Silk Road forums
Discussion => Security => Topic started by: TheDevilsSon13 on January 01, 2013, 03:58 am
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Im worried about feds raiding me for my computer information. I would like it if somebody could give me instructions on how to clear data completely not just delete it. I know feds can get into anything and I would like to stay in business on the silkroad ;) the more we all stand together and keep the SR up and running the better chance we all have.
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Im worried about feds raiding me for my computer information. I would like it if somebody could give me instructions on how to clear data completely not just delete it. I know feds can get into anything and I would like to stay in business on the silkroad ;) the more we all stand together and keep the SR up and running the better chance we all have.
Darik's Boot and Nuke: http://www.dban.org/
How To Delete and Wipe Your Data Securely With DBAN: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwCCim2V_Jw
NC
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Im worried about feds raiding me for my computer information. I would like it if somebody could give me instructions on how to clear data completely not just delete it. I know feds can get into anything and I would like to stay in business on the silkroad ;) the more we all stand together and keep the SR up and running the better chance we all have.
Darik's Boot and Nuke: http://www.dban.org/
How To Delete and Wipe Your Data Securely With DBAN: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwCCim2V_Jw
NC
Does DBAN wipe out the operating system also? I did a 3 pass wipe with CCleaner on drive C and D. Would you say that is sufficient?
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Fully encrypt your hard drives with TrueCrypt or another full disk encryption software. Try and use a password/passphrase that's at least 20 characters long.
http://www.truecrypt.org/
http://www.truecrypt.org/docs/?s=tutorial
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I have written myself an application (Mac) that sits on my desktop and when opened will immediately put all SilkRoad information including the tor browser and all related files on my computer into the trash and empty it within less than a second.
Pretty useful for that 'just in case' situation.
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Just make sure your computer is off when the fuzz comes. Commercial software is now available to steal TrueCrypt keys from RAM, and while it may not work as well as advertised, the best defense is a turned off computer.
BTW, people on this forum roundly dismissed the ElcomSoft program, but Bruce Schneier and his commenters were more concerned.
https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2012/12/breaking_hard-d.html
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and if the fuzz does arrive when your truecrypt is running even smashing the machine is a good option to get it turned off and the ram discharged fast.
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Im worried about feds raiding me for my computer information. I would like it if somebody could give me instructions on how to clear data completely not just delete it. I know feds can get into anything and I would like to stay in business on the silkroad ;) the more we all stand together and keep the SR up and running the better chance we all have.
Darik's Boot and Nuke: http://www.dban.org/
How To Delete and Wipe Your Data Securely With DBAN: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwCCim2V_Jw
NC
Does DBAN wipe out the operating system also? I did a 3 pass wipe with CCleaner on drive C and D. Would you say that is sufficient?
DBAN wipes the entire drive -- boot sector, OS, swap space, slack space, everything.
Is CCleaner sufficient? Not on your life.
NC
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There is a 27 wipe pass, I forgot the name but it's the most cleanest, or just take a magnet to your harddrive ;)
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I have written myself an application (Mac) that sits on my desktop and when opened will immediately put all SilkRoad information including the tor browser and all related files on my computer into the trash and empty it within less than a second.
Pretty useful for that 'just in case' situation.
This will not stop a determined adversary from recovering the deleted files through forensic examination of the free space on the drive, even if you use a "secure trash" feature that overwrites the files, since they have probably been written to multiple locations on the disk.
A full disk wipe (like with DBAN) is much safer, but that also has problems due to reallocated blocks and such. The best software based data erasure method is to use full disk encryption and overwrite the key if necessary.
See this analysis.
http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=99520.msg699299#msg699299
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Fire is the only 100% guaranteed way.
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Im worried about feds raiding me for my computer information. I would like it if somebody could give me instructions on how to clear data completely not just delete it. I know feds can get into anything and I would like to stay in business on the silkroad ;) the more we all stand together and keep the SR up and running the better chance we all have.
Darik's Boot and Nuke: http://www.dban.org/
How To Delete and Wipe Your Data Securely With DBAN: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwCCim2V_Jw
NC
tried and true! dod 3 pass blahhhh!
use the 7 passes also use memtest86+ for ram first then reboot and start the dericks immediately after.
u can remove the memtest disk while program is running - same with dban.
i wish there was one that was faster like on the movies :P rofl
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Fire is the only 100% guaranteed way.
+1 for overkill! My evil twin sister has an uber powered degaussing strip built into (not onto) the door frame of her office.
