Silk Road forums
Discussion => Shipping => Topic started by: foxymeow on February 29, 2012, 06:45 am
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I have to call customs tomorrow and get this sorted out. What kind of questions will they probably ask me? What do i tell them I am doing with the chemicals? I was thinking something along the lines of saying I am re-selling it to qualified research institutions via B2B sites such as tradekey.
I'm out 5k due to this order and I really hope I can either get it released to me or at least shipped back to China so that the supplier can mail it via EMS.
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You are testing the toxicity on plants :p
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DO NOT SAY RESALE.
Legitimate chemical resale involves licensing.
There are literally hundreds of legitimate uses for the HPBCD, however shipping it with 25i pretty much eliminates every reasonable explanation. The 150g is what got your package stopped. They should have been shipped separately. 25i is not currently scheduled nor is it an easy analog. Tell them youve ordered the compounds as a sample for analytical testing. If they press further, inform them that you are unaware of any law prohibiting the importation of these substances, and request their release.
Personally, Id take it up with your vendor. My chinamen have always been good about reshipping customs snatched batches.
You are fortunate that you didnt have any 2ct7 or 5meodipt in this shipment.
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DO NOT SAY RESALE.
Legitimate chemical resale involves licensing.
There are literally hundreds of legitimate uses for the HPBCD, however shipping it with 25i pretty much eliminates every reasonable explanation. The 150g is what got your package stopped. They should have been shipped separately. 25i is not currently scheduled nor is it an easy analog. Tell them youve ordered the compounds as a sample for analytical testing. If they press further, inform them that you are unaware of any law prohibiting the importation of these substances, and request their release.
Personally, Id take it up with your vendor. My chinamen have always been good about reshipping customs snatched batches.
You are fortunate that you didnt have any 2ct7 or 5meodipt in this shipment.
Yeah I know, I gave my vendor a piece of my mind for mailing FedEx. Everyone knows FedEx is bad news bears.
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i would say as little as possible. as long as nothing is specifically scheduled and assuming they are labeled "not for human consumption". if not make that clear, at the minimum. you really shouldnt have to do much more explaining than that. it's really none of their business and the more you say the more likely a slip-up might happen. just make it clear the chems are strictly for research and not for consumption/resale. anything more is unnecessary imo.
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i would say as little as possible. as long as nothing is specifically scheduled and assuming they are labeled "not for human consumption". if not make that clear, at the minimum. you really shouldnt have to do much more explaining than that. it's really none of their business and the more you say the more likely a slip-up might happen. just make it clear the chems are strictly for research and not for consumption/resale. anything more is unnecessary imo.
I'll probably just stick with analytical testing. I was so pissed when my supplier shipped via Fedex. The first thing I told them was, oh jeeze you shipped fedex
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but hey. just be happy you didn't get caught breaking any law's. always a good thing! gotta love the analog act. especially when it doesn't apply at all to sch. III and below! one of 'very' few drug laws i actually kinda like... ;)
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but hey. just be happy you didn't get caught breaking any law's. always a good thing! gotta love the analog act. especially when it doesn't apply at all to sch. III and below! one of 'very' few drug laws i actually kinda like... ;)
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I like the analog act because it keeps Designer Drugs (for the most part) out of the public's eye and keeps them from being marketed. Its one thing to sell RCs at bath salts at a place as sketchy as sex shops but its not like in the UK where Designers are sold in Card shops that market their shit as "Party Pills" out right. As long as Designers are sold in the same way as black market drugs they will stay Grey market as they aren't right up in American's face.
Spice truely was the worst thing to happen to designer drugs cause it brought designer drugs right into view.
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agreed. but i think "overall" the scene/market has done a pretty good job at following the rules, post-webtryp. the numbers of interested parties vs. other classes of drugz helps dictate that too. there will alwayz be some that get emergency scheduled for various reasons, but the longer we can keep things as legit as possible, the longer before they would ever consider introducing some sweeping anti-shulgin legistlation, like in the UK. many of which have never even been sythesized is my understanding, lol... ;) so sad...
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Even if you go through EMS, it all still goes through customs, right? Why would EMS be any less hassle than UPS or Fedex?
They have to label the chemicals anyway, right?
