somehow.

I think it'll become a honeypot before it gets taken down completely. If I were a cop, I'd be listing bulk supplies, labware and chemicals. Things only large-scale operators want. Then when they buy, you have all the info you need to start an investigation; blockchain data, delivery address, etc. Put a simple tracking device in with the package, and it's a goldmine for intel on people that are notoriously hard to track down.

Sure it could be argued that it's entrapment, but that's only if you use that specific evidence to take the buyer down. If you just use it to get the ball rolling then build up a case, you'd be golden.

tldr; small scale buyers will probably be fine for a long time to come, but buying large scale and manufacturing materials is fraught with danger even now.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: sweetbro on December 14, 2012, 08:03 am
it keeps me up at night.. thats why i want to spend on drugs now and not have a break.

if it ever goes down perhaps one day a high group in the Los Zetas drug cartel opens a web hosting company and future tor websites specialising in drug dealing can be hosted from that as i figure they are about the most untouchable kinds of people the US knows about but cant do much about
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: hashmat on December 14, 2012, 08:07 am
Sorry op, but these posts annoy thre fuck outta me, spec, when my shipping id all choked up at custome & crap.
How long is a oiece of string, how big is the universe, FFS man, have a pill, when it haoppens, it happens.
Frankly i dont think it will, and if it does within the month we will have a new site ;D
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: KING on December 14, 2012, 08:25 am
I bet you whos writng all this shit is the BMR Faggots.  What the fuck is LR.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: berry13 on December 14, 2012, 08:25 am
It's just one guy insulting him, who double posted because he's a boss...

woah sorry I didn't catch that, too many drugs

Anyway. I agree that the attention SR is getting from authorities is not good, but I think the intelligence value of the site could almost outweigh the "benefits" of LE taking the site down somehow.

I think it'll become a honeypot before it gets taken down completely. If I were a cop, I'd be listing bulk supplies, labware and chemicals. Things only large-scale operators want. Then when they buy, you have all the info you need to start an investigation; blockchain data, delivery address, etc. Put a simple tracking device in with the package, and it's a goldmine for intel on people that are notoriously hard to track down.

Sure it could be argued that it's entrapment, but that's only if you use that specific evidence to take the buyer down. If you just use it to get the ball rolling then build up a case, you'd be golden.

tldr; small scale buyers will probably be fine for a long time to come, but buying large scale and manufacturing materials is fraught with danger even now.

eh, I think large vendors already have relations with suppliers of synthesis materials and stuff, I don't think they'd trust some new guy.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: jnemonic on December 14, 2012, 08:28 am
Me personally i'll be slowly stocking up just in case.

Vendors would take orders through PGP emails if it was closed down.

Will it happen, i hope it never does, but i'm sure one day they will shut it down...

But with the profits SR make, i'm sure they have people who are keeping them one step ahead... ;)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: KING on December 14, 2012, 08:31 am
IM just smoking Bud.  But all of sudden all these new BS Post are coming up like the Fuckin stupid priest and zipp2011 what the fuck is all that
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: thecrackhead on December 14, 2012, 09:48 am
Never.

Now, would you kindly fuck off?
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Red Rama on December 14, 2012, 09:51 am
If I had to speculate how long it would take for the U.S. government to be able to shut down SR, I'd say forever. TOR sites are outside of U.S. jurisdiction, so Senator Schumer is more than welcome to cry to Michele Leonhart and Eric Holder all he wants. Of the $60 billion or so of annual drugs sales in the U.S. the DEA stops about 1% of those sales. Barry and Joe are far more concerned with turning the heat on legit dispensaries complying with state law. More than likely they'll just camp some LEO here and use it as a honeypot to snare large scale operations. Trying to take on Silk Road is like fighting a Hydra without a torch. Farmer's Market got busted because they were stupid enough to let people pay with easily traceable methods like paypal. Likely the only reason the investigation took two years was because they wanted to ensure they got as many worthwhile busts out of it as they could. Saying Silk Road is similar to Farmer's Market is like saying a Corvette and a Cavalier are similar, they might be in the same general category since they're both made by Chevy, but you definitely wouldn't put money on the Cavalier in a race.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: samesamebutdifferent on December 14, 2012, 11:16 am
The US government can't do shit, the US economy is on the brink of bankruptcy and on it's knees and governments pointless wars on everything are failing globally, at least a lot of people are starting to WAKE UP and see things for what they really are, not what the news media would have you believe.

The US has wasted more money on its war on drugs and cost more lives than drugs have ever claimed.

This thread is irrelevant, I'm sorry I'm bumping it with this post.

Had to have a small rant though, and no offense intended to any Americans on here.

Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: voice on December 14, 2012, 11:43 am
The cat is out of the bag.
All LEO can do is maybe try to stop SR, or atleast try to fish out the big ones but this formula of anonymously sending each other stuff online is HERE TO STAY.
If for some reason SR to fall (Not likely, definitely not in the near future) copycats will pop up like shrooms in heaven.
Long live the SilkRoad, for intelligent human beings can trade chemicals with 0% criminal interaction.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: ch0sen on December 14, 2012, 11:57 am
Can tell the cunt LE that when they start taking down the banks for the money laundering,

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/blogs/taibblog/outrageous-hsbc-settlement-proves-the-drug-war-is-a-joke-20121213

that they can start worrying about SR.

Although we all know they would never touch the big banks regardless of what they do.  Why is that?  Because they stand to
profit too much from it.  scumbags......

Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Bungee54 on December 14, 2012, 12:32 pm
SR wont got down anytime soon..at least not because of LEO..


technology is on our side..

if SR goes down we will see a darknet market site epedemic ! 


Farmers Market was shut down because NO ENCRYPTION and they used PAYPAL AND WESTERN UNION!

WTF?

there are hundreds off threads like this ...

damn waste of time.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: eetandern on December 14, 2012, 12:52 pm
If the gov't has the power to take down SR, not having SR would be the least of my worries.  even if they did, BMR would be right there to take over and I'm sure others would sprout up.  people are even working on decentralizing the creation of darknet markets, I think the project is called BitWasp.  also think of how long it took them to catch (execute) Bin Laden (assuming they were trying the whole time)  - who knows how hard they are actually trying to take down SR. 

For all the people scoff that the idea that the feds are helpless to stop us all-powerful darknet drug users, I think that is a reckless attitude - plan for the worst, hope for the best. The US gov't is a formitable enemy to say the least, with enough money there isn't much that can't be done - good thing they are out of money and soon won't be able to print or borrow more either :)

I think bitcoin is much more threatening to the powers that be, at a much more fundamental level.  compared to bitcoin's potential threat, SR is nothing.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: ch0sen on December 14, 2012, 01:06 pm
The only reason they would want to take down SR is because it is in competition with their own business model.

The federal gov in the US is bringing the drugs in and making tons off of it.  If SR starts to in any way cut into their
business and they are not profiting, that is when you will see SR go down. 

For the US it is a winning proposition.  They bring in the drugs and make $ from its sale.  Then they lock up the "criminals"
in their private prisons and make money from that.  If they could make as much money from drugs being legal, then the drugs would be legal.
It is all basic economics. 

 
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: grahamgreene on December 14, 2012, 01:20 pm
Now I want it to go on as much as you do, but we need to be realistic about this.  It will be shutdown by the U.S. government eventually and there is little we can do about it.

Everyone knows it's being looked into.  When the U.S. government "looks into" something 99% of the time it ends bad.  They shut down the farmers market a much more shitty version of SR and that was an over 2 years investigation.

Do I think they guy going and buying a quarter of bud is going to have his door kicked in anytime soon?  No, but there is no way DPR god bless his soul is running this place alone.  At least a handful of people are helping him and it only takes one ex girlfriend or one do right brother ect. to make the whole thing go under.

Anyways, whats your estimate especially with the growing popularity only more and more attention will fall on it.  It won't be long before we see CBS reporting about this "guy who overdosed on whatever bought from the mysterious underground website SR run by the most dangerous criminals" ect. 

Those who have been around the block a few times knows how this shit goes.
 

Your are entirely misinformed regarding all of the above.

Suggestion: do some research on how and why The Farmer's Market was brought down, and the differences between that site and Silk Road. I'm also going to hazard a guess that you're American as you seem to have a very America-centric view on things.  ::)

- grahamgreene
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: eddiethegun on December 14, 2012, 05:05 pm
Put the pitch forks and torches away.

OP is right, it will be by conventional means that SR eventually goes down -- human intelligence.
Doesn't matter that they can't find the server by technological means. This whole operation is only as secure as its weakest link.