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Believe it or not, data recovery firms are way more successful at recovering physically damaged HDDs than overwritten data. In fact, just a single overwrite is more than sufficient, and the more random the data of the overwrite, the better. Reboot the PC and use Boot and Nuke or a similar app; any overwrite method is fine. If your SATA HDD supports the Secure Erase command (95% do), that will overwrite the entire drive--including damaged areas--very quickly and thoroughly. Hybrid drives and SSDs absolutely require the use of the Secure Erase command due to the way they store data.
If you're really paranoid about the NSA using secret technology on your drive, it won't hurt to take the platters out and manually destroy them after you overwrite everything. Just don't let anyone find the remains or you can be charged with evidence tampering, obstruction of justice, etc.
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I have written myself an application (Mac) that sits on my desktop and when opened will immediately put all SilkRoad information including the tor browser and all related files on my computer into the trash and empty it within less than a second.
Pretty useful for that 'just in case' situation.
This will not stop a determined adversary from recovering the deleted files through forensic examination of the free space on the drive, even if you use a "secure trash" feature that overwrites the files, since they have probably been written to multiple locations on the disk.
A full disk wipe (like with DBAN) is much safer, but that also has problems due to reallocated blocks and such. The best software based data erasure method is to use full disk encryption and overwrite the key if necessary.
See this analysis.
http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=99520.msg699299#msg699299
Ok fair enough i did not know this, now if I am raided it will result in me running this program, stamping on my laptop and then throwing it as far as I can out of the window.
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DBAN takes way too long, like 5 - 10 hours on your average 300 - 500 GB hard drive, to be an effective defense during a raid. Your best option at that point is degaussing with a strong magnet. If you have incriminating evidence on your hard drive now, you should DBAN it now and set up full disk encryption. Don't wait until you are getting raided.
Sure, there are attacks on encrypted drives too, as we're discussing in AnonymousAddict's thread, but it makes LE's job a few orders of magnitude harder than the solution you're currently using, and unless you're a terrorist or cartel king pin, they're probably not waiting outside your door, prepared for a cold boot attack.
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Hi,
Does anyone know how strong an Electro-magnet would have to be to wipe a drive still in a laptop?
Cheers,
Guy
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I don't have a specific number for you, but it depends on the hard drive...
Drive designers continually increase the linear density of magnetic recording to create higher data storage capacity per disk. This raises the disk magnetic coercivity, the field required to write bits on the magnetic media. As the magnetic coercivity increases, the fields required to erase the data on recorded disks increases. Thus an older degausser may not fully erase data on a newer hard disk drive. New perpendicular recording drives may not be erasable by present degaussers designed for past longitudinal recording drives.
Future generations of magnetic recording media may use very high magnetic coercivity disks to achieve areal densities greater than 500 gigabits per square inch. These drives may have technology using laser light in the magnetic write element of the disk drive, to raise the temperature of a spot on the magnetic medium in order to lower the magnetic coercivity to the point where the write element can record a bit on the very high coercivity magnetic media. For disk drives using this Heat or Thermally Assisted Magnetic Recording (HAMR/TAMR) technology the degausser field required to erase the disk drive at room temperatures may be impossible or impractical to achieve. In this case the drive may have to be physically destroyed.
http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/index.php?topic=99520.msg699299#msg699299
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Great information,
Thanks Astor
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I mean.. isn't all this a little much?
Or am I wrong?
Wouldn't it be safe enough to just completely encrypt your hard-drive with true crypt?
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Wouldn't be easier to just use a laptop with no hard drive and get one or two 128 gig usb pen drive all encrypted.... that should be enough space for darknet stuff and if the fuckers come in all u have to do it is either swallow it (lol) or throwing it in the crapper and flush it....all they are left is a nice laptop with no HD...that is how i would do it ...that is how i am prepared for it...clearing evidence from computer can take quite a lot of time and when the Feds kick at the door ..not sure you've got much time....
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You guys are on the right track. I'm a big fan of full disk encryption. On top of securing your data, it offers the safest form of software-based data erasure. If you overwrite the first gigabyte of the device, you destroy the encryption key and any hope of recovering the contents. Zeroing out the first gigabyte takes only seconds, too, so it's simultaneously safer and faster than DBAN.
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astor is right, as the data density on rewritable media increases and becomes more high tech, so does the difficulty in quickly and thoroughly erasing the information on them.
Ive done a little research on HERF guns, which are directional energy weapons which one could theoretically have pointed at ones HDD in order to flatten or scramble it at the flick of a switch.. check them out.
