Silk Road forums
Discussion => Shipping => Topic started by: aletsopmoc on February 10, 2012, 11:03 pm
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I have read up on the forums/wiki and have not really found any information about the sizes of PO boxes.
Firstly, I would rather not ship it to my home address as my mail is frequently intercepted by my flatmates. I couldn't find any information specifically saying that PO boxes are bad (if they are bad oh god someone please tell me) but I also couldnt find any information on what a "minimum" size for a PO box should be.
The small ones fit like 10 letter envelopes, or rolled up magazines. The medium is large enough to fit unrolled magazines and this is probably what I would get. Will this be enough? It seems that most of the products I am interested in wouldn't require a box.
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Some people will recommend not using a PO Box, but I disagree, use one. If the package is too big to fit in the box, they put the package in a storage locker or store it away in some sort of special room, and leave a little slip in your box notifying you have a package. You take the slip out, and then give it to the postal worker, and they'll retrieve your package, and please note that you WILL NOT have to sign for it. Never sign for a package (never).
As far as the box size, I'd use the biggest one available for the sake of simplicity.
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PO Box Bad
In synopsis:
1. ID required. If they have your real identity, why not just ship to your own house in the first place.
2. Fake ID means if post is intercepted, you also have to face mail fraud charges as well.
3. There are more anonymous ways to get a mail holding service, like a virtual office or private mailbox or pigeon hole system.
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1. ID required. If they have your real identity, why not just ship to your own house in the first place.
2. Fake ID means if post is intercepted, you also have to face mail fraud charges as well.
3. There are more anonymous ways to get a mail holding service, like a virtual office or private mailbox or pigeon hole system.
OK, here's my rebuttal.
1. A police officer can put on a postal worker's outfit, knock on your door, and ask you to sign for a package. If you have a P.O Box, and an undercover officer knocks on your PO Box, the best response he'll get is from the residential Post Office mouse.
2. You don't have to use a fake ID, just use your real one. The OP said the reason he doesn't want to ship to his house is because his dumbass roommates will fuck with his packages.
3. Many areas don't private mailboxes or anything like that, especially in rural areas. I just went to google and looked up the nearest location of the closest private mailbox to me, and the nearest is 234 miles away.
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1. ID required. If they have your real identity, why not just ship to your own house in the first place.
2. Fake ID means if post is intercepted, you also have to face mail fraud charges as well.
3. There are more anonymous ways to get a mail holding service, like a virtual office or private mailbox or pigeon hole system.
OK, here's my rebuttal.
1. A police officer can put on a postal worker's outfit, knock on your door, and ask you to sign for a package. If you have a P.O Box, and an undercover officer knocks on your PO Box, the best response he'll get is from the residential Post Office mouse.
2. You don't have to use a fake ID, just use your real one. The OP said the reason he doesn't want to ship to his house is because his dumbass roommates will fuck with his packages.
3. Many areas don't private mailboxes or anything like that, especially in rural areas. I just went to google and looked up the nearest location of the closest private mailbox to me, and the nearest is 234 miles away.
Re 1: I assure you, that if a controlled delivery is going to occur, then it's going to happen whether or not it's at your P.O Box or your mailbox. It's not a DEA entry team you need to worry about, it's those tenacious Postal Inspectors, they are not 'mere mouse', they are good at their job like bulldogs who refuse to let go. They've been known to stalk their own employees for weeks on end, when having received a tip-off about some misbehavior like theft or bag disposal.
Re 2: That's fine, my synopsis was a generalization, not a prescription. I suggest he get better housemates though.
Re 3: Yes, that sucks. You have to work with what you've got in many cases. A larger town or city is certainly a distinct advantage in many ways with respect to being anonymous in person and on TOR.
However, I would say that's no reason to give up on your security. You just got to think outside the box a bit more. One of our Australian friends posted an interesting photo recently. Think 'holiday homes', think 'apartment block pigeon holes', think rural postal collection boxes at the end of each tract of land, often huddled together in one location in a row for the post man. Otherwise, think of having a delayed reaction service. You order to a address such as a virtual office far away, and pickup once a month on your regular trip to the city etc. Slow, but safe and you have to plan in advance a whole lot more.
If all else fails, setup your own virtual office company for a couple of bucks... Not worth doing for a buyer, but an interesting proposition for a vendor.
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I didn't have time to read through all your posts Pine, but I wondered if you thought it was a good idea to have a p.o. box registered in a business name (legit of course) just as a secondary place to ship to. I already use my real name\address but wouldn't mind a second place to get things through more frequently.
I believe it's a good idea to have a virtual office mail holding service registered to a business name, yes.
There is no ID required, virtual offices are like weeds, they are everywhere, whereas P.O boxes are under the wing of a federal institution with a central database.
It really depends on what you're doing. If you're getting some weed occasionally, hell, use your own address and name, it's fine.
If however you are in business, you want superior anonymity due to the volume you're getting of goods, whether legal or illegal.
Also, virtual offices make it easy to setup lots and lots of mail holding geographical locations for different purposes. Private mailboxes do the same thing.
If you fall in between, you have middling volume of e.g. weed, that you maybe distribute to friends etc, then I think the business P.O Box is ok, but I still prefer a virtual office.
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Late response but I'd have to agree with Pine.
I don't believe any vendor will send a package with signature confirmation knowing what that may entail.
There's no reason someone couldn't camp out by the P.O. until you pick up the package either and get you then.
At least with delivery to your door, if you're asked for a signature then that should set off some alarms and you just say you didn't order anything like that and don't sign.