And besides the ex-girlfriend factor, how in the fuck do you think DPR is cashing out over $2.2 million a month in BTC? He can't. The total monetary base of bitcoin is around $120m.
NO bitcoin business other than Mt. Gox pulls in revenue like this.

He'll get caught for money laundering or he'll get ratted out.
He's no dummy so I presume he's just banking all that BTC in an offline wallet and making big plans to buy an island someday far in the future, when the bitcoin economy has some actual size.
And for what it's worth DPR, I do hope you make it to that island. I'd like to have a pina colada with you someday :)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Psychadelia on December 15, 2012, 01:59 am
it keeps me up at night.. thats why i want to spend on drugs now and not have a break.

if it ever goes down perhaps one day a high group in the Los Zetas drug cartel opens a web hosting company and future tor websites specialising in drug dealing can be hosted from that as i figure they are about the most untouchable kinds of people the US knows about but cant do much about

Seems potentially possible but I find it more likely they'd just start their own delivery service if anything. They already use tor, I could see a simple page with listings and a tormail address...their gonna need a lot more people though haha right now they could do it all over I35 but thats about it. All in all I rather doubt they'd do something like that, they don't need to worry about the money they could make here. Its chump change compared to what they make, and besides that I don't think many people would want Zetas to know where they live...
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: HassleHoff on December 15, 2012, 03:03 am
There is no reason to speculate on who will win in the contest between SR and the State. Thanks to DPR the experiment is underway and we will all find out eventually. SR and bitcoin are an experiment in using technology to return some privacy to the individual. Privacy that has been eroded by the very same technology that now allows the government to track every penny you earn and everything you do with your body.  The US government is going to expend allot of resources to shut SR down , not because of the money or drugs involved , but mostly because the existence of a place like this is a challenge to their authority. Even if SR does get shut down - if the vendors escape punishment it will be a validation of the model under which SR operates and there will surely be other sites popping up to replace it. 
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: quinone on December 15, 2012, 03:40 am
I like pitchforks and torches, reminds me of the good ol day's :)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Razorspyne on December 15, 2012, 05:01 am
I've been away for two days and when I come back someone has posted this Jesus thing in capital letters (DON"T DO DRUGS, I LOVE YOU, SAVE YOUR SOUL, SR IS DOOOOOOMED!!!!!!! and so forth) and now this. Did anyone miss me btw? Probably not. This is my first post so I haven't even checked this Jesus thing yet, I will find it and give him a piece of my mind.

Soooooo........

quote author=chasezip2201 link=topic=93486.msg659905#msg659905 date=1355470030]
Anyways, whats your estimate especially with the growing popularity only more and more attention will fall on it.  It won't be long before we see CBS reporting about this "guy who overdosed on whatever bought from the mysterious underground website SR run by the most dangerous criminals" ect.   
[/quote]

This has already happened pmsl with Ryan West. SR is still running. Not to mention that crackpot Fiona West stirring up trouble with her tabloid-style rant on how "easy" it was to stockpile guns from BMR. BMR is still running. SR is definitely on LE radar and in time they will get more effective in engaging with SR, but at the moment I think it's more likely to be attacks on servers, malware from LE vendors in the Electronics dept. (only buy from trusted vendors like deeo/NQA etc), overloading the site, and attempts at hacking into well known vendors' accounts like has just happened at BMR. It has occurred to me that this BTC spammer on the forums is LE. This is the sort of problems we can expect, nothing major just yet. (It's possible they are testing the security on the forums.)

Hasselhoff hit nail on head. If LE can shut down SR it will represent they have the ability to attack Tor network. The AFP is going after bikies because new legislation supposedly created to deal with them is also deliberately worded in terms that allow LE to go after anybody they don't like, including civilians with no connection to the underworld. Same logic applies to SR. (Unlike the drivel that conspiracy theorist journalists are spouting, there's nothing seedy about the underweb.) I wonder if we turned the tables and hacked into police DBs would they be offended by that.

Another thing, LE is more likely to play games like alleging that they have "caught" DPR, and kre-8 a temporary drop-off in orders as everyone panics and doesn't know which vendors' accounts have been compromised. And monitoring the resulting chatter, not to mention spikes to specified destination urls or TorMail addresses. Oooooh that's right, they can't even do that. Welcome to TheOnionRouter, assholes.

btw, what chOsen said, I've been saying for years. It's well known LEs put drugs back into circulation again, in AU and in U.S. It's the perfect business, as they harvest drugs for free and then sell what's not theirs to begin with, right under the nose of the public.

Bottom line, SR can expect attacks by LE but if everyone uses a bit of common sense they're currently quite limited in what they can. At least currently. So at moment, keep buying and selling, just don't use your real name (even though a lot of people say use your real name and address to avoid it being marked as undeliverable), consider mail drops and don't go blabbing about it to your gf for godsakes. Only problem I have is when people don't use their real nics, like the OP for this thread. It sends a red flag. Apart from that, everyone take a goddamn chill pill, and get back to doing whatever it is that rocks your boat, drive safely, don't forget to eat. Piece out ya bastards ;)

btw, congrats typtap on becoming Hero Member. Ya bastard ;)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Edawg420 on December 15, 2012, 05:10 am
They just need to get into the cloud like thepiratebay.se....pirate bay is literally the most resilient fucking site ever....they been trying to squash that one forever now... and that shit is on the clear web...
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Save0nDrugs on December 15, 2012, 05:54 am
Even if something did happen anytime soon (Which is unlikely) I'm sure there would be another one starting up in its place. I personally would help any way I could and I think most if not all SR would agree. The government can go fuck themselves. Were not hurting anyone. It reminds me of the picture of the guy holding the sign that says gun sellers are accomplices to crimes and the guy next to him is holding a sign that says spoons made me fat. Besides that the government has already made numerous attempts to shut it down. All of which didn't even phase SR.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: A Riotous Defect on December 15, 2012, 06:02 am
They just need to get into the cloud like thepiratebay.se....pirate bay is literally the most resilient fucking site ever....they been trying to squash that one forever now... and that shit is on the clear web...

Regardless of what the RIAA and MPAA would like people think, to both the government and the people drug use is a much larger problem. Nobody dissociates from someone because they pirate movies occasionally. But if that person occasionally drops acid, or occasionally does meth or MDMA or god forbid RC's or heroin, I'd bet a good half of the people you talk to offhand would refuse to further your relationship past anything more than acquaintance level. That's the sad reality of it; the public, indoctrinated as it is, believes drugs to be a REAL threat, not something intangible like piracy. Drug addiction has real effects on people and they don't understand that legalization and education on the dangers and merits of different drugs is the only way to truly combat dangerous drug addiction. It is going to be a very long time for that to get through the skulls of the centrist-conservative-leaning majority in the USA. That's just the way things are.

Which brings back what someone said about television; if it WAS found out that some teenager who had everything going for them OD'd on some drug they got from SR, and the media publicized it, I have no doubt that there would be media backlash enough to warrant a major investigation. Whether that would amount to anything, I don't know. But the power of the people seems to be severely underestimated in this thread. Everyone's talking about how the goverment is either this giant evil mass of conglomerate power or some sort of dying shell of a former self, but no one is mentioning the real power that the media can have in this issue, and how easily it would be to spin the public opinion and therefore change what the government can and will do.

Think about it: what MAJOR power is going to stop the government of any nation from seeking to destroy SR? I doubt that any government will understand that the nature of this site is truly benevolent. What will happen if the government shuts it down? There might be some scuffles between nations remarking upon the idea that any one government can control the endless recesses of the darknet. But will wars erupt? will people die for this? I doubt it. The world will eventually go back to normal.

That being said, I think that it would be extremely hard for any force to do any reasonable damage to SR, the foundation is relatively sound given what it is accomplishing. But can they make it hard to run this operation? I think so. Will they? I don't think anybody knows for sure. But like people have said, people who are saying that there's no way it could happen are living in a dream-world. I don't think anybody can guarantee anything in this regard, for sure.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Macmeth on December 18, 2012, 10:09 am
The rash of 'The end of the world[SR] is nigh' is due to the onset of Xmas. The prophets have been sent by the keepers of the "Faith'' , that amazing super human ability to believe something, when every bit of reason, intelligence, intuition science even, sais it aint so. Unfortunately i would like to have a little faith myself and tell you that if you ignore them they will go away but they actualy get worse.
 The thought has crossed my mind from time to time that perhaps there might be some in high places of some smarts that see the road as a controlled non violent enviroment and its a case of better the devil you know!
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: A Riotous Defect on December 18, 2012, 11:25 pm

Brilliant post.  I can tell you are thinking on a much higher "world view" level than most of the people around here.  It was refreshing to see the first good reply to what I said.

