Silk Road forums
Discussion => Security => Topic started by: TMan99 on July 31, 2013, 09:10 pm
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Is there a way you can use someone elses wifi instead of your own? This way if something were to go wrong they would have their IP address, and not yours.
I live in the woods about 5 miles away from any stores, but the area im in is populated and there are a lot of other houses around me. When I start up though I only get my wifi as the other houses are a few hundred feet away...
Is there a device that picks up wifi signals within long distances and I could connect to these, use a bridge so it shows up as a VPN to the ISP and so susspicion won't be brought.
But, is there a way they can trace me back to my real in home location so it would not make a diffrence (I am using tails so I don't believe I have a mac address or something alike)
This seems like it could be pretty safe and I would rotate between a few homes wifi to use.
Yes I am paranoid, but I am taking it slow instead of jumping right in. I want to make sure I am as safe as I can be.
Thanks all
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It's better to be safe then sorry, a few hundred/thousand bucks is worth your safety. Peace of mind is also a nice thing to have.
Anyway i'm not the best person to answer this and i'm sure someone with more expertise can give a more precise answer. I know there are antennas that you can buy that extend the range of your laptops wifi. SR also has custom pcs setup that can included these, along with many other security features. They come with a lot of options although they are rather expensive,(1000-2500) it's a smart option though if money isn't a problem and you aren't that experienced with computers.
Otherwise do a little research on antennas that extend the range of your wifi. Newegg has a large selection of them.
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Thanks for the reply
It does seem like a good option on the outside, because if shit hits the fan they will not be able to tell who you are, ussually.
Hopefully can fill me in on this.
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You can get a high gain WiFi antenna and an amplifier. A $100 amplifier + a $100 directional antenna should greatly increase your wireless range versus a stock WiFi solution. On the other hand WiFi is not a magic bullet, live WiFi sessions can be traced and the police have many times in the past traced people who tried to get all of their anonymity by using neighbors WiFi. It is definitely better imo to do this than to use your own internet, but especially if you don't move around much, the anonymity benefit of doing this is fairly minimal. For best results you would use new WiFi hotspot from new location every time you connect, people doing that by itself can manage to be untraceable indefinitely if they go about it right. So the answer to your question is yes you can use WiFi from significant distances away, but it partially depends on the strength of the WiFi access point you are using as well, however high end WiFi equipment is more sensitive to signals as well so it can pick up fainter signals from greater distance, and of course if you have an amplifier and a high end antenna you can send WiFi signals for many miles depending on environmental variables as well though (dozens or even hundreds of miles are possible with direct line of sight, add some trees in the way and the distance is much less though). I think it is reasonable to think that you can in practice increase your transmit distance by about five or six times a stock solution, and your receive sensitivity can be significantly increased as well.
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You can get a high gain WiFi antenna and an amplifier. A $100 amplifier + a $100 directional antenna should greatly increase your wireless range versus a stock WiFi solution. On the other hand WiFi is not a magic bullet, live WiFi sessions can be traced and the police have many times in the past traced people who tried to get all of their anonymity by using neighbors WiFi. It is definitely better imo to do this than to use your own internet, but especially if you don't move around much, the anonymity benefit of doing this is fairly minimal. For best results you would use new WiFi hotspot from new location every time you connect, people doing that by itself can manage to be untraceable indefinitely if they go about it right. So the answer to your question is yes you can use WiFi from significant distances away, but it partially depends on the strength of the WiFi access point you are using as well, however high end WiFi equipment is more sensitive to signals as well so it can pick up fainter signals from greater distance, and of course if you have an amplifier and a high end antenna you can send WiFi signals for many miles depending on environmental variables as well though (dozens or even hundreds of miles are possible with direct line of sight, add some trees in the way and the distance is much less though). I think it is reasonable to think that you can in practice increase your transmit distance by about five or six times a stock solution, and your receive sensitivity can be significantly increased as well.
Interesting.
How are the LE able to trace the connection if someone is using TOR? Or is it just that they are able to trace someone who is using regular clearnet with no TOR (seems like this would be possible, but am unsure how they would be able to figure out someone using TOR)
The area I live in does have many trees, but it is densley populated. If I could get the setup of the antenna and amlafier to connect to wifi from a few miles away I would have a lot of choices to rotate through, rotating and not revisiting the same wifi for months.
It seems like everyone had passwords on their wifi now a days though, I know 5 or 6 years ago very few had the password lock. Would these passwords be easy to crack? without the ISP knowing I am cracking them.
Also, can you see who has connected to your wifi? I remember logging into my router a few years back and seeing something like that..
It seems like a much better option then using your own internet everytime you connect.
