Silk Road forums
Discussion => Philosophy, Economics and Justice => Topic started by: hotcrossbuns on April 23, 2013, 09:42 pm
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(dyslexic so soz about the grammer/spelling)
Hey,
So I have noticed it is very uncommon to criticise what we have hear atm.
I can understand why, the concept of SR and the way in which it has been
set up is an amazing achievment and great step in the right direction for Human
Rights and personal choice IMO.
However I do believe that even in this environment there needs to be some kind of
line in the sand. I am not trying to end the party early, I like taking drugs, smoking weed etc etc.
I just don't think the two drugs I mentioned in the title should be made available,
imagine if you are a potential rapist, this would be the perfect place for you to get the drugs to
do so. Completely anonymous, no witness and little if any trace of purchase.
( if you do not know what Devils breath is, google Devils Breath Vice, watch that film)
We now have the freedom to purchase drugs openly, but it does not mean we should do away with morals.
The argument for legalisation of drugs from private compaines such as SR will be delt a blow when some high
profile rape/overdose story hits the press as LE would love societys opiion firmly pressed against us even more.
any thoughts?
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I am glad you agree, I understand that they have other uses and im sure the seller has taken great pains to portray that on his vender page to make him seem human. Lets be honest thou, who really wants to take a drug that could cause memory loss and amenisa when you could get simular downers without such harsh side effects.
It is not up to me either, but are opinions can still carry some worth. If enough users of SR were anguished by this of course it would not be sold it wouldn't be economically viable to piss everyone off and this place must all be about money in the first and foremost sense for selling it anyway.
I might be the first to say it, I like the concept of SR but this not anti-capitalist wet dream as some people make it out, this is so another person/group can get filthy rich.
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I was able to get clarification from DPR who let me know that we don't restrict the sale of any substance.
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"I was able to get clarification from DPR who let me know that we don't restrict the sale of any substance."
and that is as it should be .... I dont believe in 'hurting anyone' But, that said . . I'll use a saying that makes sense ... even though the folks who made it up (NRO) do not so much!!!
"Guns dont Kill people, People Kill people" .....
Just like "drugs dont Do rape, it IS People who DO the raping!"
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You can use MDMA as a date rape drug. You can use LSD for some pretty intense psychological torture. You can use scopolamine ("Devil's Breath") for alleviating nausea and motion sickness. You can use Rohypnol as an anxiolytic and sedative. Few drugs are truly malevolent, and few truly benevolent. The Silk Road community exists by the tacit trust we have in each other to use and distribute responsibly.
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You realize that few drugs other than alcohol are actually ever used as date rape drugs right? Or are you just perpetuating and regurgitating the classic anti-drug propaganda?
Cheap and easy date rape drug synthesis:
Everclear + sugar.
Excess alcohol is masked by the sweetness and is very easy to spike into people's drinks without anyone being the wiser, especially if they are already tipsy. Virtually everyone who claims they were drugged and raped test only for alcohol.
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PLEASE POST LINKS TO THE DRUGS IN QUESTION .. OR LOCK UR POST.. U CHOOSE
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Hey Popper ... that is the first 'sensible' thing we've heard you say . . . nad bugger motek if you aren't absolutely CORRECT! 8)
Good stuff, keep it up! 8)
m m m :)
p.s and +1 . . . coz anyone who gives good/sensible/reasonable etc information here, deserves to, and therefore gets +1 from motek for doing so ;)
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You realize that few drugs other than alcohol are actually ever used as date rape drugs right? Or are you just perpetuating and regurgitating the classic anti-drug propaganda?
Cheap and easy date rape drug synthesis:
Everclear + sugar.
Excess alcohol is masked by the sweetness and is very easy to spike into people's drinks without anyone being the wiser, especially if they are already tipsy. Virtually everyone who claims they were drugged and raped test only for alcohol.
Exactly. Rohypnol (flunitrazipam) is not even water soluble and has been bright purple since the 80s.
GHB/GBL is perhaps a better contender, but GHB has a very strong salty taste, GBL tastes indescribably foul, both however much you dilute them. But both these have plenty of legitimate recreational use.
When I used to take GHB I took the precaution of adding food coloring (and of course didnt give any to anyone I didn't know and trust very well, with full consent). But due to the terrible reputation spread by media etc. you had to be very careful who you mentioned the fact you had some to. (Difficult as one of its side effect s is verbal diarrhea!)