I think there is no better example for the media power than Trayvon Martin case.  Regardless of your individual beliefs on the case it shows how powerful the media was.  Why it was so important I don't know.  This happens thousands of times a day all across the country but what made this so important?  The media relentlessly following it.  Imagine someone buys the medias new favorite toy "bath salts" on the "underground market SR" and kills someone.

The other thing about the media is that there will be no positive bias in the favor of SR, regardless of what news channel it will be on. With maybe the exception of NPR or some independent presses, there will be a general concordance of "this is evil and must be stopped" AS SOON as it's found that a teenager  has died. One thing I'm debating is whether or not a death as a result of research chemicals or a death as a result of some of the 'harder drugs' like meth or heroin will cause the most media focus. On one hand, the media can report that 'dangerous, untested drugs' are being sold offhand to children 'with no system in place to stop it', because it's not like the mass media gives a fuck about genuine reporting. On another hand, they could cite some bullshit claim about the resurgence of heroin in the United States as causal of an increased popularity of SR, or of the inevitability of another rise in methamphetamine use due to mass dealing on SR.

None of them are pretty for the state of things, but there are a few things that I think we can be sure of:

1 . Nobody will EVER be able to stop the smuggling of drugs through the mail. Smuggling has existed since even the notion of prohibited merchandise has been around. If SR is put to pasture, it would be rough, but there would be no way for them to stop the premise of getting drugs through the mail. The whole premise of the site will still be intact.

2. Even if there is media upheaval from some major reporting of SR, there is very little chance that data on the average user of SR will be able to be captured, and even if it is, I seriously doubt that individual governments would be able to do anything with the information. In such a situation, it would be the distributors that would catch the most of the flak.

3. There is always the chance that, due to recent circumstances regarding the policies of the international drug panel ( I forget it's actual name ) and what I inevitably see as a complete legalization of marijuana and reformation of drug policy in general that public attention will be shifted away from drug abuse and towards more fruitful things. In which case, if the public really doesn't care about the issue, the inevitable press of SR will have less effect.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: A Riotous Defect on December 18, 2012, 11:46 pm
Actually you have a few years before they do end all drug mail.
They have new molecular scanning lasers for the airports and mail and security in general.
It finds molecules of a particular substance through many many layers.

Make your darknet drug sales NOW, because the future is back to IRL.

I have to call bullshit. The art of smuggling has been around for many years. Any time they come out with some new bullshit like that, they immediately come up with something to counteract such technology.

That's how technology works. Everything works in balance.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: peperami on December 18, 2012, 11:57 pm
Now I want it to go on as much as you do, but we need to be realistic about this.  It will be shutdown by the U.S. government eventually and there is little we can do about it.

Everyone knows it's being looked into.  When the U.S. government "looks into" something 99% of the time it ends bad.  They shut down the farmers market a much more shitty version of SR and that was an over 2 years investigation.

Do I think they guy going and buying a quarter of bud is going to have his door kicked in anytime soon?  No, but there is no way DPR god bless his soul is running this place alone.  At least a handful of people are helping him and it only takes one ex girlfriend or one do right brother ect. to make the whole thing go under.

Anyways, whats your estimate especially with the growing popularity only more and more attention will fall on it.  It won't be long before we see CBS reporting about this "guy who overdosed on whatever bought from the mysterious underground website SR run by the most dangerous criminals" ect. 

Those who have been around the block a few times knows how this shit goes.
 

The farmers market wasn't a 'shitty version of SR', it was a newish forum on tor for customers of HUSHMAIL VENDOR 'RAVESUPPLY/ADAM FLOWERS'.

They sold drugs via hushmail originally, they didn't encrypt their communications, they took paypal. etc etc. Adam had been selling weed for fucking years on the clearnet, open as anything. People are the weak link, not the technology. Chances are the rat was working with them long before they set up any TOR forums...

 SR is unfortunately populated by children/idiots and will eventually fall because of this. Lets hope DPR chooses his friends wisely, I have a feeling he will.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Tyl3rdurden on December 19, 2012, 02:17 am
Silk Road may get closed down, the sale of drugs online is only just being born :) you cannot stop the trade in drugs it is an impossible task and the internet is the most logical way to do it.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: ch0sen on December 19, 2012, 02:24 am


If they come up with scanning systems, someone will defeat it.  There is always a way.  Maybe we aren't thinking of it now, but historically speaking, every single thing ever done to thwart drugs, pirates, anything grey/black market, has been worked around. 

They may win for a while and slow things down, but where there is a will there is a way.  Always.  Since humans have had laws, other humans have found ways around them. 
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: astor on December 19, 2012, 02:34 am
Well if you looked at the technology I was talking about, please explain to me how your gonna cover up mere molecules of a substance and hide them from something that is capable of scanning them?

The assumption you're making about this still nonexistent and unproven technology is that it will fulfill its claims with an accuracy that is anywhere close to useful. Because it sounds to me like corporate marketing hype. I'm sure you'd also hear great things about polygraphs from the people who sell them.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Tyl3rdurden on December 19, 2012, 02:36 am


If they come up with scanning systems, someone will defeat it.  There is always a way.  Maybe we aren't thinking of it now, but historically speaking, every single thing ever done to thwart drugs, pirates, anything grey/black market, has been worked around. 

They may win for a while and slow things down, but where there is a will there is a way.  Always.  Since humans have had laws, other humans have found ways around them.
Some clever Chinese company will invent some kind of laser proof baggie and make millions if not billions whilst undermining the costly introduction of such a machine. It wont happen its pipe dreams.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: A Riotous Defect on December 19, 2012, 02:38 am
Well if you looked at the technology I was talking about, please explain to me how your gonna cover up mere molecules of a substance and hide them from something that is capable of scanning them?

You cant hide on the molecular level.

Unless you have someone spraying all the mail with it.

That would screw it up but for the most part, this is their big upcoming tool that WILL fuck everything up.

Look throughout history and you'll see that every time some groundbreaking technology comes out there's always people that say "There's no way we can do [X]! This will completely invalidate everything we've come to know!" but every single time, that proves not to be the case. There will ALWAYS be workarounds to a system. ALWAYS. That and taxes are some of the only things that you can be assured of.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: my_fake_acct on December 19, 2012, 02:45 am
Not really... look at the satellite industry. people used to hack that shit all the time, but the providers finally won :(
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: hoobydoobydoo on December 19, 2012, 02:46 am
Actually you have a few years before they do end all drug mail.
They have new molecular scanning lasers for the airports and mail and security in general.
It finds molecules of a particular substance through many many layers.

Make your darknet drug sales NOW, because the future is back to IRL.

Where are these "molecular scanning lasers for airports" being used?  I call shenanigans.

I have flown with drugs/weed in my carryon, my pocket, my crotch, my luggage, my sock - Pretty much any way you can possibly imagine.  And all the fucking time too.  There is no way in hell any sort of molecular scanning is going on at any level in any airport

Backscatter uses x-ray technology.  Puffers supposedly can determine traces of compounds in the air after spraying - but they arent anything like scanning technology that can tell you for certain at the molecular level which your describe.  I have been through a puffer with drugs.  Did not alert on anything.  They are looking for bombs not drugs.  Just like the technologies that scan luggage.

I am not saying such scanning isnt possible.  It sounds theoretically possible - but insanely expensive and potentially very dangerous and involving high amounts of radiation.

And you are saying that this will be implemented how in America?  By the USPS which is completely bankrupt as an organization?  Or by UPS and FedEx who no one uses anyway?  Do other governments outside of the US care enough to spend money on technology to do this?  Seems unlikely to me.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Issuvi on December 19, 2012, 02:46 am
OK. Calm down.  No one is going to strip search you for molecules anytime soon.

You're probably thinking of mass spec.  This is pretty sensitive, but probably not going to be deployed for drug scans soon. 
For any spectroscopic detection mechanism, you need to know what you're looking for.  This ususally means a spectral "fingerprint" that indicates a particular substance with high fidelity.  For explosives, there are a few that might work, because there are functional groups that are common in high-energy materials (nitro groups attached to aromatic species, for example).  With drugs, it is not clear that this will work.  The problem is that the functional groups on a lot of drugs are common to a lot of other organics - understandable, because many common drugs are natural products, or close derivatives.

It is also always good to remember that LE is not some all-powerful mythical thing, but a real governmental organization with budgetary constraints and beaurocratic oversight.  There is a money issue.  Detection is a really, really hard problem.  There is interest, and there are tools that "sort-of" work for certain things (mostly explosives, see above).  The problem is that most are really expensive and not likely to be deployed en masse anytime soon.  Dogs are still much cheaper, but it is still important to point out that dogs are still pretty expensive to train, and they take a lot of time. 