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You can get a high gain WiFi antenna and an amplifier. A $100 amplifier + a $100 directional antenna should greatly increase your wireless range versus a stock WiFi solution. On the other hand WiFi is not a magic bullet, live WiFi sessions can be traced and the police have many times in the past traced people who tried to get all of their anonymity by using neighbors WiFi. It is definitely better imo to do this than to use your own internet, but especially if you don't move around much, the anonymity benefit of doing this is fairly minimal. For best results you would use new WiFi hotspot from new location every time you connect, people doing that by itself can manage to be untraceable indefinitely if they go about it right. So the answer to your question is yes you can use WiFi from significant distances away, but it partially depends on the strength of the WiFi access point you are using as well, however high end WiFi equipment is more sensitive to signals as well so it can pick up fainter signals from greater distance, and of course if you have an amplifier and a high end antenna you can send WiFi signals for many miles depending on environmental variables as well though (dozens or even hundreds of miles are possible with direct line of sight, add some trees in the way and the distance is much less though). I think it is reasonable to think that you can in practice increase your transmit distance by about five or six times a stock solution, and your receive sensitivity can be significantly increased as well.
Interesting.
How are the LE able to trace the connection if someone is using TOR? Or is it just that they are able to trace someone who is using regular clearnet with no TOR (seems like this would be possible, but am unsure how they would be able to figure out someone using TOR)
The area I live in does have many trees, but it is densley populated. If I could get the setup of the antenna and amlafier to connect to wifi from a few miles away I would have a lot of choices to rotate through, rotating and not revisiting the same wifi for months.
It seems like everyone had passwords on their wifi now a days though, I know 5 or 6 years ago very few had the password lock. Would these passwords be easy to crack? without the ISP knowing I am cracking them.
Also, can you see who has connected to your wifi? I remember logging into my router a few years back and seeing something like that..
It seems like a much better option then using your own internet everytime you connect.
It would be possible for law enforcement to detect your location because of the wifi device you are using to connect with w/e access point you choose. Your wifi device transmits and receives signals. I'm not sure exactly how it's done but while you are connected these signals could be used to zero in on your location. If you are using your laptop at home and connecting to these routers they could possibly find you. They would first have to locate the routers using tor and then go from there. It would probably be unlikely that this would be used against you unless you are a high value target/big vendor.
You never know what they might start using as this site gets bigger though...
Edit: if you change the transmit power of your wifi adapter and want to be safe; make sure to set it below the legal limit of transmit power. I believe you can set it above the legal limit easily and this might cause suspision. peace.
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Well, if they are able to pinpoint where the laptop is that is connecting to the router that could be even worse. Would this just be during the connection? Or would they be able to figure out the exact loacation of where it came from even after I have been disconenected for days.
I guess this would not matter if you are always on the move and checking SR from different locations all the time, but that is not an option for me buisness wise..
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Well, if they are able to pinpoint where the laptop is that is connecting to the router that could be even worse. Would this just be during the connection? Or would they be able to figure out the exact loacation of where it came from even after I have been disconenected for days.
I guess this would not matter if you are always on the move and checking SR from different locations all the time, but that is not an option for me buisness wise..
I can only see someone being discovered by this method if they were actually physically near your location while you are conneced since they would need a way to read the signals being emmited by your wifi adapter. I guess something might be able to be installed locally at the access point. This is beyond my level of knowledge although I could see it entirely being possible. Paranoia to win this war!
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**Clearnet Links**
Try the DIY wifi antenna
http://revision3.com/systm/surfer
http://wireless.gumph.org/articles/homemadeomni.html
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=122779
**Clearnet Links**
Hope this has helped ya 8)
Peace & Hugs,
ChemCat
O0
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Using a long-distance connection to a neighboring WiFi network is a good idea, but there's a few things you should keep in mind.
- Just like your internet connection, your neighbors internet is also logged/recorded in some NSA database.
- While you're trying to remain anonymous online, don't use any services which could identify you in any way. No e-mail, Facebook, IM, etc.. Even though you're connected through an encrypted channel, there's no reason to allow any form of profiling by exit nodes.
- Your neighbors router could (probably does) maintain a short-lived log of connecting MAC addresses. A MAC address is a unique hardware identifier. You should randomize your MAC address every time you connect to the foreign AP. Some privacy-based distros of linux will automatically do this for you on bootup.
- It would be a good idea to have a visual line of site with the connection to some extent. Why? Let's say there's an investigation in your neighborhood and your neighbors ISP willingly gives logs to LE. The LE fabricates enough evidence (starting with suspicious Tor traffic) to perform a raid. You'll want to know when this happens! Here's why..
Anyone (including LE) can use a simple handheld spectrum analyzer (see WiSpy) to lock onto an RF signal. They can aim their antennas around to find where the strongest transmission signal is coming from. If you have a a good visual on where you believe your internet is coming from, you can disconnect your wireless NIC.
A matter of fact, you don't even need a spectrum analyzer. Somebody could easily locate a WiFi signal source using a directional antenna fitted with a WiFi adapter. Keep your anonymous internet connections short and to the point!
Hope this info helps.
psil0
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Using a long-distance connection to a neighboring WiFi network is a good idea, but there's a few things you should keep in mind.