I had one massive steroid enhanced meathead punch a hand dryer off the wall in a bar toilet as he tearfully raged about his girlfriend having "nearly been date raped by two n******s"
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I'm just looking up at one of the replies that I had to click first in order to read ::) and it seems they probably should have thought a couple of seconds before responding to this thread.
I'm sorry but does this mean Silk Road is planning on selling anthrax and ricin in the future? I mean, they did say "anything"....
Sorry, but I was laughing my fucking head off at the Public Relationships thing here. The LE visiting this site must be giggling like silly little children right now. ............. LOL ::) I feel like donating some coin so they can fix up the PR here. Sorry. Too funny! :D Sad, sad, sad..... but funny too! :D
LOL. I love this place. Let me get the listings for some nice universities out there to help. Truly I want to help. I truly, truly do. Lol. Fucking Lol. Where do I go? Honestly, I am laughing my fucking ass off right now.
Piece, Love, and Fuck Haters.
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I'm just looking up at one of the replies that I had to click first in order to read ::) and it seems they probably should have thought a couple of seconds before responding to this thread.
I'm sorry but does this mean Silk Road is planning on selling anthrax and ricin in the future? I mean, they did say "anything"....
Sorry, but I was laughing my fucking head off at the Public Relationships thing here. The LE visiting this site must be giggling like silly little children right now. ............. LOL ::) I feel like donating some coin so they can fix up the PR here. Sorry. Too funny! :D Sad, sad, sad..... but funny too! :D
LOL. I love this place. Let me get the listings for some nice universities out there to help. Truly I want to help. I truly, truly do. Lol. Fucking Lol. Where do I go? Honestly, I am laughing my fucking ass off right now.
Piece, Love, and Fuck Haters.
If you're referring to me, then yes, I should have waited before responding. And what I posted about not banning any substances, that wasn't a direct quote. It was only a response to the question about the specific drugs in the OP's question.
Sorry for not being more clear.
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You can use MDMA as a date rape drug. You can use LSD for some pretty intense psychological torture. You can use scopolamine ("Devil's Breath") for alleviating nausea and motion sickness. You can use Rohypnol as an anxiolytic and sedative. Few drugs are truly malevolent, and few truly benevolent. The Silk Road community exists by the tacit trust we have in each other to use and distribute responsibly.
I was gonna say almost exactly the same thing, but you did first so I'll just repeat it. Would give you +1, but I can't yet... :-\
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This is an interesting discussion even if it is getting me a
lot of bad karma. (Again sorry about bad grammar spelling etc)
You can use MDMA as a date rape drug. You can use LSD for some pretty intense psychological torture. You can use scopolamine ("Devil's Breath") for alleviating nausea and motion sickness. You can use Rohypnol as an anxiolytic and sedative. Few drugs are truly malevolent, and few truly benevolent. The Silk Road community exists by the tacit trust we have in each other to use and distribute responsibly.
No I did not know about MDMA being used as date rape drug,
I did once stop a girl from getting raped at festival when she was smashed
on K so yall make a fair point use of other substances for this.
Thanks for the person who asked DPR :)
Quote "The Silk Road community exists by the tacit trust we have in each other to use and distribute responsibly"
That is a nice idea, but slightly naive in my opinion.
Look at the amount of people that get scammed on here,
in big ways you can't trust an anonymous community when no one pays
for mistakes. Anarchists (like myself) still have a sense of justice, we
just advocate things a hell of a lot differently to society.
Who would come on SR to buy a cure for sea sickness? Unless its flipping awesome cure, in the UK you can just go to chemist get something very cheaply. But I am still researching into scopolamine ("the devils breathe") has anyone tried it for personal use? What does anyone think of the dangers of misuse, I understand there is a problem in Mexico for it being used to rob people.
You realize that few drugs other than alcohol are actually ever used as date rape drugs right? Or are you just perpetuating and regurgitating the classic anti-drug propaganda?
Cheap and easy date rape drug synthesis:
Everclear + sugar.
Excess alcohol is masked by the sweetness and is very easy to spike into people's drinks without anyone being the wiser, especially if they are already tipsy. Virtually everyone who claims they were drugged and raped test only for alcohol.