The bottom line is that I can't really think of any spectrometer that you could put a person into and which could be deployed en masse in airports.  You can't stick a traveller in a mass spec.  You could rub them with a cloth, and put that in the mass spec (as is done), but again the problem is that you need an unambiguous signal that you can look for.  Again, this is easier to do for explosives than drugs because of the existence of certain common high-energy chemical motifs in explosives that are not found in other things, so false positives are less likely.  The commonly trafficked drugs to not have these unique chemical identifiers.

So, relax.  Your molecules are not going to betray you any more than they have been.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: ch0sen on December 19, 2012, 03:24 am
Not really... look at the satellite industry. people used to hack that shit all the time, but the providers finally won :(

I will tell you something.  It appears that way.  However, it all went very deep underground.  No you cannot download your fix anymore.
I can assure you people are watching TV.  Just like SR is here, well, Dicknet is done.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: A Riotous Defect on December 19, 2012, 03:39 am
OK. Calm down.  No one is going to strip search you for molecules anytime soon.

You're probably thinking of mass spec.  This is pretty sensitive, but probably not going to be deployed for drug scans soon. 
For any spectroscopic detection mechanism, you need to know what you're looking for.  This ususally means a spectral "fingerprint" that indicates a particular substance with high fidelity.  For explosives, there are a few that might work, because there are functional groups that are common in high-energy materials (nitro groups attached to aromatic species, for example).  With drugs, it is not clear that this will work.  The problem is that the functional groups on a lot of drugs are common to a lot of other organics - understandable, because many common drugs are natural products, or close derivatives.

It is also always good to remember that LE is not some all-powerful mythical thing, but a real governmental organization with budgetary constraints and beaurocratic oversight.  There is a money issue.  Detection is a really, really hard problem.  There is interest, and there are tools that "sort-of" work for certain things (mostly explosives, see above).  The problem is that most are really expensive and not likely to be deployed en masse anytime soon.  Dogs are still much cheaper, but it is still important to point out that dogs are still pretty expensive to train, and they take a lot of time. 

The bottom line is that I can't really think of any spectrometer that you could put a person into and which could be deployed en masse in airports.  You can't stick a traveller in a mass spec.  You could rub them with a cloth, and put that in the mass spec (as is done), but again the problem is that you need an unambiguous signal that you can look for.  Again, this is easier to do for explosives than drugs because of the existence of certain common high-energy chemical motifs in explosives that are not found in other things, so false positives are less likely.  The commonly trafficked drugs to not have these unique chemical identifiers.

So, relax.  Your molecules are not going to betray you any more than they have been.

+1, very good post. It's amazing how people latch onto silly things because of fear.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Fuck DPR on December 19, 2012, 03:43 am
Never.

Now, would you kindly fuck off?

Good call fuckwit, only took 2 days before you looked stupid. Dont worry dpr has it all  under control right? haha fkn clueless fanboys
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: A Riotous Defect on December 19, 2012, 03:46 am

Good call fuckwit, only took 2 days before you looked stupid. Dont worry dpr has it all  under control right? haha fkn clueless fanboys

I like how you get on a fake account to promote your SR displeasure. If you were done with this site, why the FUCK wouldn't you use your real account? You're just a fucking vagina, man.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: utf-8 on December 19, 2012, 03:50 am
Actually you have a few years before they do end all drug mail.
They have new molecular scanning lasers for the airports and mail and security in general.
It finds molecules of a particular substance through many many layers.

I have heard of this too. I don't think it's been perfected down to the molecular level as of yet, but can detect certain concentrations of drugs.
It's not plausible for these to be implemented everywhere though, considering just how much mail there is.
An example of what clorox talks about is the IONSCAN 400B (clearnet link: http://www.smithsdetection.com/IONSCAN_400B.php)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: quinone on December 19, 2012, 03:55 am
Dec. 21.

When SR is busted the world will end, be in fear !!!!

:P :P  (I am just kidding of course, this is such a stupid thread to even speculate on, there isn't enough information to make such a speculation)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: A Riotous Defect on December 19, 2012, 03:58 am
Actually you have a few years before they do end all drug mail.
They have new molecular scanning lasers for the airports and mail and security in general.
It finds molecules of a particular substance through many many layers.

I have heard of this too. I don't think it's been perfected down to the molecular level as of yet, but can detect certain concentrations of drugs.
It's not plausible for these to be implemented everywhere though, considering just how much mail there is.
An example of what clorox talks about is the IONSCAN 400B (clearnet link: http://www.smithsdetection.com/IONSCAN_400B.php)

That device must have a concentration of the drug on the swab or whatever for it to detect any drug... Any smuggler worth their salt will know how to properly smuggle their packages without worry if that's all they have to worry about.

Also, those look super fucking expensive. If you notice on the page it says they're used in thousands of airports, but they do not say anything about regular mail or anything. Also, the airports they're in are more likely using them for carryon luggage than for the mail.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Fuck DPR on December 19, 2012, 04:05 am

Good call fuckwit, only took 2 days before you looked stupid. Dont worry dpr has it all  under control right? haha fkn clueless fanboys

I like how you get on a fake account to promote your SR displeasure. If you were done with this site, why the FUCK wouldn't you use your real account? You're just a fucking vagina, man.

Im sorry if my anti sr sentiment is leavng you butthurt, please feel free to post in my thread I made just for fangirls like you - http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=94513.0
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: hoobydoobydoo on December 19, 2012, 06:14 am
That device must have a concentration of the drug on the swab or whatever for it to detect any drug... Any smuggler worth their salt will know how to properly smuggle their packages without worry if that's all they have to worry about.

Precisely.  These systems work under the assumption that the person has trace of whatever the drug is all over their luggage.  Vac seal your shit before putting in luggage always.  Take a shower before you go on flights.

I have had these swabs used on me several times while carrying as well.  VERY rarely are they used anymore now with the backscatter technology so widely deployed.  Regardless - this is NOT molecular scanning technology.  It is technology that can look at a tiny swab and determine if it sees trace molecules on it.  Applying this technology to mail would be so prohibitively expensive it is laughable.  And once again we run back to the same situation - the USPS is BANKRUPT and no other countries care enough about drug smuggling to pay for this.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: clorox on December 19, 2012, 07:15 am
search terms "dhs molecular scan laser"
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: astor on December 19, 2012, 07:32 am
lol, nice try guys but read a little...

http://www.prweb.com/releases/2011/GeniaPhotonics/prweb8922932.htm

coming to airport near you 2013

from there who knows

Yes, from a web site called PR Web, which is not a news site but a publishing platform for corporate press releases, which is what that is. See what I wrote earlier about corporate marketing hype.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: hoobydoobydoo on December 19, 2012, 07:36 am
You went from talking about them using molecular laser scanning already in airports and mail to referencing some obscure marketing article from a tech firm...

I agree that theoretically the technology is possible.

Actually being able to deploy such technology on a massive scale to prove effective is where I disagree. 

And I am not seeing how a marketing article from a company who likely hasn't even developed the technology they are requesting funding for in the press release shows how it would happen today.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: THUMBSuP. on December 19, 2012, 08:28 am
Why you talkin all this bullshit man? Are you a bitch.

looool. +1

You can the the GOVERNMENT to go fuck themselves.

loooool. +1 again if i could.


a lot of valid, intellectual posts in this thread..
but then again a lot of dumb ones too..
but everyone is entitled to their own opinion..
whether it be intelligent or not.

long live the Road!


/thumbs
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Razorspyne on December 19, 2012, 09:38 am
Actually you have a few years before they do end all drug mail.
They have new molecular scanning lasers for the airports and mail and security in general.
It finds molecules of a particular substance through many many layers.

Make your darknet drug sales NOW, because the future is back to IRL.

Can you provide further info? An addy for instance? (Where did you hear this and from whom?)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: bvincent020 on December 19, 2012, 09:50 am
Did The Pirate Bay and Wikileaks get shut down? No. You guys need to realize we are living in an age where the internet has shown the power of truly free people and markets. The government has been exposed as weak and ineffective; they can't control this anymore.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Razorspyne on December 19, 2012, 10:12 am
They just need to get into the cloud like thepiratebay.se....pirate bay is literally the most resilient fucking site ever....they been trying to squash that one forever now... and that shit is on the clear web...