- Just like your internet connection, your neighbors internet is also logged/recorded in some NSA database.
- While you're trying to remain anonymous online, don't use any services which could identify you in any way. No e-mail, Facebook, IM, etc.. Even though you're connected through an encrypted channel, there's no reason to allow any form of profiling by exit nodes.
- Your neighbors router could (probably does) maintain a short-lived log of connecting MAC addresses. A MAC address is a unique hardware identifier. You should randomize your MAC address every time you connect to the foreign AP. Some privacy-based distros of linux will automatically do this for you on bootup.
- It would be a good idea to have a visual line of site with the connection to some extent. Why? Let's say there's an investigation in your neighborhood and your neighbors ISP willingly gives logs to LE. The LE fabricates enough evidence (starting with suspicious Tor traffic) to perform a raid. You'll want to know when this happens! Here's why..
Anyone (including LE) can use a simple handheld spectrum analyzer (see WiSpy) to lock onto an RF signal. They can aim their antennas around to find where the strongest transmission signal is coming from. If you have a a good visual on where you believe your internet is coming from, you can disconnect your wireless NIC.
A matter of fact, you don't even need a spectrum analyzer. Somebody could easily locate a WiFi signal source using a directional antenna fitted with a WiFi adapter. Keep your anonymous internet connections short and to the point!
Hope this info helps.
psil0
Nice reply.
I would be using bridges so it would not come up as TOR on the persons router. Just as someone using a VPN. Also, while using TAILS does your real macadress get saved to the router?
If they somehow figure out I have a wifi connection ranging a mile would they trace it to where I am connecting to, ask those people if they know who is connecting, then trace it back to my house. May seem far fetched, but you don't know what goes on around here and this would be one of the most interesting thing for them in years.
I also could just route it across the street but because my ISP has probably already shared I use TOR with the locals if something were to go wrong they would know who it is...
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Usually people leave their router password at a default setting and you can take full remote control of the wireless router. I have done this in the past to erase MAC address logs. Hell some routers you can even completely root remotely, it is very very rare for people to have a password on their router and if they do it is almost always the default for the model.
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I would be using bridges so it would not come up as TOR on the persons router. Just as someone using a VPN. Also, while using TAILS does your real macadress get saved to the router?
I use a different Linux distro, but I know Tails has features enable you to randomize your MAC address on startup. If your MAC address is spoofed, it (your real MAC address) will not be recorded on the router. Use a random one every time you boot up. Check out the Tails documentation and forums.
If they somehow figure out I have a wifi connection ranging a mile would they trace it to where I am connecting to, ask those people if they know who is connecting, then trace it back to my house. May seem far fetched, but you don't know what goes on around here and this would be one of the most interesting thing for them in years.
Highly unlikely but possible. If you're bridging through multiple routers/switches, every router needs to know your MAC address (spoofed) to direct traffic from the first router to the last router in sequence. Again, a directional antenna could lock onto the MAC address and pinpoint where the rogue RF transmissions are coming from.
Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong. Again -- highly unlikely if you're that far away.
I also could just route it across the street but because my ISP has probably already shared I use TOR with the locals if something were to go wrong they would know who it is...
I doubt they've shared information with locals regarding your internet usage unless they've been faced with a court order to hand it over.
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Usually people leave their router password at a default setting and you can take full remote control of the wireless router. I have done this in the past to erase MAC address logs. Hell some routers you can even completely root remotely, it is very very rare for people to have a password on their router and if they do it is almost always the default for the model.
But, by default is your mac address spoofed while using tails? Or will you have to log into the router and delete it?
Also, do you know anything about LE intercepting the signal and tracing it back to you?
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If LE trace up to an access point that you are no longer using, and it has only your spoofed MAC address, the trace is essentially dead. They will never directly tie that connection to you, in the vast majority of cases. The problem is that if the police have traced up to your neighbors house, it is very simple for them to set up shop with spectrum analyzers. While you are connected to a hotspot you send and receive signals. Receive is fine and cannot be traced, send is where the problem is. Something that is sending a WiFi signal can be pinpointed very quickly with the right equipment. When the thing stops transmitting a signal, the trace can no longer continue. So if you use a random persons internet from a park that you go to one time with a spoofed mac address, and you leave before the cops come, not even the NSA is likely going to be able to determine that *you* are the one who used the access point at the time it comes into question. If you set up shop in the park for months on end, or get in any sort of pattern, that is where the attacks come from. If you always use your neighbors internet for illegal shit, yeah the trace will first go to your neigbhor but it will only be a short amount of time before it goes to you from there. Another thing is that even if the trace is at a technical dead end, there are other things to take into consideration. Perhaps the trace goes to a hotel, from that point on it is dead, it could have been anyone at the hotel at that time. Okay, but then you have this same thing happen to five different hotels, and now the FBI does an intersection attack of the people registered at the hotels at that time and your name pops out. they didn't technically trace you but they did trace up to the hotel that you were at multiple times, and saw you are by far the most likely suspect (I guess you should have registered the room with a new fake ID each time, preferably not from celtic !).