As for me spreading typical Anti-drug propaganda, well if you test my urine you would be pretty funny read.
It was more like selective drug propaganda :P
However you make an interesting argument to do with alcohol, I will look into this and post back on here, thanks for replying.
You may think that I am against SR and that I am trying to police it or something. To me it is quite the opposite, I want SR to be an argument in the fight for decriminalization for certain substances. I want to be able to turn round to politicians and show them they have no alternative. The longer SR continues the more it will embarrass politicians and LE. I am already working on campaigns in the UK to do just that.
From a public relations view I want SR to have a 'line in the sand' so to speak in order for it to look more credible to the outside world. The sale of drugs that has been given the label of "date rape" is a PR nightmare. I understand I may hold a strange view point on this than others, so, let the discourse continue..
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I think it's a topic worth discussion. I'd say the only intended use of scopolamine is to cause harm to others. It's more like a chemical weapon than a drug. There must be a line to be drawn no?
I understand a lot of people didn't like the fact SR used to sell guns. Isn't this the same?
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Alcohol is the most prevalent date rape drug and in the USA can be purchased in just about every convenience store. It's about time that we stop living in the 80's and going along with the misleading media hype that existed back then regarding Rohypnol for eg. as a date rape drug. It was a period where the DEA somehow managed to convince the federal government to violate the countries constitution by passing the legislature for the 'Emergency Scheduling Act', and the media was either interested, coherced, or just had no other news to report on and started a fear mongering campaign as they're well known to do for just about everything under the sun to bolster the DEA's circumvention of the right's of American citizens. It was played up really big when for a short time there were a few cases of date rape using an exotic chemical ... vs. just alcohol, but that only lasted until Roche added a blue dye to it's Rohypnol so that if someone's drink had been laced they'd know it.
In reality Rohypnol is just a potent Benzodiazepine leaning towards the hypnotic spectrum of benzodiazpine's. Why don't we just call Haldol and a number of other's date rape drugs? Why? Because it was a fearmongering campaign initiated by the DEA to divert people's attention that they could schedule a drug any way they wanted, even when their own internal judges found that a drug should be scheduled in another class (eg. 1985 Judge Francis Young was thrown off the bench when he concluded that MDMA should be classed as a Schedule II drug so that researchers and doctor's had access to studying it, and not even day's later the DEA enacted it's 'Emergency Scheduling Act' to place MDMA as a Schedule I drug. Here we are almost 30 years later with only empirical evidence of it's long term effects, when Judge Younng in the first place could have left us in a position where we would now have 30 years of research and medical data on it's long term neurotoxicity).
The DEA was out to harm the very people it claims to protect, because they must be high themselves to think that any recreational user of MDMA gave/gives a fuck what classification it was given, and the potential gains we could have achieved by now by listening to their own judge and making it Sched. II, instead of throwing him off the bench and enacting an illegal piece of legislature (because the emergency scheduling act doesn't have to go through the house or senate (which breaches your constitution), it's like having an infinite bullet cheat in call of duty lol) incalculably valuable data on MDMA by now. To prevent people from catching on and making efforts to putting a stop to them passing this legislature a number of very isolated cases of exotic drug abuses were sensationalized beginning in 1983, Rohypnol being one of them. It worked ... because everyone focused on these scary drugs, and nobody bothered to care about the boring legal mumbo jumbo (when they should have !!!)
If some asshole want's to date rape a woman, he only needs to split a 40 of tequilla with her and she'll voluntarily fuck him ... until the next day when she realized that alcohol's judgement impairing effect's made her a victim of date rape.
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The vice documentary is a crock of shit. Scopalamine ... the drug we're talking about here because 'devil's breath' is just a euphemism for the Datura plant is indeed a dirty, harmful deleriant. But is most certainly not a Manchurian Candidate inducing drug. If it were, the US would not have spent billions in MKULTRA trying to find the perfect method of controlling someone's actions through the use of drugs (which they did not find any legitimate candidate for). You cannot use it to make someone go to an ATM and withdraw all of their money for you, that my friend is an example of SENSATIONALISM in the media.
Those black chicks in that documentary must have been high on something too, because prostitutes steal their John's wallet and belongings all of the time, when he/she is perfectly sober. What's he going to do, go to the police and say "This prostitute whose services I just purchased stole my shit and i'd like to file a report' ? lol No of course he's not !