I mean, it's not like you could get the chinese to intentionally mislabel it, could you? :)
Can they actually get watched chemicals through? Cuz, that'd blow my mind.
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They have to label the chemicals anyway, right?
I mean, it's not like you could get the chinese to intentionally mislabel it, could you? :)
Can they actually get watched chemicals through? Cuz, that'd blow my mind.
very much so. i know vendors that have people on occasional payroll in china. they, along with sources supplying all sorts of goodness (from most any common third-world country) will happily ship how you like, mislabeled or not. i've spoken to various international source's that claim to go as far as to pay off the customs in their respective countries. well, or so they claim at least.. ;)
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Even if you go through EMS, it all still goes through customs, right? Why would EMS be any less hassle than UPS or Fedex?
They have to label the chemicals anyway, right?
I mean, it's not like you could get the chinese to intentionally mislabel it, could you? :)
Can they actually get watched chemicals through? Cuz, that'd blow my mind.
There are people in China and surrounding areas that will ship you drums of safrole or MDP2P labeled as something innocent.
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Even if you go through EMS, it all still goes through customs, right? Why would EMS be any less hassle than UPS or Fedex?
They have to label the chemicals anyway, right?
I mean, it's not like you could get the chinese to intentionally mislabel it, could you? :)
Can they actually get watched chemicals through? Cuz, that'd blow my mind.
There are people in China and surrounding areas that will ship you drums of safrole or MDP2P labeled as something innocent.
A drum of safrole?! *faints from pleasure* :-* Tell me more about these intelligent, handsome, magnificent people you know in China!
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A drum of safrole?! *faints from pleasure* :-* Tell me more about these intelligent, handsome, magnificent people you know in China!
Amen to that
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For those who don't know, 1 standard drum is potentially worth 8 million dollars, at a minimum.
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For those who don't know, 1 standard drum is potentially worth 8 million dollars, at a minimum.
Not so sure about that, drums are typically 25kg or 50kg which will not make anywhere near $1mil worth of MDMA, let alone 8.
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well considering you just showed who you are on SR and you are going to call customs I would say either consider yourself compromised (if you had it shipped to your address) or don't call and pick it up and just ignore it (if you had it sent to a fake ID box). If you sell illegal stuff here or really even if not I would clean up shop and quit for a long time though, you just revealed your SR identity to customs.
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For those who don't know, 1 standard drum is potentially worth 8 million dollars, at a minimum.
Not so sure about that, drums are typically 25kg or 50kg which will not make anywhere near $1mil worth of MDMA, let alone 8.
What drums do you be using? Were we talking proper drums or the little plastic ones you find in Wal-Mart? :)
Let's do a back of the envelope calculation:
A average drum can contain ~200 kg of water. Saffrole, since it is an oil, is probably lighter than that, with oils having roughly 9/10 of the density of water, so that's 180 kg. Assuming that say 30% of the saffrole is wasted in production, clumsy chemist syndrome, evaporation etc, that leaves us with 126kg of MDMA.
The average street price in the USA ranges from 70 to 180 dollars per gram, or 30 dollars wholesale. So, that's 8.8 million dollars - 22.6 million dollars at retail, and 3.7 million dollars wholesale.
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well considering you just showed who you are on SR and you are going to call customs I would say either consider yourself compromised (if you had it shipped to your address) or don't call and pick it up and just ignore it (if you had it sent to a fake ID box). If you sell illegal stuff here or really even if not I would clean up shop and quit for a long time though, you just revealed your SR identity to customs.
Well, if I understand the situation right, the materials aren't illegal or even regulated, are they? And do you think LE is really watching this forum 24/7 post by post? I'd hope not, but would be good to know if they do. I'm sure they put some man hours into it, but 24/7 monitoring? idk... kmfkewm's right though (usually is! lol) extreme caution is in order. You should remove the details from your earlier posts, foxy. And if you're still thinking of going in and facing this head on, you might even want to think about talking to an attorney first. It goes without saying, you should clean house. Get any illegals / incriminating shit off premises, close out orders, take listings offline. Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. This is the same way many people who have been busted first came under suspicion leading to the investigation that eventually took them down.
You're one cool cat foxy, would hate to see anything bad happen to you, hun.