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I forgot to mention though that there are very advanced attacks that can fingerprint wireless cards regardless of their MAC address. It is totally possible to uniquely identify WiFi cards if you can get a live sample from them, in some cases maybe even router logs are enough I dunno. Anyway, it is in the realm of possibility for the NSA to have much of the USA covered in spectrum analyzers that could perhaps even fingerprint your wireless card regardless of its MAC address. This is definitely in the realm of possibility, but it is also definitely in the realm of the NSA (ie: not the FBI).
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If I use a different neighbors router each time, would they be able to trace me from a spectrum analyzer?
For example: I connect to house A which is 1.5 miles away. The LE set up there. I then connect to house B which is 1.75 miles away in the same direction.
Would they be able to grab that signal and trace it back to me, and if they did that, they would have to be monitoring my end node also to see what I am doing
But, the only way they would set up one of thse analyzers is if they get the go ahead from the NSA to find out who is using whichever wifi.
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This sounds like overkill to me, quite honestly.
I know Liberte Linux automatically spoofs your MAC, which would then allow you to use an amplifier, which can easily be purchased at radio shack or the like.
However, have you thought of getting a proxy? The Snowden backlash has driven up the demand for proxies, so a lot of legitimate (i.e. people not using Tor that LE generally doesn't care bout) people are using it. This makes it much less suspect.
A proxy may even be safer if you use an off-shore location.
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This sounds like overkill to me, quite honestly.
I know Liberte Linux automatically spoofs your MAC, which would then allow you to use an amplifier, which can easily be purchased at radio shack or the like.
However, have you thought of getting a proxy? The Snowden backlash has driven up the demand for proxies, so a lot of legitimate (i.e. people not using Tor that LE generally doesn't care bout) people are using it. This makes it much less suspect.
A proxy may even be safer if you use an off-shore location.
I have not looked into getting a proxy...
Would something like adding a sock5 proxy to TOR on Tails help me out? Then should I throw some bridges in there also?
Would this be a better option then grabbing others wifi?
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If I use a different neighbors router each time, would they be able to trace me from a spectrum analyzer?
For example: I connect to house A which is 1.5 miles away. The LE set up there. I then connect to house B which is 1.75 miles away in the same direction.
Would they be able to grab that signal and trace it back to me, and if they did that, they would have to be monitoring my end node also to see what I am doing
But, the only way they would set up one of thse analyzers is if they get the go ahead from the NSA to find out who is using whichever wifi.
I suggest you read about the carder iceman I think his name was. He liked using WiFi from hotels and such as one of his primary sources of anonymity. By the time the police were narrowing in on him, they saw that the IP addresses used by him all came from the same neighborhood. He was at this point hopping between wireless access points, from his house. The police simply went to that neighborhood with spectrum analyzers and they were able to pinpoint him and kick his door in etc. So hoping between different neighbors wireless is not going to save the day if the police are after you. To get the most from WiFi anonymity you need to always be using a different hotspot, but then there are attacks like okay let's pull all the data from the license plate cameras and see if any of these connections we traced back to hotspots correlate with a specific car in the area, or let's pull the list of all people registered at these hotels and intersect them. So even when it used properly, over time WiFi based anonymity can fail you. A single session traced to a single hotel, they are not going to have luck. Multiple sessions to multiple hotels? Okay they might have luck. You would think that being anonymous rather than pseudonymous would help, and in some cases it might, but there is still pattern left to analyze. Okay we traced some suspect to this hotel in this area doing something like downloading CP for ease of example. Okay this happened again in the same area, let's do intersection attack and see if there is anybody to be suspicious of. The technical trace fails but a suspect can still emerge from the crowd.
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This sounds like overkill to me, quite honestly.
I know Liberte Linux automatically spoofs your MAC, which would then allow you to use an amplifier, which can easily be purchased at radio shack or the like.
However, have you thought of getting a proxy? The Snowden backlash has driven up the demand for proxies, so a lot of legitimate (i.e. people not using Tor that LE generally doesn't care bout) people are using it. This makes it much less suspect.
A proxy may even be safer if you use an off-shore location.
I have not looked into getting a proxy...
Would something like adding a sock5 proxy to TOR on Tails help me out? Then should I throw some bridges in there also?
Would this be a better option then grabbing others wifi?
Yes, you can do that with Tails.
I'm not sure if it would be safer. In theory, if you could mask your MAC and use another's WIFI, you may be completely untraceable.
The proxy would hold just as much; however, your ISP would see you are connected to a proxy.
Your #1 concern from ordering on places like these is honestly the vendor's stelath. DEA knows this type of encryption is very hard to crack, so if they were to pursue you, it would most likely be due to intercepted mail.