Regardless of what the RIAA and MPAA would like people think, to both the government and the people drug use is a much larger problem. Nobody dissociates from someone because they pirate movies occasionally. But if that person occasionally drops acid, or occasionally does meth or MDMA or god forbid RC's or heroin, I'd bet a good half of the people you talk to offhand would refuse to further your relationship past anything more than acquaintance level. That's the sad reality of it; the public, indoctrinated as it is, believes drugs to be a REAL threat, not something intangible like piracy. Drug addiction has real effects on people and they don't understand that legalization and education on the dangers and merits of different drugs is the only way to truly combat dangerous drug addiction. It is going to be a very long time for that to get through the skulls of the centrist-conservative-leaning majority in the USA. That's just the way things are.

Which brings back what someone said about television; if it WAS found out that some teenager who had everything going for them OD'd on some drug they got from SR, and the media publicized it, I have no doubt that there would be media backlash enough to warrant a major investigation. Whether that would amount to anything, I don't know. But the power of the people seems to be severely underestimated in this thread. Everyone's talking about how the goverment is either this giant evil mass of conglomerate power or some sort of dying shell of a former self, but no one is mentioning the real power that the media can have in this issue, and how easily it would be to spin the public opinion and therefore change what the government can and will do.

Think about it: what MAJOR power is going to stop the government of any nation from seeking to destroy SR? I doubt that any government will understand that the nature of this site is truly benevolent. What will happen if the government shuts it down? There might be some scuffles between nations remarking upon the idea that any one government can control the endless recesses of the darknet. But will wars erupt? will people die for this? I doubt it. The world will eventually go back to normal.

That being said, I think that it would be extremely hard for any force to do any reasonable damage to SR, the foundation is relatively sound given what it is accomplishing. But can they make it hard to run this operation? I think so. Will they? I don't think anybody knows for sure. But like people have said, people who are saying that there's no way it could happen are living in a dream-world. I don't think anybody can guarantee anything in this regard, for sure.

Am compelled to give A Riotous Defect +1 for well composed article, I mean post. Was thought through a little.

OK. Calm down.  No one is going to strip search you for molecules anytime soon.

You're probably thinking of mass spec.  This is pretty sensitive, but probably not going to be deployed for drug scans soon. 
For any spectroscopic detection mechanism, you need to know what you're looking for.  This ususally means a spectral "fingerprint" that indicates a particular substance with high fidelity.  For explosives, there are a few that might work, because there are functional groups that are common in high-energy materials (nitro groups attached to aromatic species, for example).  With drugs, it is not clear that this will work.  The problem is that the functional groups on a lot of drugs are common to a lot of other organics - understandable, because many common drugs are natural products, or close derivatives.

It is also always good to remember that LE is not some all-powerful mythical thing, but a real governmental organization with budgetary constraints and beaurocratic oversight.  There is a money issue.  Detection is a really, really hard problem.  There is interest, and there are tools that "sort-of" work for certain things (mostly explosives, see above).  The problem is that most are really expensive and not likely to be deployed en masse anytime soon.  Dogs are still much cheaper, but it is still important to point out that dogs are still pretty expensive to train, and they take a lot of time. 

The bottom line is that I can't really think of any spectrometer that you could put a person into and which could be deployed en masse in airports.  You can't stick a traveller in a mass spec.  You could rub them with a cloth, and put that in the mass spec (as is done), but again the problem is that you need an unambiguous signal that you can look for.  Again, this is easier to do for explosives than drugs because of the existence of certain common high-energy chemical motifs in explosives that are not found in other things, so false positives are less likely.  The commonly trafficked drugs to not have these unique chemical identifiers.

So, relax.  Your molecules are not going to betray you any more than they have been.

Am compelled to give Assuvi +1 for exact same reason.

Am compelled to agree with A Riotous Defect on subject of kre-8 ing new usernames to post unpopular material. I have said some things on SR that have in some cases got me -Karma, or nearly got me -Karma in others, because I thought it should be said and that the message is more important than the medium. Just say it how it is. Grow a spine. (How do you think I  got MY username? People appreciated my balls in the chat-rooms, though some couldn't swallow all of what I had to give them.)

TY utf-8 for posting addy. 'bout bloody time someone did. Piece out.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: quinone on December 19, 2012, 10:48 am
LOL, you're linking INVESTOR website's as your evidence to your 'molecular sniffing super devices'

Terehertz spectroscropy has been around for like 10 years, you're just completely mangling the information from an investor website with the information from scientific literature showing proof in concept the capabilities of THz range laser's (and you should be embarrassed at how stupid it's made you look).

In TEN YEARS or so when such a technology has been developed and proven to the point where it can be used to make LEGAL determination, firstly nobody is going to buy it because it'll be too expensive and they'll already have their detection methods in place.

Secondly, any smuggler will simply put their contraband in a material that diffracts photon's. materials that are all around us RIGHT NOW.

Sorry but your evidence for THz photon scanning is based on the magical molecule sniffing PR that investor's are begging people to go along with because they know how difficult a system this would be to implement. 

Don't worry guys, the technology out there used to detect contraband already surpasses this devices capacity to COMMERCIALLY detect contraband and yet DOES NOT WORK AT ALL because there is simply TOO MUCH mail to be analyzed.

You may as well go back to your bunker Clorox, Dec. 21 is only 2 day's away.  Go count your batteries and rice just to make sure you're ready !
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: samesamebutdifferent on December 19, 2012, 11:06 am
coming 2013
http://washington.cbslocal.com/2012/07/11/new-homeland-security-laser-scanner-reads-people-at-molecular-level/
When being in a room with contraband the molecules will be all over you.
Its not just hiding things from photons.
I linked the first one so people would know of In-Q-Tel.

These small machines could actually scan the mail as it is machine sorted and also the parcels, I can see it being setup
pretty easy.

Have seen a growing number of posts re this, does not sound good  :-\
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: quinone on December 19, 2012, 11:16 am
GARBAGE ...

Its not just hiding things from photons.

MORE GARBAGE

You don't know what spectroscopy is do you?

Or what a laser is do you?

Or even what a photon is, do you? (it's a quantized packet of EM, the force carrying boson of the EM force lol *facepalm*)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: quinone on December 19, 2012, 11:30 am
What I meant was its not just hiding your big mass of scannable contraband.

Because the molecules will be all over you, your clothes, hair...

Yeah that's called NOISE, and without Fourier transformation it's called 'we can't extract any viable information from it".

Besides, what kind of smuggler would you be to package your product in the same building as there has been drug's before?  Not a good one.  Proper aseptic technique isn't that hard to achieve, and if it were ... damn PCR would be one hard mother fucker of a task to carry out ... whereas it's actually the easiest way to amplify DNA and actually just one of the easiest molecular biochemistry techniques there is to conduct in a lab (and it RELIES on quantities at the magnitude of only several molecules).
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: utf-8 on December 19, 2012, 11:49 am
What I meant was its not just hiding your big mass of scannable contraband.

Because the molecules will be all over you, your clothes, hair...

Yeah that's called NOISE, and without Fourier transformation it's called 'we can't extract any viable information from it".
This. While it's possible that these kinds of things may be deployed, scanning anything that has come into contact with molecules from any narcotic or otherwise illegal material is prohibitively invasive. Consider cigarettes; if one were to scan every letter for molecules of cigarette smoke, a countless amount of time would be wasted on investigating those that merely came into contact with it during their transportation.

Also while these techniques do exist they are currently far too expensive to use in every single post office in the country. Scanning these letters takes a good deal of time which the post office doesn't have.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: ch0sen on December 19, 2012, 12:10 pm
So now every time grandma sends $20 to her grand kids for their birthday, she is gonna get a letter for sending coke
through the mail?  I mean we know most $20 bills have coke residue on them, so if they put this laser in and it
detects at the molecular level, then grandma is a smuggler.  That's what I see happening. 
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: utf-8 on December 19, 2012, 12:17 pm
all the articles I see say it can scan multiple items at a time.
So put one on every machine sorter in the post office...

I understand your need to feel smart or important on the internet forum but ya gotta admit the articles are pretty effin scary.

I don't really have a need to feel smart or important on the internet - it's the INTERNET... Sorry if my response wasn't tailored to your specific concern, I was referring more to my link of the IONSCAN 400B. Yeah, they are pretty effin' scary, but read my last post re: cigarette smoke and ch0sen's on $20 bills... do we not make a convincing point?
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: MR.X on December 19, 2012, 12:40 pm
lets hope we never see the day come that this site goes down for good this place has really been a blessing to me and to many others :)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: hoobydoobydoo on December 19, 2012, 03:25 pm
So put one on every machine sorter in the post office...

Please address the question of who will fund such a project.  Until then, this is fantasy.