What needs to be removed from SR are compounds that have no entheogenic or enactogenic potential at all, and furthermore are extremely potent poisons that have no use in the clandestine manufacture of any drug. I'm not going to paste the link, but there's potassium cyanide (believe it's the potassium salt, may be hydrogen cyanide ...) but it don't matter because all cyanide salts that i know of are extremely potent poisons with absolutely no recreational drug characteristics whatsoever. It's only use is to commit murder, or in the novel organic synthesis of new organic chemicals (none of which would ever fall into the categories of enactogenic/entheogenic compounds) that may be being seeked out to create .. a new industrial cleaner or something. Yet there's a listing for it up live right now, and it has no place being here or anywhere where the public can gain access to it.
If you really want to bitch, bitch about poison's being sold on SR, because their sale sullies the entire essence of what almost all (not counting the murderers) silk road user's want to echo to the world. That's that ANY DRUG (not poison) can be used safely and not cause medical problems or death and that it's OUR BODIES, and with the proper education and respect should be allowed to be altered in any way we feel fit to do. It's mostly a game to withhold the people from gaining power while still saying that they live in a free and democratic state.
That's the only argument the DEA has to ride on right now in it's ongoing 'war on drugs', and silk road represents a GLOBAL example to the entities that wish to suppress the use of mind altering drugs because of social policies developed in the early 1900's (because remember in the late 1800's Coke was given that name because ... IT HAD COCAINE in it ! You could also purchase syringes of cocaine or heroin from the SEARS catalog in that period with it's description of use being for "women to deal with personal women issues (eg. PMS, cramps, etc. etc.). It was also done primarily to curb the influx of Mexican immigration over the border, to demonize black people further, and a number of other things that we now know had no place in being the justification for making a particular drug illegal. Weed was primarily criminalized by the Mormon church in Utah for fuck sakes, because back then the Churches did in fact have more power in many way's then the evolving federal government.
Those Vice reporter's should be ashamed for propagating misinformation to bolster their penetration in the media, and you should try getting hammered sometime, you'll see just how potent a simple and LEGAL drug can be in suppressing you're ability to use rational thought.
The gun doesn't kill the victim mother fucker, the person who pulled the trigger did !
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What needs to be removed from SR are compounds that have no entheogenic or enactogenic potential at all, and furthermore are extremely potent poisons that have no use in the clandestine manufacture of any drug. I'm not going to paste the link, but there's potassium cyanide (believe it's the potassium salt, may be hydrogen cyanide ...) but it don't matter because all cyanide salts that i know of are extremely potent poisons with absolutely no recreational drug characteristics whatsoever. It's only use is to commit murder, or in the novel organic synthesis of new organic chemicals (none of which would ever fall into the categories of enactogenic/entheogenic compounds) that may be being seeked out to create .. a new industrial cleaner or something. Yet there's a listing for it up live right now, and it has no place being here or anywhere where the public can gain access to it.
Cyanide can be used in the manufacture of mescaline I believe. Fentanyl could be used as effectively to kill someone, and could even be masked as an accidental overdose.. A lot of other potent poisons can be obtained legally.
I don't think cyanide or scopolamine should be banned from SR, even though it sucks that some people may be buying it to harm others. Most people would be making their own poisons if they really wanted to kill someone I think.
I agree with the rest of your post though, alcohol is no better than scopolamine, GHB, etc.
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It also is a matter of perspective. Something like potassium cyanide my seem to be poison only to you, but is is a valuable reagent to others.
Something considered a date rape drug may be the narcotic of choice for someone else.
Chemicals often are like baseball bats: they can serve their purpose perfectly well, but also be used to kill someone. It obviously is illegal to kill someone with a bat, and it is illegal to do so too with any chemical. This has nothing to do with the nature of the chemical or bat, but everything to do with how people apply it.
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Here is how I end this thread. I have personally tripped on datura/ scopolamine/ the devils breath, a few times. It's an awesome drug if done correctly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmNnhvnUI3Q
Also I have gotten fucked up on roofies with friends:
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/608148-What-s-a-recreational-safe-dose-for-Rohypnol-(flunitrazepam)
Cyanide manufacture mescaline.