For example, I was on BMR scouting cheaper prices, and found a guy that was indeed cheaper (no longer; his prices went up, so I see no use for him). The first order had a WRITTEN address with noticeable damage. The second had a WRITTEN address, and was damaged so badly that the box had opened.
On the other hand, I use a vednor here who has such deceptive stealth that I thought it was another package.
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if you know the direction of the wifi network you want to break into, then a yagi antenna works best. if you're not sure than an omni works best. the signal amplifier will increase your signal about +10 or maybe +20dbi, not much, but can be the difference of getting a dhcp lease and having connectivity or not.
maybe look into reaver pro if you're not already familiar with the tools.
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I have had good luck with reaver pro also.
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I have had good luck with reaver pro also.
nice never seen that!
You have probably already seen/used it but if people are interested in that, check out backtrack linux distro. It's a pen testing distro that has reaver installed. you can run from a usb/dvd. pretty cool.
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I don't see the reason for reaver pro
If the cops want you, they are just going to set up analyzers and trace you back. It is just going to make them go through another step. Seems like a waste to me.
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I don't see the reason for reaver pro
If the cops want you, they are just going to set up analyzers and trace you back. It is just going to make them go through another step. Seems like a waste to me.
Sometimes when searching for an AP i grab the lowest hanging fruit (open networks) but a lot of the time I am targeting a specific network and the attacks used by reaver are very helpful.
Wrenched we miss you. :D
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I don't see the reason for reaver pro
If the cops want you, they are just going to set up analyzers and trace you back. It is just going to make them go through another step. Seems like a waste to me.
Sometimes when searching for an AP i grab the lowest hanging fruit (open networks) but a lot of the time I am targeting a specific network and the attacks used by reaver are very helpful.
Wrenched we miss you. :D
But for constant use from the same spot it won't do anything to protect you..
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Using a Tor Bridge will show up as Tor usage to your ISP. To avoid that, use a VPN, and then connect to Tor as usual.
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Using a Tor Bridge will show up as Tor usage to your ISP. To avoid that, use a VPN, and then connect to Tor as usual.
I don't think that is true, the whole point of a bridges is to disguise your Tor usage as connecting to a VPN.
Also, I heard you can't use a VPN from Tails...
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posting so i can find this thread later. there is some good stuff in here. Thanks guys!
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I would be using bridges so it would not come up as TOR on the persons router. Just as someone using a VPN. Also, while using TAILS does your real macadress get saved to the router?
I use a different Linux distro, but I know Tails has features enable you to randomize your MAC address on startup. If your MAC address is spoofed, it (your real MAC address) will not be recorded on the router. Use a random one every time you boot up. Check out the Tails documentation and forums.
Here's how to do it for Linux Mint -- the method will probably work for any Debian-derived distro.
Manipulate your system's MAC address
I'm always a fan of collecting useful utilities, and I'm proud to say that macchanger is one of them. I've always appreciated the usefulness of this utility that I made it a point to install it when installing a new version of Ubuntu/LinuxMint on my lappy.
Some features that this utility offer are:
- Set a MAC of another vendor
- Set another MAC of the same vendor
- Set specific MAC address of a network interface
- Set the MAC randomly
To install the macchanger utility:
sudo apt-get install macchanger
Here's how I setup macchanger to automatically change my NIC's MAC address to a random MAC address.
Create a file named changemac on your /etc/init.d/ folder with:
gksudo gedit /etc/init.d/changemac
The content of the changemac file would be the text below colored BLUE (copy and paste it).
# Start of script file
#!/bin/bash
# Disable all the network devices
ifconfig eth0 down
ifconfig wlan0 down
# The value for wlan0 (eth1) would change depending on the driver you're using - Be it Broadcom's STA wireless driver or Broadcom's B43 wireless driver
# Spoof the current MAC addresses with a random MAC address
/usr/bin/macchanger -r eth0
/usr/bin/macchanger -r wlan0
# Re-enable all the network devices
ifconfig eth0 up
ifconfig wlan0 up
# End of script file
http://community.linuxmint.com/tutorial/view/376
Nightcrawler
4096R/BBF7433B 2012-09-22 Nightcrawler <Nightcrawler@SR>
PGP Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB8F1D88EBBF7433B (MIT clearnet keyserver)
PGP Key: https://keys.indymedia.org/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB8F1D88EBBF7433B (IndyMedia https: clearnet keyserver)
PGP Key: http://qtt2yl5jocgrk7nu.onion/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB8F1D88EBBF7433B (IndyMedia .onion keyserver)
PGP Key: http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=174.msg633090#msg633090 (Silk Road Forums PGP Key Link)
PGP Key Fingerprint = 83F8 CAF8 7B73 C3C7 8D07 B66B AFC8 CE71 D9AF D2F0
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I don't see the reason for reaver pro
If the cops want you, they are just going to set up analyzers and trace you back. It is just going to make them go through another step. Seems like a waste to me.