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well considering you just showed who you are on SR and you are going to call customs I would say either consider yourself compromised (if you had it shipped to your address) or don't call and pick it up and just ignore it (if you had it sent to a fake ID box). If you sell illegal stuff here or really even if not I would clean up shop and quit for a long time though, you just revealed your SR identity to customs.
Well, if I understand the situation right, the materials aren't illegal or even regulated, are they? And do you think LE is really watching this forum 24/7 post by post? I'd hope not, but would be good to know if they do. I'm sure they put some man hours into it, but 24/7 monitoring? idk... kmfkewm's right though (usually is! lol) extreme caution is in order. You should remove the details from your earlier posts, foxy. And if you're still thinking of going in and facing this head on, you might even want to think about talking to an attorney first. It goes without saying, you should clean house. Get any illegals / incriminating shit off premises, close out orders, take listings offline. Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. This is the same way many people who have been busted first came under suspicion leading to the investigation that eventually took them down.
You're one cool cat foxy, would hate to see anything bad happen to you, hun.
Ditto, I'd assume they are page scraping each entry.
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If they ask you specifically what you're analyzing say you're testing the LD50 rating of the drugs on rats.
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If they ask you specifically what you're analyzing say you're testing the LD50 rating of the drugs on rats.
Never give any information more specific than absolutely necessary. That's why I say talk to an attorney first. You might just as well pass the buck and say, for example, I'm not sure exactly. I just handle business and shipping, my lab partner requested this for testing. Non specific and shifts any blame in intent. But I have no idea what the hell I'm talking about, lol. An attorney would be a very good idea.
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And do you think LE is really watching this forum 24/7 post by post? I'd hope not, but would be good to know if they do. I'm sure they put some man hours into it, but 24/7 monitoring? idk...
I can say WITHOUT a doubt that LE (from various if not most countries) are archiving the forums on a constant basis. Considering how little effort would be involved (as another poster said they would simply use a page scraper) there really is no reason to think otherwise. Never, ever say something on the forums that you wouldn't want your worst enemy to know about.
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I can say WITHOUT a doubt that LE (from various if not most countries) are archiving the forums on a constant basis. Considering how little effort would be involved (as another poster said they would simply use a page scraper) there really is no reason to think otherwise. Never, ever say something on the forums that you wouldn't want your worst enemy to know about.
Is that just because of how technically easy it would be to do, or do you have some solid source of information? Because, I can also tell you that such activity would be easily detectable and stopped by a competent sysadmin, which I hope and would think SR is employing with all the buku dollars they're supposed to be raking in. And, just because something is ridiculously easy in technical terms, don't automatically assume LE is doing it. They've got some very capable contractors, I'm sure. But your standard LE operations are drawing from the same HR pools as the rest of us, and incompetence abounds.
EDIT:
I might also add, SR may have become politically significant because we're a bold publicly accessible slap in the face against a tyrannical system of control, but operationally we're a teensy weensy drop in the bucket of illegal drug smuggling and distribution. And nobody's getting killed, tortured, enslaved and raped over the dope getting moved here. (They should BE so lucky if all drug activity were to go online, lol). Trust me, infinitely more resources are allocated elsewhere. We are not as important as we might like to believe, lol.
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Is that just because of how technically easy it would be to do, or do you have some solid source of information? Because, I can also tell you that such activity would be easily detectable and stopped by a competent sysadmin, which I hope and would think SR is employing with all the buku dollars they're supposed to be raking in. And, just because something is ridiculously easy in technical terms, don't automatically assume LE is doing it. They've got some very capable contractors, I'm sure. But your standard LE operations are drawing from the same HR pools as the rest of us, and incompetence abounds.
I agree with you that incompetence is found in all fields and yes I am basing this on the technical side of things but I don't agree it would be easy to pick up from a sysadmin point of view. Anyone can sign up at any time and with the anonymity that is granted by TOR it would be almost impossible to stop without affecting normal users. There are a limited number of endpoints in the TOR system so banning by IP would not be feasible. Plus I'm confident that along with LE there are also a bunch of scammers and hackers constantly trying to compromise the system.
I'm not trying to be a smartass and I guess my point was that the information you give on the forums is out there, there is no inherent security in who has access to that information.