These items are in not lethal, only if used In a certain way they become weapons.
Chaos
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s for me spreading typical Anti-drug propaganda, well if you test my urine you would be pretty funny read.
It was more like selective drug propaganda :P
What like how drugs like cocaine are bad because they make niggers bulletproof, but alcohol is good because of it's cultural acceptance? Seems like pretty typical factually incorrect anti drug propaganda which favors the drugs of one class over drugs favored by a minority. Seems very typical actually.
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Agree with a lot of the points here. Lots of unsubstantiated and/or subjective crap here.
Any fellow chemist will agree that a lot of 'evil' substances have legitimate purposes. Alcohol, for instance being an acceptable toxin which , due to its ready availability and acceptability doesn't raise an eyelid anywhere but is vastly more costly to society than even the likes of heroin.
Rather than making arbitrary forum posts, just go and educate yourself on toxicology / physiology / chemistry etc.
I know people like to hear / read their opinions on forums to get a congratulatory pat on the back from peers, but imo you just look like twits.
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I would love to throw in my two cents here.
I have a buddy who lives in a half way house who also loves GHB and devils breath, Due largely to the fact that they are untraceable in a UA. They are both the only way he can safely enjoy himself without going to prison.
I feel like SR and DPR have come up with very definitive lines that seem to work great. Obviously anything that is sold on SR could be used for bad. Just as some of the things in your local 7-11 could be used for bad if someone really wanted to. What it comes down to is freedom, plain and simple. Just like with politicians trying to outlaw everything from guns, to 32 ounce sodas. Why do we need someone to tell us that that is bad for us or could be used for bad so there for it is outlawed. I feel like people can make up their own mind. As you can see from this forum alone if you start to outlaw one thing it can easily lead to another and then another.
People everyday are out there trying to get laws passed, telling you what you can and cannot have, do, and think and personally I am getting sick of it.
I love SR because they give you the freedom to make a decision that is yours, free of smite, criticism, and that has no limits at all. If we were to start limiting the things that people are allowed to sell, then we would be no better then the politicians that tells you what you can and cannot eat, drink, smoke, buy, sell, think, and shoot.
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I love SR because they give you the freedom to make a decision that is yours, free of smite, criticism, and that has no limits at all. If we were to start limiting the things that people are allowed to sell, then we would be no better then the politicians that tells you what you can and cannot eat, drink, smoke, buy, sell, think, and shoot.
Remember DPR did ban guns.
Chaos
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I love SR because they give you the freedom to make a decision that is yours, free of smite, criticism, and that has no limits at all. If we were to start limiting the things that people are allowed to sell, then we would be no better then the politicians that tells you what you can and cannot eat, drink, smoke, buy, sell, think, and shoot.
Remember DPR did ban guns.
Chaos
He did open the armory. However there wasn't enough traffic to keep it open.
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I love SR because they give you the freedom to make a decision that is yours, free of smite, criticism, and that has no limits at all. If we were to start limiting the things that people are allowed to sell, then we would be no better then the politicians that tells you what you can and cannot eat, drink, smoke, buy, sell, think, and shoot.
Remember DPR did ban guns.
Chaos
He did open the armory. However there wasn't enough traffic to keep it open.
Why do you think that? He never said there wasn't enough traffic as the reason. When I messaged him about it, it seemed to be a moral debate he was having and decided it was to wrong. I mean it had the same amount of traffic as the road did in its first few weeks. Who is to say it wouldn't have blown up like the road.
Chaos
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you've been listening to the media too much, alcohol can be a date rape drug how can the government justify selling it on corner stores?
I use these so called "date rape" drugs. Rohypnol is by far my favorite benzo and it is very euphoric.
GHB helps me sleep. it is by far one of the best sleep aids out there.
ketamine? I dont know why the media says ketamine is a date rape drug. I have met hundreds of people who use or used to ketamine and i know alot about ketamine and i have never heard of someone being raped on ketamine and honestly i have trouble understanding how someone would rape somebody with ketamine..