I completely disagree - there r tons of those routers still around and reaver pro is fast and dirty!
i dont need macchanger as my antenna comes with it. evenings downtown r best - we have buses here. hoody -
backpack - laptop with ssd hard drive or no hard drive at all.
it's a wonderful thing.
on the other hand backtrack works great if u have enough batteries.
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I suppose if you were to always be changing locations it would work. But for my buisness I need to be in my office whenever I go to work. If they were not able to just trace me back it would be helpful but the next time I connect they will easily trace me back.
The same would be for you if you are always in the same routine, taking the same bus route, etc. But if you randomize it and always go to different locations you could be in luck.
No one in my surburban area would be using devices like this, they would be using their own wifi. My signal would stick out like a sore thumb.
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Thought I was done posting for the night but I have unique input here because...I've actually done ALL the things being talked about here and learned ALOT - all of this was done as part of the classes for my major though.
I'd say this guy hits it on the head with the best accuracy (I didn't read the whole thread but....
He still has alot wrong though and I got to learn this the hard way - it's not as simple as getting a big ass antennae and amplifiying the fuck out of it in fact that's a bad idea in many cases and will actually hurt you connect. I'll explain after the quote.
<quote>
You can get a high gain WiFi antenna and an amplifier. A $100 amplifier + a $100 directional antenna should greatly increase your wireless range versus a stock WiFi solution. On the other hand WiFi is not a magic bullet, live WiFi sessions can be traced and the police have many times in the past traced people who tried to get all of their anonymity by using neighbors WiFi. It is definitely better imo to do this than to use your own internet, but especially if you don't move around much, the anonymity benefit of doing this is fairly minimal. For best results you would use new WiFi hotspot from new location every time you connect, people doing that by itself can manage to be untraceable indefinitely if they go about it right. So the answer to your question is yes you can use WiFi from significant distances away, but it partially depends on the strength of the WiFi access point you are using as well, however high end WiFi equipment is more sensitive to signals as well so it can pick up fainter signals from greater distance, and of course if you have an amplifier and a high end antenna you can send WiFi signals for many miles depending on environmental variables as well though (dozens or even hundreds of miles are possible with direct line of sight, add some trees in the way and the distance is much less though). I think it is reasonable to think that you can in practice increase your transmit distance by about five or six times a stock solution, and your receive sensitivity can be significantly increased as well. </quote>
So say you're in a neighborhood with like 5 networks you can see regularly. You hook up your big ass omni directional antennae adn amplify it. Now you see like 40. Woot, right? Nope. According to the science I learned - just imagine that by seeing so many more networks there's ALOT more disturbance in the signal you're trying to get cause wifi waves are bouncing around everywhere off everything and you're collecting it all with your super sensitive instruments - you'll see - bad performance.
Switch to a smaller antennae and things are much better again - you'll notice improved performance because you antennae isn't getting all that interference and distortions too.
The directinoal antennaes were A PAIN THE FUCKING ASS to use unless you like spending hours trying to tweak shit. Don't worry though, I'll explain how you should really do this. Directional antennaes are only going tobe useful if you're REALLY far away from a poin, there is nothing inbetween. Like you're in the middle of the desert. The problem with directional antennaes is alot of the waves bounce around especially in more city like areas...they'll parially and completely bounce off all sorts of materials in so many different ways. Because of this, the directional antennae is going to miss alot of the waves that came the direction of your target wifi network because some with hit it from behind and all these different angles. - this is why we liked omnidirectional more cause it catches eveything the network gives. There's alot less packet loss - which isif you employed some of the strategies here without my advice you'd be scratching your head over for way too long like we did.
Now, there is a way around this as we theoretically discussed in class but never tried.
You use special types of cables that split up where your connection is received from into many difference locations. Like split it up into one big antennae on one side of your house and another big antennae on the other - now they even get to take advatange of potentialy triangulating witheach other. We never actually tested this as I said so I don't know much about it, where to find it, or how to exactly set it up (besides trying to make the antenaaes as far away from either other as possible.
I would imagine dishes would perform similarly if you were to set up several different angles pointing at the same spot - but still miss alot of waves. so perhaps a good setup would be to use an omnidirectional with it.
And by the way, what I just said is most likely something you're not going to hear anywhere else on the internet. Consider it a secret - cause that is going to be what allows you to try connecting to someone's internet across the city......multiple antennaes for one connection.
Hopefully saving all you guys the time of doing and making themistakes we made will pay me back - becuase I actually have all the eequipment you're wanting and I"ve been trynig to sell it for a while now.
They'll be some pretty reasonable and discounted prices too.
I've got one or two 24gb gain directional antennas I believe. Got at least one. This is the highes tgain I could find.
Got a nice very powerful amplifier (I believe I bought the best and most powerful one available, which btw did not help out at all...although it may if you use multiple antennaes. Think of it as turning up the volumes when your antennnae is already picking up too many radio stations. Can you hear any of them any better then? No. That's essentialy what these amplifiers do.