In fact, it may be worth some time to investigate it myself and run a scraper over the forums with random usernames and TOR identities to see whether it is picked up or not.
But I truly believe it would be naive to think that LE is not all over this site.
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... but I don't agree it would be easy to pick up from a sysadmin point of view. ...
battles like these are an on going process that requires diligence and vigilance and have no guarantees. For every attack, I think of a defense. For every defense, I think of a counter. Is SR even taking the approach of attempting to prevent automated archiving? idk.
You're absolutely right about the necessity of containing sensitive information, though. It's always regrettable to see people throwing out specifics they really ought not to. But when it's done, its done. All you can do is suggest it's removal, educate and engage in conversations just like this one, lol.
In the forums today I came across a link to Eleusis's memoirs and I like to revisit these histories just to remember lessons learned. He had first drawn attention in a similar manner. Fedex intercepting a shipment of legal chemicals. It's funny how he was so surprised they never connected him with his online identity, which to him was such a huge part of his whole experience.
Is foxy fucked? Maybe, maybe not. I'd like to hold out hope. She definitely oughta clean house, cut ties, get her story straight and get an attorney.
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I would hate for anyone on SR to be done - that goes without saying - but even the fact that you do not have to be logged in to browse the forums is a huge security hole in my opinion and that would be my first point of defense in tightening things up around here. At least you could then associate suspicious behaviour with a particular user and block him out as necessary but as I alluded to in my previous post there is no barrier to who can sign up and how many accounts they could create and this, ironically, is a weakness related to the limited & anonymous nature of the TOR system. And this is before you even think of becoming serious.....
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I would hate for anyone on SR to be done - that goes without saying - but even the fact that you do not have to be logged in to browse the forums is a huge security hole in my opinion and that would be my first point of defense in tightening things up around here. At least you could then associate suspicious behaviour with a particular user and block him out as necessary but as I alluded to in my previous post there is no barrier to who can sign up and how many accounts they could create and this, ironically, is a weakness related to the limited & anonymous nature of the TOR system. And this is before you even think of becoming serious.....
Security through obscurity (assuming LEO can't read your posts) is very poor.
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I can say WITHOUT a doubt that LE (from various if not most countries) are archiving the forums on a constant basis. Considering how little effort would be involved (as another poster said they would simply use a page scraper) there really is no reason to think otherwise. Never, ever say something on the forums that you wouldn't want your worst enemy to know about.
Is that just because of how technically easy it would be to do, or do you have some solid source of information? Because, I can also tell you that such activity would be easily detectable and stopped by a competent sysadmin, which I hope and would think SR is employing with all the buku dollars they're supposed to be raking in. And, just because something is ridiculously easy in technical terms, don't automatically assume LE is doing it. They've got some very capable contractors, I'm sure. But your standard LE operations are drawing from the same HR pools as the rest of us, and incompetence abounds.
EDIT:
I might also add, SR may have become politically significant because we're a bold publicly accessible slap in the face against a tyrannical system of control, but operationally we're a teensy weensy drop in the bucket of illegal drug smuggling and distribution. And nobody's getting killed, tortured, enslaved and raped over the dope getting moved here. (They should BE so lucky if all drug activity were to go online, lol). Trust me, infinitely more resources are allocated elsewhere. We are not as important as we might like to believe, lol.
good luck to stop scraping on a hidden service, maybe you could detect it if they scrape like idiots but even that would be difficult to do. I would be surprised if hell if LE don't scrape this entire site and have at least a small team of intelligence analysts reading every single post.
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Tell them this, they likely just won't know how to respond:
"We are studying the evolution of lipid raft transient structure formation during active transport processes. In particular we are interested in how nascent and bound β-cyclodextrin alter the formation of these complexes as β-cyclodextrin's are some of the most promising candidate for pharmacological delivery methods. We believe compounds in this class are particularly interesting for new methods of transporting drugs across the BBB due to its affinity for forming complexes with a wide range of chemical moieties and we chose a phenethylamine as it's target because they are known not to disrupt the structure of β-cyclodextrin and are easily quantifiable."
Before they have a chance to even respond tell them that by opening the package you can no longer use them for your research, which has eaten deeply into your grant, not to mention 'we've' lost over 2 weeks of work (talk about molecular biology if you want) due to the delay and that you'd like to know how they obtained a warrant to open your package.