What would they do, try to slip a whole gram of ketamine into a drink and then rape them while theyre enjoying their khole? And by the way ketamine is much less active orally than by sniffing, so a 0.1gram sniffed is equal to 0.5 or 1 gram swallowed orallly. So anything drink with 1-2 grams or more of ketamine will taste very nasty
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As far as I'm informed scopalamine has no recreational value. Rophies I can't see being sold legitimately on here and if cyanide were being sold for use as a precursor, why isn't it listed under precursors? GHB is a legit drug that people use, though, so as much as the media says it's the "dare rape drug" I don't find it convincing. I'd be happier buying from the silk road if non-recreational drugs used for likely violent purposes were more closely monitored.
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If by date rape drug you mean GHB, you're all wet. It's rohypnol that's a date rape drug, NOT GHB. This is an old calumny against GHB that was promoted by the FDA, and a lot of people (maybe most) fell for it, even you, OP.
GHB was demonized by the FDA (and the DEA) because it was competing directly against established antidepression drugs that were promoted by big pharma, and which the FDA had sanctioned, and we all know how big pharma owns the FDA lock, stock and barrel.
So please, inform yourself before posting this kind of comment.
goblin
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does this rag smell like chloroform to you ?
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As far as I'm informed scopalamine has no recreational value. Rophies I can't see being sold legitimately on here and if cyanide were being sold for use as a precursor, why isn't it listed under precursors? GHB is a legit drug that people use, though, so as much as the media says it's the "dare rape drug" I don't find it convincing. I'd be happier buying from the silk road if non-recreational drugs used for likely violent purposes were more closely monitored.
You would be even more informed if you had read through the whole thread from beginning to end.
Chaos
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I sell a fair bit of Dormicum which can be used as a date rape drug, but I have no problem with this. There are many ways to rape someone that involve other substances or means such as coercion. Also Dormicum is used by some who have great difficulty falling asleep. I'm not your clergyperson here for goodness sake. You can handle your own moral dilemmas. I sleep like a baby...but maybe it's the Dormicum.
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Whatever you may say, scopolamine is a nasty drug with little to no recreational value (anyone can post a positive report ?) and its use on others can't be justified under no circumstances. It should be banned, even if banning does not go well with libertarianism, because scopolamine is mainly used to rob others from their freedom. Think about it.
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Whatever you may say, scopolamine is a nasty drug with little to no recreational value (anyone can post a positive report ?) and its use on others can't be justified under no circumstances. It should be banned, even if banning does not go well with libertarianism, because scopolamine is mainly used to rob others from their freedom. Think about it.
You wanna ban datura and brugmansia plants, too? Don't you see that's the same myopic mindset that led to governments banning marijuana?
Christ, poeple, think!
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Whatever you may say, scopolamine is a nasty drug with little to no recreational value (anyone can post a positive report ?) and its use on others can't be justified under no circumstances. It should be banned, even if banning does not go well with libertarianism, because scopolamine is mainly used to rob others from their freedom. Think about it.
You wanna ban datura and brugmansia plants, too? Don't you see that's the same myopic mindset that led to governments banning marijuana?
Christ, poeple, think!
I fail to understand what you're saying, unless what you're saying is really what I think it is: a fallacy. Pure scopolamine is:
1) extremely dangerous
2) not comparable at all with marijuana
Datura plants can be used wisely (i.e: in some shamanic brews, such as ayahuasca, in very small quantities and not by itself), scopolamine can't.
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Whatever you may say, scopolamine is a nasty drug with little to no recreational value (anyone can post a positive report ?) and its use on others can't be justified under no circumstances. It should be banned, even if banning does not go well with libertarianism, because scopolamine is mainly used to rob others from their freedom. Think about it.
You wanna ban datura and brugmansia plants, too? Don't you see that's the same myopic mindset that led to governments banning marijuana?
Christ, poeple, think!
I fail to understand what you're saying, unless what you're saying is really what I think it is: a fallacy. Pure scopolamine is:
1) extremely dangerous
2) not comparable at all with marijuana
Datura plants can be used wisely (i.e: in some shamanic brews, such as ayahuasca, in very small quantities and not by itself), scopolamine can't.
This is the 10th time I have posted this link about a girl who trips on scopolamine.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?nomobile=1&v=dmNnhvnUI3Q
I personally have had 5 awesome trips on pure scopolamine.
Chaos
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Whatever you may say, scopolamine is a nasty drug with little to no recreational value (anyone can post a positive report ?) and its use on others can't be justified under no circumstances. It should be banned, even if banning does not go well with libertarianism, because scopolamine is mainly used to rob others from their freedom. Think about it.