I havve a 30 gb gain in line amplifier. It looks super cool too. I also have all the special chords you need to run one at a time and I have an extra realtek card wich 'm sure you're using.
I actually kind of want to hold on to the omnidirectional antennae on second thought but if you guys are internested in any of the other stuff (I can do like a satellite dish, realtek adapter, all the ridiulous chords you need, and the amplifier I paid $100 for) for a pretty sold deal - at least one that would 25-30 or more less thann what you'd pay anywhere else.
Keep in mind you're gonna want more than just the stuff I have if you're serious about it though.
For any inquires just PM me. I'm normally not a vendor. This isn't illegal equipment in any way though so I"m not too worried about the transaction plus I just want to get rid of some of the shit it takes up room.
Oh btw another alternative is to just ren the devices that make 4g hotspots with fake information and have them mailed to some random address (that's your part to figure out lol). The works well and is nice and consistent, although I believe most of htese come with a GPS coomponent though.
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Heh that thing about using multiple antennaes for one connection....you guy are SO FUCKING LUCKY I told you about it because we spent so much itme and stress in our project group until we were actually told thats the way thephysics of wifi communication work.
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I don't see the reason for reaver pro
If the cops want you, they are just going to set up analyzers and trace you back. It is just going to make them go through another step. Seems like a waste to me.
I completely disagree - there r tons of those routers still around and reaver pro is fast and dirty!
i dont need macchanger as my antenna comes with it. evenings downtown r best - we have buses here. hoody -
backpack - laptop with ssd hard drive or no hard drive at all.
it's a wonderful thing.
on the other hand backtrack works great if u have enough batteries.
Using WiFi from random locations is a lot more helpful than using it from your office. But in either case it is helpful imo.
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So say you're in a neighborhood with like 5 networks you can see regularly. You hook up your big ass omni directional antennae adn amplify it. Now you see like 40. Woot, right? Nope. According to the science I learned - just imagine that by seeing so many more networks there's ALOT more disturbance in the signal you're trying to get cause wifi waves are bouncing around everywhere off everything and you're collecting it all with your super sensitive instruments - you'll see - bad performance.
Switch to a smaller antennae and things are much better again - you'll notice improved performance because you antennae isn't getting all that interference and distortions too.
Good amplified wireless adapters have noise filtering as well, should help with that some.
The directinoal antennaes were A PAIN THE FUCKING ASS to use unless you like spending hours trying to tweak shit. Don't worry though, I'll explain how you should really do this. Directional antennaes are only going tobe useful if you're REALLY far away from a poin, there is nothing inbetween. Like you're in the middle of the desert. The problem with directional antennaes is alot of the waves bounce around especially in more city like areas...they'll parially and completely bounce off all sorts of materials in so many different ways.
I have also had some trouble with directional antennas, you really do need to position them just right. They are better for long distance though. Generally I hear that you use Omni directional for the hotspot and then directional to connect to it. Directional definitely works better for direct line of sight, that is why you would rarely want to use a directional antenna for the hotspot, because it needs to provide WiFi to a radius around it not a narrow line from it. But if you point a directional antenna right at the hotspot I think it would still be better than omni directional at cutting through walls and other objects than a comparable omni directional antenna would be. But omni directional is better at getting signal that takes an erratic path, so if you have an omni directional antenna in a room with an open door, signal will go out the open door, whereas with a directional antenna it will only go where you point it.
Because of this, the directional antennae is going to miss alot of the waves that came the direction of your target wifi network because some with hit it from behind and all these different angles. - this is why we liked omnidirectional more cause it catches eveything the network gives. There's alot less packet loss - which isif you employed some of the strategies here without my advice you'd be scratching your head over for way too long like we did.
I am not sure. If your neighbor has a wireless router that is in a straight line through four walls away from you, I think that directional antenna stands more chance of getting signal through the walls, but it needs to be pointed right at the wireless router. On the other hand, if they have a wireless access point in the same place but a window is open, an omni directional antenna will pick up signal coming out of the open window better. I can definitely see that omni directional are superior in some cases, in most cases they will definitely pick up more signals at the same time, but directional antenna is more likely to be able to pick up more signals at different times depending on how you have it positioned. The first directional antenna I got was a big let down for me but I think it is because I did not amplify it at all. The second directional antenna I got worked great when it was amplified but it needed to be pointed just right for optimal performance. Omni directional are certainly better if you don't want to have to reposition your antenna all the time, but I think directional are better for busting through walls (whereas omni directional are better for going around walls, if there is any way to go around the walls).
You use special types of cables that split up where your connection is received from into many difference locations. Like split it up into one big antennae on one side of your house and another big antennae on the other - now they even get to take advatange of potentialy triangulating witheach other. We never actually tested this as I said so I don't know much about it, where to find it, or how to exactly set it up (besides trying to make the antenaaes as far away from either other as possible.