That or you can tell them you just wanted to make your own home-made febreze whilst testing the limits of the human psyche :)
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Really doesn't matter what she tells them she just posted on SR exactly what she had intercepted and from where and via which shipping service, chances of customs not knowing that that shipment belongs to foxy from SR are pretty much zero at this point.
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Tell them this, they likely just won't know how to respond:
"We are studying the evolution of lipid raft transient structure formation during active transport processes. In particular we are interested in how nascent and bound β-cyclodextrin alter the formation of these complexes as β-cyclodextrin's are some of the most promising candidate for pharmacological delivery methods. We believe compounds in this class are particularly interesting for new methods of transporting drugs across the BBB due to its affinity for forming complexes with a wide range of chemical moieties and we chose a phenethylamine as it's target because they are known not to disrupt the structure of β-cyclodextrin and are easily quantifiable."
Before they have a chance to even respond tell them that by opening the package you can no longer use them for your research, which has eaten deeply into your grant, not to mention 'we've' lost over 2 weeks of work (talk about molecular biology if you want) due to the delay and that you'd like to know how they obtained a warrant to open your package.
That or you can tell them you just wanted to make your own home-made febreze whilst testing the limits of the human psyche :)
lol..good shtuff!!! ;)
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Meh talked to FedEx, they said it hasn't been detained and they don't need any information. Customs is just backed up and they haven't examined it they said. I don't know how to take that, but there is nothing I can do because I tried calling customs directly and they said that only FedEx can contact them and that customers cannot contact customs directly.
Customs doesn't need a warrant LOL, they can open any package they want.
Whatever, I already have another 5g of 25C coming via EMS.
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Really doesn't matter what she tells them she just posted on SR exactly what she had intercepted and from where and via which shipping service, chances of customs not knowing that that shipment belongs to foxy from SR are pretty much zero at this point.
I'm hoping they don't care enough to bother..... stay safe sister.
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Meh talked to FedEx, they said it hasn't been detained and they don't need any information. Customs is just backed up and they haven't examined it they said. I don't know how to take that, but there is nothing I can do because I tried calling customs directly and they said that only FedEx can contact them and that customers cannot contact customs directly.
Customs doesn't need a warrant LOL, they can open any package they want.
Whatever, I already have another 5g of 25C coming via EMS.
Why do you habitually say what you have coming via which shipping service and from where when you already revealed your identity to customs :/ .
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Meh talked to FedEx, they said it hasn't been detained and they don't need any information. Customs is just backed up and they haven't examined it they said. I don't know how to take that, but there is nothing I can do because I tried calling customs directly and they said that only FedEx can contact them and that customers cannot contact customs directly.
Customs doesn't need a warrant LOL, they can open any package they want.
Whatever, I already have another 5g of 25C coming via EMS.
Why do you habitually say what you have coming via which shipping service and from where when you already revealed your identity to customs :/ .
Because nobody cares man, that's why we've been ignoring your posts. They firstly have no connection to her, you can go back to conspiracy land, second she said she'd sit on this, and thirdly neither compounds are regulated. One of them in face is the main ingredient in air freshener's.
She's committed no criminal offense and has had no illegal goods shipped to her. If cops were to do anything the only leg they've got to stand on is the hopes they can scare you in an interrogation with lies (it's legal for cops to lie when questioning). Any smart human being would simply stay COMPLETELY silent during the entire police drama show, and they'll let you go because they had no reason to hold you in the first place (in fact you could just decline going for questioning, you possess legal compounds, no crime has been committed.
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a bit harsh no? we're all friends here and therefore work best as a team. although a healthy pararnoia is alwayz a good thing.... ;)
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1. She sells illegal drugs here
2. She had a package stopped by customs and announced it here, including the exact country of origin, exact contents, exact shipping service
3. Customs can now check their records for such an interception, and find her shipping address, with no problems (plus I doubt she called fedex from a burner phone)
why don't you just post your address here for customs it seems to me like you think they don't care so much that you could vend with your SSN as your pseudonym and never be busted. I really hope none of you get the wake up call that you seriously seem to be begging for, because it isn't going to be fun for you at all and despite being dumb as rocks you really don't deserve it.
btw bulk RC shipment stopped at customs is what got enelysion put under surveillance and eventually raided, he wasn't importing anything illegal either. You pretty much posted your shipping address by making this thread and you are known to sell illegal drugs. At least Enelysion didn't make a post saying omg my methylone was intercepted shipped from china via fedex, and then I called about it on this day!!! Your anonymity is gone unless it was sent to a box with a fake ID or similar situation with absolutely no link to you, and you used a burner phone with absolutely no link to you. If these things are not true, you might as well change your nym to the number of the phone you called from and put your address in your signature.