And don't say the USPS or Homeland Security because neither of those organizations have any money.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: dabigboss on December 19, 2012, 06:11 pm
Personally, I don't really worry about SR getting busted.  I live in the United States, and I don't believe that our government, or any government sees shutting down SR as a wise use of resources.  I believe this for the simple reason that shutting down SR won't stop vendors from selling.  Even if SR were to be shut down, you could still place orders with vendors through Tormail, BMR, or any other website that would pop up in an attempt to mimic the success of SR.  It's really not a battle worth fighting.  Not to mention, SR has probably fueled quite a number of drug busts.  All it takes is one mistake and the DEA can be knocking down your door.  :-\

Also, although SR has grown tremendously over the past year, it is important to keep in mind that SR is only responsible for a tiny fraction of the drug trade.  Authorities are better off focusing on criminals they can actually see, instead of chasing ghosts on the deep web.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: ch0sen on December 19, 2012, 07:31 pm
Quote
Even if SR were to be shut down, you could still place orders with vendors through Tormail, BMR, or any other website that would pop up in an attempt to mimic the success of SR

The endless game of whack-a-mole.  That's what the drug war has been for the last 30 years anyways.  The authorities probably just
keep an eye on SR because at least they can see whats going on instead of having to find the next one if they shut this place down.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Theaides on December 19, 2012, 11:35 pm
Also consider that the SR is just a tool for vendors to do their business, its something many people over the world are capable of building and even if SR did go down, another online black marketplace will pop up in its place.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: clorox on December 20, 2012, 02:07 am
sorry man I was referring to that guy that was all flustered and insulting me what ever his name is, not you bud  :)

all the articles I see say it can scan multiple items at a time.
So put one on every machine sorter in the post office...

I understand your need to feel smart or important on the internet forum but ya gotta admit the articles are pretty effin scary.

I don't really have a need to feel smart or important on the internet - it's the INTERNET... Sorry if my response wasn't tailored to your specific concern, I was referring more to my link of the IONSCAN 400B. Yeah, they are pretty effin' scary, but read my last post re: cigarette smoke and ch0sen's on $20 bills... do we not make a convincing point?
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: astor on December 20, 2012, 02:18 am
Personally, I don't really worry about SR getting busted.  I live in the United States, and I don't believe that our government, or any government sees shutting down SR as a wise use of resources.  I believe this for the simple reason that shutting down SR won't stop vendors from selling.  Even if SR were to be shut down, you could still place orders with vendors through Tormail, BMR, or any other website that would pop up in an attempt to mimic the success of SR.

Agreed. Technology has matured beyond the capabilities of law enforcement. This is the essence of crypto-anarchy: no amount of guns in the world can solve a math problem. They have all the guns, but smart people create encryption and routing protocols that provide (practically) unbreakable privacy and anonymity. SR is just the beginning. Wait until something like BitWasp or its successor takes off, when anyone can download a zero-install software package similar to the Tor Browser Bundle, but it's an anonymous market platform that can run as a hidden service off their own computer. No programming or internet hosting knowledge required. Just extract and start accepting orders, safely, securely, anonymously.

Despite increased law enforcement and penalties, more people can get a wider variety of purer drugs than ever. I think we're winning.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: DrDeepWood on December 20, 2012, 03:24 am
Holy shit that technology gives me a hard on
It will happen sooner or later, maybe 15 years?
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: hoobydoobydoo on December 20, 2012, 04:21 am
Patriot Act funding is bananas I tells ya..

Patriot act funding is designated for very specific programs such as  FBI's technical support center, VOCA changes, and more border patrol agents.  It is not an open check to put extremely expensive electronic equipment all over the country.  The Patriot act's main purpose was reducing the average citizen's rights - not obtaining funding.

You are suggesting a complete takeover of the not-only-bankrupt but pretty much completely insolvent USPS by another government organization (DHS) which doesn't bring in any of its own revenue, and then suggesting that organization spend tens of billions of dollars on technology which also is unlikely to bring in significant revenue, and will cost billions of more dollars per year to operate beyond the current deficit the program is running; and yet you don't seem to see the problem here?

Been watching too much FOX news or something?
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: OnePotMama on December 20, 2012, 08:52 am
lets hope we never see the day come that this site goes down for good this place has really been a blessing to me and to many others :)

Exactly why I dream of the day when SR can safely move onto the clearnet!

"Searching for that perfect holiday gift to give to your fellow tweaker? Silk Road Gift Cards! Available at a convenience store near you!"

Ahhh, a girl can dream...
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: ShardInspector on December 20, 2012, 12:39 pm
Hulk101 - You know, there is a well established theory that everything that every human being does is a selfish act (bar being imprisoned or otherwise forced against your will).

For example, if you have a family members birthday coming up, you must choose whether to buy them a present or not.
The common way to think would be that to buy the family member  the present would be an selfless act of kindness.
However...
In reality, so the theory goes, you made a selfish act to choose to buy the present because it was better than the alternative of not buying the present and hurting their feelings and having the other family members be down on you etc etc... in other words, the choice you made was selfish because it ultimately served your best interests to keep in good with the family.

I pretty much ascribe to the theory... at least I have been unable to come up with an example where it does not hold true.

I mention it to take away from your trying to paint the SR community as unique in being greed driven.

There is a lot of  very intelligent people here. I invite anyone to shoot down the theory... I'd rather be wrong and end up believing the right thing than be thinking I'm right and believing the wrong think... if that makes any sense **bangs head**
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: BreakOnThrough on December 20, 2012, 01:32 pm
Hulk101 - You know, there is a well established theory that everything that every human being does is a selfish act (bar being imprisoned or otherwise forced against your will).

For example, if you have a family members birthday coming up, you must choose whether to buy them a present or not.
The common way to think would be that to buy the family member  the present would be an selfless act of kindness.
However...
In reality, so the theory goes, you made a selfish act to choose to buy the present because it was better than the alternative of not buying the present and hurting their feelings and having the other family members be down on you etc etc... in other words, the choice you made was selfish because it ultimately served your best interests to keep in good with the family.

I pretty much ascribe to the theory... at least I have been unable to come up with an example where it does not hold true.

I mention it to take away from your trying to paint the SR community as unique in being greed driven.

There is a lot of  very intelligent people here. I invite anyone to shoot down the theory... I'd rather be wrong and end up believing the right thing than be thinking I'm right and believing the wrong think... if that makes any sense **bangs head**

I've heard this theory before, but there are many examples of selflessness IMO.  On a basic level someone who gives charity without anyone knowing about it.  Or someone that goes way beyond what would be expected of them by society.  Something like.. Going to prison for someone they love for example, knowing they'll get no thanks for it ?  Just off the top of my head :)

Don't be too cynical! :)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: ch0sen on December 20, 2012, 02:24 pm
In an open and free market, businesses operate for 1 reason.  To make a profit.  That can be seen as greed I suppose.
If it is true that all human actions boil down to being in self interest only and therefore greed.  But from a market perspective,
SR is here to make a profit for the owner and provide value for its members.  The profit is shared amongst the vendors
and the administration, while the value is shared amongst the buyers.  When the value that is offered by this marketplace
is no longer there, then the business will no longer operate.  I guess if you look at providing a value proposition to the
markets as greed, then it is greed.  I do not necessarily see that as greed.  Are all businesses that operate either IRL or
on the darknets greed?

Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: jesse on December 20, 2012, 04:34 pm
when SR is busted is not really relevant ....it will be, no doubt.
The reality is that within a week there is a new market or we all go to the next best thing BM or whatever.
What I think is important that what you do here (or in another place) has meaning.
That could be you making money, making money helping people, selling because you feel good doing that or making people happy that you are selling what they want/need.
Just for greed, just to get as much money as you can without the need for it -what greed is in my opinion- its no use.
When you are really hungry and want to eat badly in my idea you are not greedy...you're hungry.
When you are not hungry but keep putting food on your plate you cannot even eat and make sure others don;t get that....thats greedy
Well, being here also brings frustration which  others find a good reason when expressing that to bring you down.
The frustration wanting to log in and not able to ....
When its greed you loose money, you can be annoyed or irritated by that.
When not able to contact customers who need what you have, waiting desperately for you to ship the order (and that in the real sense) that is frustrating.
Today, again, for 8 hours trying now and 1 time connected and kicked of is not good.
And yes, new ID 10x, TOR working fine for everything TORmail, SR forum except SR login.
SR busted/going down, no doubt. You see it crumble by the day. Everytime there is something, wile back the big down time, took ages to fix.
All little things we don't even know because it is hidden for our eyes and now with the photo's and all.
One day a smart hacker comes in and fuckes it up big time.
I've been here some time as a vendor, long enough to see the difference in attitude over time.
Even the customers change. When I started there were ''normal'' questions in the messages.
Now often they are so rude that I don't even want to answer them...I do but tell them i will not sell to them :-0
A customer ask me something, I say I cannot do that and he give me an attitude you will not believe.
If you see the energy around it, all the things that happen ...its coming down, no doubt.....
.
 