I also believe the business P.O. that you speak of has been mentioned before and they feel it's a good idea. Off the shelf business mailbox or some such.
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I have read up on the forums/wiki and have not really found any information about the sizes of PO boxes.
Firstly, I would rather not ship it to my home address as my mail is frequently intercepted by my flatmates. I couldn't find any information specifically saying that PO boxes are bad (if they are bad oh god someone please tell me) but I also couldnt find any information on what a "minimum" size for a PO box should be.
The small ones fit like 10 letter envelopes, or rolled up magazines. The medium is large enough to fit unrolled magazines and this is probably what I would get. Will this be enough? It seems that most of the products I am interested in wouldn't require a box.
Get a P.O box big enough to fit a C5 envelope. Why can't you just go to USPS.com and find out the measurements of all of there flat rates?
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I use their medium size box, and have had over 20 packages delivered no problem. I order mainly powders/pills and up to 10 grams and around 50-80 pills at a time. Just to keep my po box interesting, I have a few magazine subscriptions and random junk mail that goes there also. I just didn't want anyone to notice that the only packages/letters i get are from overseas lol.
So to answer your questions, yes IMO PO boxes are fine to use. And yes, the medium size is a good size as most packages, even "bulk" are almost always compressed down and fit in an envelope/medium bubble mailer.
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It's kind of funny that this is a constant question (and point of controversy) that arises in the shipping forum.
I'm a PO BOX supporter but there are as many PO BOX haters.
All the reasons for and against have been posted in one form or another in previous messages so it seems a little pointless in repeating these points ad nauseam.
But in relation to the question asked by the OP I would (and will) get the biggest PO BOX available when it becomes time to move on and get a new box.
Not only does this cover you when small parcels arrive that are just a little too big to fit into the 'personal' size boxes, it also allows you to let the mail pile up for a little longer than normal.
At my PO they don't seem to care too much and are quite happy to cram more and more crap in my little box than should be allowed. If I had the largest box this wouldn't be such an issue.
I notice that many Americans automatically assume that things work the same way everywhere around the world but unfortunately (or fortunately) this is not how it is.
Down here in Oz we don't have private mailbox companies (at least not in places outside of the capital cities but even then I'm not sure) so we use Australia Post (our national carrier) or we don't.
There is a price difference of course, but if you are planning on receiving large-ish amounts of mail (from SR or elsewhere) then it makes sense to pay the extra and get the biggest box you can afford. But, in reality, this is not the point where things will go wrong. It will be further up the chain (like customs, etc.) where things will be discovered. The local PO employees aren't paid enough to give a shit about what's in your packages. They just cram 'em in the box and that's it.
In my opinion, it makes absolutely no difference if you get drugs sent to your box or to your home. They know who you are and the same 'excuses' can be used for either. You may be able to get away with it the first time but how often can you say "I didn't order these drugs officer, someone keeps sending them anonymously".
There is one practice that I have seen mentioned many times and that is to keep packages which may have fake names for a few days before opening. This is absolutely CRAZY in my opinion. Why on earth would you want to keep packages containing drugs in your house?? Just tell them you put 'return to sender' and destroy the bloody thing (after extracting its contents of course). There is no way they can prove you didn't put 'return to sender' but they can sure as charge you with possession if they find the contents sitting on your hallway table (or at least it will cause you to be under more suspicion).
While contrary to what is said in the SR FAQ's the absolute best option is to have a drop house that is in no way associated with you where you can safely and reliably get mail sent and be able to pick it up without talking to anyone, seeing anyone, or have anyone see you. The problem here is that it is hard to find these 'perfect' drop houses. If it is a rental you are always at the mercy of a new tenant moving in. If it is a house that has been for sale for awhile, someone may buy the damn thing.
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PO Boxes are pretty much the cheapest, easiest way to receive mail away from your place of residence, if you have someone you need to hide it from, or if you don't trust your local mail carrier (they can be really nosy because they deliver the same routes every day, and get a good feel for your mail habits).
A PO box lets you control when you get your mail. The workers who put mail in the boxes put lots of mail in lots of boxes every day. They aren't paying attention to how much/how little one specific box gets.
Some people also recommend a PMB instead of a PO box because they supposedly have more lax requirements, but in my area the ID requirements are exactly the same. A photo ID and a utility bill/lease/etc. In my opinion PMB companies like the UPS store are more likely to report suspicious packages, but that's not really based on any concrete evidence.
Also think about how many reasons people have for wanting to get a PO box to receive mail. Maybe they like to order sex toys they don't want their significant other to know about. Maybe they like to buy computer parts on ebay, but they're afraid of packages being stolen from their mailbox or their porch. Maybe their mail carrier weirds them out and they don't want them snooping around in their mail. Maybe they belong to a hobbyist forum where people trade various things back and forth, but they don't want to give out their real address. Some people say it looks suspicious to get a bunch of priority mail packages delivered to a PO box, which I don't understand - that's what PO boxes are for!
If you're just a small time buyer, a PO box doesn't seem any less safe than your home address. If you're a vendor or buying serious quantity, you better be smart enough to figure out an alternative to either one.
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Another way to get a PO Box, is find a student, homeless person, illegal with sufficient ID and that looks presentable and pay $50 or $100 to open for you.
You can even pay them to pick up, but they aren't the most honest people and will turn on you, and doing it this way you look bad already.
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A good "patsy" is hard to find because the obvious concern is that they will go see the girls in blue right after they are done "helping" you in the hope of getting another $50 or $100 for snitching.
Does anyone know if the USPS clerk makes a copy of your license(s) when you open a PO box?