Take it for what it is worth I guess, i'm really just trying to look out for you and your customers, but the fact of the matter is if customs wants you they got you and it doesn't matter in the slightest that your order was of legal substances what matters is that you leaked your real identity by making this thread.
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there is no such thing as being too paranoid. imo. then again i'm hopelessly paranoid.
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Come on guys, let's not turn this into a mudslinging exercise!
We all appreciate Mr Kmfkewn's efforts to look for holes in our procedures/affairs, and we all want Miss Meow to prosper in her trade, so let's not have a "you're stupid", "no, you're the one who's stupid" argument here. It's totally pointless and we have enough opposition to contend with without turning on each other!
Just plan for every reasonable possibility and cover your tail, that is all.
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Kmfkewm's just telling foxymeow to stop telling on herself. Something tells me his comments would be quaint in comparison to foxy getting booked for distribution.
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Loose LIPS sink SHIPS is how it goes I believe.
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I still think the fact that it's legal tends to negate a lot of the paranoia going on here, I agree with most of what people are saying but this is not a red flag to customs, once they can tick a box saying it's not illegal they go home and forget about it.
It is legal to rent a hotel room but if some meth vendor makes a post about how he rented a room out at a specific hotel but the lady at the desk told him he couldn't have a pet stay with him, he shouldn't be surprised if a narcotics officer asks the lady at the counter at the hotel about the man who tried to bring an animal with him. Shitty example, but meh. Measuring things as discrete actions, and thinking they are not risks to your freedom if they are not illegal, is a naive as hell viewpoint to hold. It isn't illegal to post your full name and address here, so why don't you do it , not like you can be arrested FOR it ....course you could get arrested FROM it
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Edited out details thanks.
I hate fedex, so fucking much. Makes me want to rip my hair out.
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If you think someone has compromised themselves by posting too much info why not just PM them? By posting (and repeating key details) publicly you are propagating the info you feel is sensitive in the first place. Miss Meow cleaned up her post but they details have been copied in reply quotes a few times in this thread. I get the point about too much info but that's where a PM comes into play. Now if your post has some of these details in it please consider editing that as well.
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If you think someone has compromised themselves by posting too much info why not just PM them? By posting (and repeating key details) publicly you are propagating the info you feel is sensitive in the first place. Miss Meow cleaned up her post but they details have been copied in reply quotes a few times in this thread. I get the point about too much info but that's where a PM comes into play. Now if your post has some of these details in it please consider editing that as well.
Yeah seriously, I have pmed people and many people have done the same. Sometimes I wonder why so many people have a complete inability to talk about things in private. Heck, I got slandered just because a guy wasn't able to talk to me before going on the forums. Whatever, honestly worst comes to worst they will take it an trash it. Its money lost but thats the gamble you pay. Whenever someone asks me why I can't sell for lower margins I point out all the times that I have lost thousands of dollars getting ripped off, the work I put into making everything legit (just had to do a fictous name registration and put the required ad in the paper for it just to put a mailbox under a business name), and the stress i have to go through.
Its cool, the 4-ACO-DMT smarties were quite popular BTW so I have made some of my money back.
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In the forums today I came across a link to Eleusis's memoirs and I like to revisit these histories just to remember lessons learned....
I've been looking for that, can you send it/post it? Thanks.
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Even if you go through EMS, it all still goes through customs, right? Why would EMS be any less hassle than UPS or Fedex?
They have to label the chemicals anyway, right?
I mean, it's not like you could get the chinese to intentionally mislabel it, could you? :)
Can they actually get watched chemicals through? Cuz, that'd blow my mind.
There are people in China and surrounding areas that will ship you drums of safrole or MDP2P labeled as something innocent.
prooooooove it