I am no expert on wireless stuff, but isn't that sort of what a dipole antenna does? I thought that dipole antennas are essentially two directional antennas in one, with each one pointed in the opposite direction.
I would imagine dishes would perform similarly if you were to set up several different angles pointing at the same spot - but still miss alot of waves. so perhaps a good setup would be to use an omnidirectional with it.
I think dish antennas are omnidirectional antennas but with a big angle. They are probably your best bet for getting the most signal as well, since they are usually mounted outdoors and have at least one less wall to penetrate through. On the other hand, you cannot really drive around with a huge dish antenna mounted on the roof of your car, I think that would look suspicious ;).
I've got one or two 24gb gain directional antennas I believe. Got at least one. This is the highes tgain I could find.
I assume you mean db. My impression on antennas from personal experience, but again I am no expert on this, is that the antenna is sort of a bottleneck that determines the best possible range you can get. But even the best antenna without an amp is not going to be very good, it needs to be powered in order to live up to its maximum potential. This is just the impression I have after once buying a really high end antenna and noticing it had very little effect on my range as compared to a much cheaper antenna. I think the limiting factor was that I was not powering either of the antennas, because later when I bought an amplifier it made a lot of difference and that is when the differences between the antennas really became obvious.
Got a nice very powerful amplifier (I believe I bought the best and most powerful one available, which btw did not help out at all...although it may if you use multiple antennaes. Think of it as turning up the volumes when your antennnae is already picking up too many radio stations. Can you hear any of them any better then? No. That's essentialy what these amplifiers do.
Yeah that is a problem for amplified signals, but there are noise filtering amplifiers as well maybe that will make the difference. Have you ever tried a noise filtering amplifier?
Oh btw another alternative is to just ren the devices that make 4g hotspots with fake information and have them mailed to some random address (that's your part to figure out lol). The works well and is nice and consistent, although I believe most of htese come with a GPS coomponent though.
In a lot of European countries you can buy those things over the counter with no ID required. I think that they can all be triangulated as easily as a phone though, so it might not actually help very much at all especially if you use it from your house. If they all come with GPS then it will be even less helpful. Another alternative is to use hacked cable modems with spoofed MAC addresses, although I don't think this is much more helpful for anonymity than using open WiFi. The cable company can at least determine your neighborhood, and then they can locate you by running a tap on each of the lines in the neighborhood looking for where the rouge signal is coming from. Usually I think this is too much of a hassle for the cable company to do, but if the police are after you they can do it, might be a bit more work for them than tracing a rouge WiFi signal but it is by no means impossible. Plus using hacked Cable Modem is much more likely to have the cable company come after you than using Open or Cracked WiFi is to have the person who owns the access point come after you or contact the police, but to the best of my understanding it is difficult for the cable company to detect that you are doing this if you go about it right, and even when they detect somebody doing this it is often too much a pain for them to bother tracking them down.
Heh that thing about using multiple antennaes for one connection....you guy are SO FUCKING LUCKY I told you about it because we spent so much itme and stress in our project group until we were actually told thats the way thephysics of wifi communication work.
I think those are called dipole antennas.
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Recommended antenna and amplifier models?
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Could someone explain to me the advantage of grabbing someones wifi? If you are roaming in different locations it is an obvious plus, but if you are in the same location when grabbing the wifi I don't see it adding anything.
It could even be worse, there is the very small chance someone notices someone using their wifi who they do not know and decide to investigate it.
I am just not seeing what it adds
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Could someone explain to me the advantage of grabbing someones wifi? If you are roaming in different locations it is an obvious plus, but if you are in the same location when grabbing the wifi I don't see it adding anything.
It could even be worse, there is the very small chance someone notices someone using their wifi who they do not know and decide to investigate it.
I am just not seeing what it adds
If you always use from the same location it really doesn't add much other than possible retroactive unlinkability if you move or notice you leaked your IP address. If you move to a new location and then the police show up at your neighbors house a month later, they might not be able to link the interesting session to you. If you notice you accidentally fucked up and leaked your IP address, you can stop using your neighbors WiFi and then when the police show up they might not be able to link the session to you. I think on a scale of 0-10, using WiFi from a neighbors house gives you +1 to anonymity, whereas using WiFi from random locations gives you probably +3.
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As I take it if I ever want to stop and move on I can put it all behind me as my IP wouldn't be linked.
Also, if there were to be a crackdown on SR all at the same time I would be able to investigate further and hear about it before logging back in.
I think in the end I am going to end up using the same neighbors wifi everytime. If I use a TOR Bridge this will not show up as tor usage correct?
Also, there is the option of starting a proxy application when tor starts, what does this have the possibility of adding for me in terms of anonymity?
+ under the sharing tab in Tor setting, their are 4 options - Run as client only, Relay traffic inside the tor network (non-exit relay), relay traffic for the tor network (exit relay), help censored users reach the tor network.
Default is set to the first run as a client only.