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: ch0sen on December 20, 2012, 07:47 pm
Quote
Greed is always there and I don't mean greed as judgement like good or bad. More in a sense of "state of being". Stay hungry long enough till you really have great hunger, then go for your favorite dish and you will experience greed. So greed is something which has it's right place and right function. Let's say greed is a kind of FORCE in our psycho-physiological system.

To be able to control a force, one has to have might over an other force which can work diametrical to the first: 2 forces with opposite qualities. And you need a third factor or force: one which is able to modulate the first two forces, so that you are able to navigate your direction.

Hulk101,

I follow what you are saying and find that a pretty interesting topic.  But do you think that is greed?  Is the greed the correct word for what you are describing?
To me greed has a negative connotation.  But what you are describing is not negative at all.  I cannot really think of another word that would fit there so I guess greed works, but it feels like some other word would better describe that.

Interesting nonetheless.  Thanks
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: warmkitty on December 20, 2012, 10:02 pm
If i were selling i would get a seller account prepd on bmr just as a fallback. That said i doubt that anyone is that worried about drugs or closing silk road down. They cant even make a dent in drug activity on terra firma so what chance have they got in cycberspace. Dea legalise all drugs and stop this silly nonsense now !
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: jesse on December 20, 2012, 11:04 pm
If i were selling i would get a seller account prepd on bmr just as a fallback. That said i doubt that anyone is that worried about drugs or closing silk road down. They cant even make a dent in drug activity on terra firma so what chance have they got in cycberspace. Dea legalise all drugs and stop this silly nonsense now !
I have an account there. The problem is you still be loyal to SR. Why? No clue. Thats the point, the momenbt they will make it owrk everybody stay here.
The moment it crumbles, and it will soon, the people who need the items will go where the vendors go.
Like I said, already have an account there waiting. Just a reply ''all message'' the minute SR is working...yeah right !! and all is gone.
No more millions for SR DPR and crew who fuck the ones that made them so fucking rich !!!
They don't care, they have earned enough...all the signs are there and so few see it!!! Mark my words
I TELL YA...EVEN THE FUCKING CAPTCHA IS NOT WORKING...3 4 5 TIMES DO IT AGAIN.
Am I fucking blind, I know I type the right shit
When you use something get it to work. incompetent asses, that what they are.
If you would use this shit in the corporate world you would be so fast out you'll smoking.....
The fact that this site is enable you to sell drugs does not mean it have to work so poorly .
Like the captcha...what is wrong is that it just doesn't work, have nothing to do with drugs...just a cheap program  THAT IS NOT WORKING!!!
OKAY 4th time captcha, who knows, maybe I'm lucky
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: clorox on December 21, 2012, 12:32 am
You ever actually been to BMR?

Its a fucking joke!

No ones gonna make any coins there EVER!

If i were selling i would get a seller account prepd on bmr just as a fallback. That said i doubt that anyone is that worried about drugs or closing silk road down. They cant even make a dent in drug activity on terra firma so what chance have they got in cycberspace. Dea legalise all drugs and stop this silly nonsense now !
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: A Riotous Defect on December 21, 2012, 12:47 am
You ever actually been to BMR?

Its a fucking joke!

No ones gonna make any coins there EVER!

If i were selling i would get a seller account prepd on bmr just as a fallback. That said i doubt that anyone is that worried about drugs or closing silk road down. They cant even make a dent in drug activity on terra firma so what chance have they got in cycberspace. Dea legalise all drugs and stop this silly nonsense now !

I've been there and the one thing they DO have going for them is the speed of the website. Fucking zooms compared to SR, but I guess that's because SR has a bunch more traffic.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: warmkitty on December 21, 2012, 09:18 am
You ever actually been to BMR?

Its a fucking joke!

No ones gonna make any coins there EVER!


Yes ive been there and i agree the place is a joke.
The point is that might change if sr vanished. Bmr could forseeably become the new default drugs marketspace .
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Slicksuit on December 21, 2012, 09:59 am
Now I want it to go on as much as you do, but we need to be realistic about this.  It will be shutdown by the U.S. government eventually and there is little we can do about it.

Everyone knows it's being looked into.  When the U.S. government "looks into" something 99% of the time it ends bad.  They shut down the farmers market a much more shitty version of SR and that was an over 2 years investigation.

Do I think they guy going and buying a quarter of bud is going to have his door kicked in anytime soon?  No, but there is no way DPR god bless his soul is running this place alone.  At least a handful of people are helping him and it only takes one ex girlfriend or one do right brother ect. to make the whole thing go under.

Anyways, whats your estimate especially with the growing popularity only more and more attention will fall on it.  It won't be long before we see CBS reporting about this "guy who overdosed on whatever bought from the mysterious underground website SR run by the most dangerous criminals" ect. 

Those who have been around the block a few times knows how this shit goes.
 

The people that were running the farmers market only got caught because they were using hushmail to communicate with one another..

.. The investigating officers even said that if they hadn't been doing that it would have taken a whole lot longer to catch them.

The were stupid - DPR is a genius.

It will take a lot to shut the place down, but I do agree that one day it will no longer be the beautiful place it is.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: ch0sen on December 21, 2012, 02:55 pm
Quote
Hi!

Yes I tried to avoid a stigmatization of greed per se. That doesn't mean that greed can't lead to very negative consequences. Greed is an instinctual driver which is OK in animals, b'coz the haven't free will. So the greed in animals is controlled outside their own will, "from an other instance", if you will.

The real problems arise in humanity - but we haven't reached that level really, we are more on a level of intellectual animals - where greed can be pushed for consciously. This is the reason why you will never find such perversity and monstrosity amongst animals, like you can find amongst humanity. At that level, greed can corrupt a character so much, that you can't speak of a human being anymore. This is where things turn really ugly.

Does this meet your direction of thinking?

Hulk


Hi.

Basically it does.  Like I said in an earlier post about businesses being in business to make a profit.  That isn't really greed.  If those running the business
begin to do things outside of the normal rules, like price fixing and price gouging, that is where we see greed some into play.    Otherwise it is
a mere drive to exist in the world of today.  Right?
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: PartTimeFiend on December 21, 2012, 03:42 pm
If i were selling i would get a seller account prepd on bmr just as a fallback. That said i doubt that anyone is that worried about drugs or closing silk road down. They cant even make a dent in drug activity on terra firma so what chance have they got in cycberspace. Dea legalise all drugs and stop this silly nonsense now !

Like your comment "Dea legalise all drugs and stop this silly nonsense now" (+1)

p.s. Call me a conspiracy theorist, but personally I reckon the whole DEA war on drugs is phony.  The CIA have been caught importing drugs on many occasions, and are blatantly involved in the trade. Having a 'war on drugs' and being 'tough on drugs' has just meant the creation of draconian laws which punish people for having small amounts of drugs for personal use.  Criminalising these people creates a steady stream of prisoners to fill up the ever-growing corporate run prison system, now known as the Great American Gulag !!!  The new face of slavery.

....so, getting back 'on topic',  No, I don't think the SR will be busted.  My even bigger conspiracy theory is that I semi-believe the SR is actually run by the CIA or some other shadowy US intelligence agency.  ....and if this is the case, I don't think they're doing it so they can put us all in prison.  I think they're doing it so they can get their cut of the highly lucrative drug trade. A kind of tax on drugs.
 Let's face it, they'll never actually legalize drugs in the US, despite the obvious tax benefits if they controlled the sale,  so having a covert operation like the SR is the next best thing.

...and if my theory is completely wrong, you can bet there is a US intelligence agency who would like to be running the Silk Road!
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: warmkitty on December 21, 2012, 07:25 pm
If i were selling i would get a seller account prepd on bmr just as a fallback. That said i doubt that anyone is that worried about drugs or closing silk road down. They cant even make a dent in drug activity on terra firma so what chance have they got in cycberspace. Dea legalise all drugs and stop this silly nonsense now !

Like your comment "Dea legalise all drugs and stop this silly nonsense now" (+1)

p.s. Call me a conspiracy theorist, but personally I reckon the whole DEA war on drugs is phony.  The CIA have been caught importing drugs on many occasions, and are blatantly involved in the trade. Having a 'war on drugs' and being 'tough on drugs' has just meant the creation of draconian laws which punish people for having small amounts of drugs for personal use.  Criminalising these people creates a steady stream of prisoners to fill up the ever-growing corporate run prison system, now known as the Great American Gulag !!!  The new face of slavery.