You wanna ban datura and brugmansia plants, too? Don't you see that's the same myopic mindset that led to governments banning marijuana?
Christ, poeple, think!
I fail to understand what you're saying, unless what you're saying is really what I think it is: a fallacy. Pure scopolamine is:
1) extremely dangerous
2) not comparable at all with marijuana
Datura plants can be used wisely (i.e: in some shamanic brews, such as ayahuasca, in very small quantities and not by itself), scopolamine can't.
This is the 10th time I have posted this link about a girl who trips on scopolamine.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?nomobile=1&v=dmNnhvnUI3Q
I personally have had 5 awesome trips on pure scopolamine.
Chaos
I think it would just be a matter of dosage; so chil, chill!
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As far as I'm informed scopalamine has no recreational value. Rophies I can't see being sold legitimately on here and if cyanide were being sold for use as a precursor, why isn't it listed under precursors? GHB is a legit drug that people use, though, so as much as the media says it's the "dare rape drug" I don't find it convincing. I'd be happier buying from the silk road if non-recreational drugs used for likely violent purposes were more closely monitored.
Roophies can be used as a date-rape drug but your average xanax or ambien can be just as effective... Even Unisom and benadryl could be used as far as I know. Roophies are tightly regulated in europe mainly because of their recretional value, not because of date-rape. And GHB can also be used as one, but it's as legit as flunitrazepam. The demonization of GHB and flunitrazepam by the media are pretty comparable.
And for cyanide, it's also sold for people that want to commit suicide. It's not a murder weapon of choice because it can be revealed in an autopsy, most cyanide is used in suicides. Murderers prefer untraceable poisons.
Whatever you may say, scopolamine is a nasty drug with little to no recreational value (anyone can post a positive report ?) and its use on others can't be justified under no circumstances. It should be banned, even if banning does not go well with libertarianism, because scopolamine is mainly used to rob others from their freedom. Think about it.
Personally, I'd be interested to try scopolamine recreationally. Not everybody wants to buy that just to slip it into peoples drinks. It really seems like an interesting substance, although dangerous, and its effects are less harsh than those of datura which is why I'm interested in it. Chaos also used it recreationally, and I even saw people inquiring for BZ (a deliriant way more hardcore than scopolamine) for recretional use... Sure the effects are not exactly as enjoyable as morphine but it's interesting nonetheless.
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Whatever you may say, scopolamine is a nasty drug with little to no recreational value (anyone can post a positive report ?) and its use on others can't be justified under no circumstances. It should be banned, even if banning does not go well with libertarianism, because scopolamine is mainly used to rob others from their freedom. Think about it.
You wanna ban datura and brugmansia plants, too? Don't you see that's the same myopic mindset that led to governments banning marijuana?
Christ, poeple, think!
I fail to understand what you're saying, unless what you're saying is really what I think it is: a fallacy. Pure scopolamine is:
1) extremely dangerous
2) not comparable at all with marijuana
Datura plants can be used wisely (i.e: in some shamanic brews, such as ayahuasca, in very small quantities and not by itself), scopolamine can't.
Sorry, chil, didn't mean to snap at ya. But when I read or hear the word, ban, I lose it. I get mad as hell.
It makes me think that whoever utters it thinks he knows more than anybody, and knows what's best for everybody. I simply can't abide that. To support to ban is to participate in the authoritarianism that permeates the modern world, especially in the west. It is against freedom, it is for statism and against choice. It is deplorable anyway you look at it.
People have got this magnificent gift the creator (universe, whatever) endowed them with, a mind, a brain. Thay can use it, to decide about certain things, things that make people in power angry, and tremble with fear and loathing.
People, use your noodle, make those in the entrenched hierarchical power structure of domination and control, truly tremble. And strike a blow for freedom everywhere.
goblin
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subbing
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The whole point of SR is to allow voluntary interaction between individuals be the foundation of human civilization. So if you don't want it dont buy it. there are many things in your home right now that can do more damage than the drugs you mentioned. You obviously don't understand the definition of an open market. A simple prohibition of the a fore mention drug would kill the very meaning of what SR is, Witht hat said, If DPR and the team feel that allowing such drug to be sold on the Road could cause it to be shutdown, I am sure they would do it.
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Is there anyone on here who was against the sale of guns, but supports the sale of substances like scopolamine/ricin/cyanide?
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Is there anyone on here who was against the sale of guns, but supports the sale of substances like scopolamine/ricin/cyanide?
I support the sale of guns, but don't like the poisons. Apparently scopalamine can get you high in small doses they're telling me. Not sure I really buy it, but whatevs. Did notice lidocaine being sold. I'm against that, too.
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Whatever you may say, scopolamine is a nasty drug with little to no recreational value (anyone can post a positive report ?) and its use on others can't be justified under no circumstances. It should be banned, even if banning does not go well with libertarianism, because scopolamine is mainly used to rob others from their freedom. Think about it.
You wanna ban datura and brugmansia plants, too? Don't you see that's the same myopic mindset that led to governments banning marijuana?
Christ, poeple, think!
I fail to understand what you're saying, unless what you're saying is really what I think it is: a fallacy. Pure scopolamine is:
1) extremely dangerous
2) not comparable at all with marijuana
Datura plants can be used wisely (i.e: in some shamanic brews, such as ayahuasca, in very small quantities and not by itself), scopolamine can't.
Sorry, chil, didn't mean to snap at ya. But when I read or hear the word, ban, I lose it. I get mad as hell.
It makes me think that whoever utters it thinks he knows more than anybody, and knows what's best for everybody. I simply can't abide that. To support to ban is to participate in the authoritarianism that permeates the modern world, especially in the west. It is against freedom, it is for statism and against choice. It is deplorable anyway you look at it.
People have got this magnificent gift the creator (universe, whatever) endowed them with, a mind, a brain. Thay can use it, to decide about certain things, things that make people in power angry, and tremble with fear and loathing.
People, use your noodle, make those in the entrenched hierarchical power structure of domination and control, truly tremble. And strike a blow for freedom everywhere.
goblin
The problem with libertarianism is that it assumes people are responsible adults with high moral values. But hey, not all people are responsible adults with high moral values and some people are just kids who need to be told what's best for them.
Sure, the government is quick on banning stuff they have no idea about, and banning often equates ignorance, but sometimes, banning is an accurate measure to try to protect people, whether it works or not.
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I support the sale of guns, but don't like the poisons. Apparently scopalamine can get you high in small doses they're telling me. Not sure I really buy it, but whatevs. Did notice lidocaine being sold. I'm against that, too.
I can understand why some of you are against the sale of poisons but... Lidocaine? Seriously? I don't think people cutting their coke are buying lidocaine on SR, if that's why you're concerned.
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Everything is poisonous above a certain amount. Everything has an LD50.
Oxygen, vitamins, even water.
Toxicity is a terrible basis for categorization.
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Rick Ross sounds like an illiterate piece of shit, hopefully he delivers himself a fatal dose of that crap. Let natural selection proceed.
(one can only hope ::))
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First of all, DPR is an individual and although he is at the foundation of SR he stands as an entity separate from the Road [when it comes to addressing issues of morals/ethics].
Because we can assume that DPR is not himself monitoring every single drug that is posted on the site, and that SR is likely made up of a group of people, we can agree to take DPR as an individual out of this question.
So is it moral to have SR allow the trade of drugs used for date rape?
We have to look at both a) the entity responsible [in this case SR Marketplace]
b) the effects of the substances [how much harm does it cause]
SR is a platform where the trade of illegal substances is made possible through technology. It has at heart anarchist values of freedom and decentralization (whether it effectively decentralizes drug-trade is debatable) and SR has yet to show preference or disdain of any specific substance. As the Road is shown now, it is clear that the goal as far as trade goes is purely to enable it, rather than to control certain substances in order to fulfill an agenda. Therefore, SR as it stands now does not have the ethical standing to censor an illegal substance.
Taken in any context, does the drug on its own cause date rape? Or is if often used as a means to facilitate the act of date rape? If we understand this then we also agree that any drug could be used as a means to aid rape, in the same way that they can be used for other recreational purposes. The drug in itself is not the cause of harm, date rape is. Proper harm reduction is not to ban the substance, but to educate those who could be exposed to it.
TL;DR - DPR is not responsible. SR don't have to justify anything. The drug itself is not evil.