....so, getting back 'on topic',  No, I don't think the SR will be busted.  My even bigger conspiracy theory is that I semi-believe the SR is actually run by the CIA or some other shadowy US intelligence agency.  ....and if this is the case, I don't think they're doing it so they can put us all in prison.  I think they're doing it so they can get their cut of the highly lucrative drug trade. A kind of tax on drugs.
 Let's face it, they'll never actually legalize drugs in the US, despite the obvious tax benefits if they controlled the sale,  so having a covert operation like the SR is the next best thing.

...and if my theory is completely wrong, you can bet there is a US intelligence agency who would like to be running the Silk Road!

What better to way for the cia to monitor and control the online drug trade than run it. Maybe it was started by some maverick subversive but how long till the mib turned up and took over. I imagine they would be less interested in drug activity than listening for more serious activity. 
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: shunyata on December 21, 2012, 07:41 pm
First the US gov will have to find out where is SR and who is SR? Good luck with that. We will have a new site in days. War on drugs is lost, period. Now quit doing drugs that make you paranoid! :)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Jopular on December 21, 2012, 11:37 pm
If Silkroad gets taken down another will spring up to take it's place.

Packages may get intercepted more, so packaging will evolve.

The pirate bay is still up and accessible by many methods even though ISP's  must block it by law.

Even if they take the internet down then the technology may be developed to create a peer to peer internet using wireless. You just need a critical mass of people willing to run it. Or dial up to a server in a foreign land, like the old BBS days.

They idea and the momentum behind the SR idea will not be stifled.

idea's can be so powerful that various governments have often tried to make them illegal. (thought crime)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: quinone on December 23, 2012, 10:51 am
Oh shit, they're onto us guys !!!

Hurry, hide the meth, MDPV and mephadrone !!!

Shit wait, nm, i'm just tweaking hard.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: hoobydoobydoo on December 24, 2012, 01:21 am
If Silkroad gets taken down another will spring up to take it's place.

I've seen this idea repeated several times in this thread.  One thing I hope people understand is that it would take a while to build up something close to the size of SR.

People call BMR a joke and I kind of agree.  But that's the reality - it would take time to get a replacement for SR capable of meeting the expectations of the current user base.  It would also take a while for trust to be built up.  I would guess vendors didnt start trading in high amounts for some time until that trust was built here.  With another secret website who no one knows the operators of, how do you establish this trust quickly?  I cant think of many ways.

In fact, I would imagine a big power struggle should SR fall involving multiple shady websites sprouting up before one finally taking over many months later after many users had already lost lots of money.

But that's just a guess.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Crack Fox on December 24, 2012, 02:07 am
lol quinone..

I thought SR was going down one day too... I broke my computer, burned my burner and popped some benzos... then I just realized I needed to get off the coke.

long live SR! and finally I can find some serious doses of LSD :┬žD

Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Jopular on January 02, 2013, 12:19 am
Long live silkroad!

If I ever fancy an opiate addiction I know where to come.

If I want to try a new strain of weed, I know where to come.

If I want to roll on the molly, SR is the place.

SR is the place for tripping , pilling , soft and hard drugs and not giving a god damned damn.


It might not get totally taken down, it could be targeted in other ways such as informant vendors, scamming, Tor network attacks, infiltration etc.
The confidence blow could be damaging.
Hopefully techniques could be evolved preemptively to counter such attacks.
Measures relating to shipping standards, trusted long time vendors, and probably many more things.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Theaides on January 02, 2013, 02:05 am
The only way they could actually bust the SR is by outlawing services like TOR network or making such services really difficult to access.  But actually bust bust it?  Highly improbable at the rate they're going.  We had that one guy saying he wanted the SR found and shut down over a year ago?  I'd not at all be surprised if they just gave up at this point.  Surely still fishing for clues but doesn't seem to be a high priority for the law or anything.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Issuvi on January 08, 2013, 12:26 am
search terms "dhs molecular scan laser"

I did this, and came up with a load of utter nonsense.  The phrase "DHS Molecular Scan Laser" is actually unspeak: "DHS"="Department of Homeland Security".  So, it's not a technical term.   If a DHS employee gives a powerpoint presentation.  He/she is probably using "DHS laser" to point at the wall. 

I know a bit about laser spectroscopy.  There is nothing on the horizon that is going to radically change anything discussed on this thread. 
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: BloodThinner on January 08, 2013, 12:42 am
What, Im smoked like 5 blunts within 2hours. Can you eliberate further.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: samspade72 on January 08, 2013, 12:43 am
it keeps me up at night.. thats why i want to spend on drugs now and not have a break.

if it ever goes down perhaps one day a high group in the Los Zetas drug cartel opens a web hosting company and future tor websites specialising in drug dealing can be hosted from that as i figure they are about the most untouchable kinds of people the US knows about but cant do much about

Persoanlly i trust DPR more than any Z any day. Isn't there something where farmers market servers are still up due being unable to find the servers?

When it happens it happens. SWIM knows he received more than his share. Frankly, we dont deserve any more.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: 420SLINGER on January 08, 2013, 01:24 am
The US government can't do shit, the US economy is on the brink of bankruptcy and on it's knees and governments pointless wars on everything are failing globally, at least a lot of people are starting to WAKE UP and see things for what they really are, not what the news media would have you believe.

The US has wasted more money on its war on drugs and cost more lives than drugs have ever claimed.

This thread is irrelevant, I'm sorry I'm bumping it with this post.

Had to have a small rant though, and no offense intended to any Americans on here.

NONE TAKIN
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: samspade72 on January 08, 2013, 02:10 am
The only way they could actually bust the SR is by outlawing services like TOR network or making such services really difficult to access.  But actually bust bust it?  Highly improbable at the rate they're going.  We had that one guy saying he wanted the SR found and shut down over a year ago?  I'd not at all be surprised if they just gave up at this point.  Surely still fishing for clues but doesn't seem to be a high priority for the law or anything.

Interesting you mention this. I recently read an article about tor having a lot of government funding. I donate to the Tor network whenever i can so that the feds can keep their mitts out of it and i urge those that can to do so as well. Lucky for us Tor was established as a way to retrieve information behind firewalled countries. If they take Tor down, they remove a lot of much needed conduits for repressed netizens.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: spazzmatrazz on January 08, 2013, 02:31 am
If you want to support tor, run an exit relay.

The easiest way for the feds to take down tor is by controlling all the relays (by making civilians too scared to operate them, by arresting a few people for the illegal traffic that passes through their relays.)
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: samspade72 on January 08, 2013, 03:46 am
If you want to support tor, run an exit relay.

The easiest way for the feds to take down tor is by controlling all the relays (by making civilians too scared to operate them, by arresting a few people for the illegal traffic that passes through their relays.)

I forgot. By running Tor as a relay you actually speed up the network and provide more obfuscating routes for LE. But in my opinion cash also seems to keep things going. After all, what are we all doing here?
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: samspade72 on January 08, 2013, 03:47 am
If you want to support tor, run an exit relay.

The easiest way for the feds to take down tor is by controlling all the relays (by making civilians too scared to operate them, by arresting a few people for the illegal traffic that passes through their relays.)

I dont run as an Exit node but merely a relay. I doubt i would be bound legally for traffic that passes through here. Id love for them to try.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: astor on January 08, 2013, 03:56 am
Running an exit node when you're doing anything illegal is retarded. There was an exit node operator who got raided and one of the people on OVDB knew him. That's all the details I'll give about that. Not a good situation.

Oh, and this guy (who outed himself, so I'm not giving anything away) had a small amount of MJ and hash, but still not a good thing when you're running an exit:

http://raided4tor.cryto.net
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: samspade72 on January 08, 2013, 04:13 am
Running an exit node when you're doing anything illegal is retarded. There was an exit node operator who got raided and one of the people on OVDB knew him. That's all the details I'll give about that. Not a good situation.

Oh, and this guy (who outed himself, so I'm not giving anything away) had a small amount of MJ and hash, but still not a good thing when you're running an exit:

http://raided4tor.cryto.net

I dont think people know enough about it to be able to deffirenitae between node/relay/client only. Its a shame because if more ran as nodes. wed be "safer".

What he said. If you jaywalk, dont run as exit node. Thanks!
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: InternetDealer on January 09, 2013, 02:55 pm
Let me call the DEA and ask. Brb.
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: Crazy Eights on January 09, 2013, 05:08 pm
Donating to here & there to the Tor project is my way of keeping this thing going

ce
Title: Re: How long before SR is busted?
Post by: BloodThinner on January 09, 2013, 07:21 pm
Au9 19, 3019