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I would run tails from a boot cd in a laptop with no hard drive and have everything stored on a usb stick encrypted with truecrypt using a hidden volume. that way if you get raided you may have time to eject the usb drive and smash it to a million pieces. if you dont have time to smash it up at least its encrypted. Of course keep backups of your usb drive in multiple safe locations!
As for wiping the hard drive... use DBAN although to be honest i'd just move your data to an encrypted usb stick and smash your hard drive up...
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I find bullets to be my hard drives only weakness. Why fuck around? I see a lot of good ideas for how to proceed in the future, but if it's that serious then just use the programs to wipe the drive that were suggested and then use a drill press to finish the job and toss that bitch into the swamp!
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I find bullets to be my hard drives only weakness... and then use a drill press to finish the job and toss that bitch into the swamp!
Unfortunately, you'll need to grind the disks into microscopic pieces. From the same analysis I quoted earlier:
To positively prevent data from recovery, disks can be removed from disk drives and broken up, or even ground to microscopic pieces. (Actually, simple disk bending is highly effective, particularly in emergency situations.) Obsolete government document DoD 5220 required physical destruction of the storage medium (the magnetic disks) for data classified higher than Secret. Even such physical destruction is not absolute if any remaining disk pieces are larger than a single 512-byte record block in size, about 1/125" in today's drives. As linear and track densities increases, the maximum allowable size of disk fragments become ever smaller.
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I never met an alligator who specialized in data recovery. I'm treating it like a pistol I just committed a crime with. I don't trust any piece of software to do the trick, and don't care to go right back to using the exact same drive even if I was convinced. I guess removing the disks and using a hammer can pretty much accomplish what your analysis suggests, and is more practical than using bullets, however less fun.
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I never met an alligator who specialized in data recovery. I'm treating it like a pistol I just committed a crime with. I don't trust any piece of software to do the trick, and don't care to go right back to using the exact same drive even if I was convinced. I guess removing the disks and using a hammer can pretty much accomplish what your analysis suggests, and is more practical than using bullets, however less fun.
What's more likely to get you into trouble: 1) overwriting data rendering any recovery IMPOSSIBLE or 2) playing with a gun?
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Now if you computer geeks could just get my shit to my mailbox in under a month during the Christmas days.
You're so focused on security. Let me guess, you do weed, and or psychedelics. I've been there.
Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're not out to get you !!! :o
I'd give up my mailing address right here, for that 2 gram German speed I ordered a month ago to show up. I really don't think LE cares about my shitty little addiction, and if they do they can have me. I've dodged more damning evidence than possession.
Shit I'd be happy to have the pig cops deliver me my package so I can plead "plausible deniability".
I ain't afraid of LE for small personal usage amounts. Come get me bitches!
Chill out and order drugs. You're already liable for being on this forum if they ever were to go to court, which they wont. Too many 100.000 cases. name me one LE agcy in the world with those resources..
Yeah, I didn't think so. Chill the fuck out and get high. You know you want to. Stop being a fucking pussy !!! ;D
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think there would be any interest in thermite laced hard drives? would destroy all data in less than a second :D
i would probably have the data encrypted and then physically destroy, it could never be decrypted with missing bytes.
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On their own, both sound legal to me. Now if the HD contained illegal material or if the gun was stolen... they both sound like bad ideas.
I personally just like to do the very best I can to destroy the data and then ditch the drive was my point. Take away the alligators and bullets as required. I genuinely believe no matter how well you erase the drive, or destroy it physically, that you then need to get rid of it. Getting rid of the evidence after taking all other measures is just another layer of security in case others fail... you could make a user error with one of the programs, but if you bury it in the dessert then it won't matter. If you pop it back in your computer then any mistake in your other steps will ruin you. I just don't trust everything I read on the internet on proper data destruction techniques, but I trust that tossing my hard drive into the Hudson river after taking all other precautions will keep me out of handcuffs.
Oh, even better, dump those disks in battery acid!
Another good reason for ditching the drives, tampering with evidence is a crime in itself. How do I know even if LE can't access the data anymore, that they can't still prove it was in fact destroyed intentionally... idk, I could just never be comfortable enough to reuse drives again once I decided it was necessary to destroy the contents for the sake of my safety.
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The question is : ""wil a magnet wipe all data from a hdd"".
Answer is, yes it will, or at least, it can wipe all data of the hdd.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degaussing
But if you are just doing drugs or murder, smashing the hdd with a hammer or drilling some holes, should do the same, or have the same result.
No way to read the data from the hdd after that.
The strongest point is not on the magnet but a few inches above the magnet.
A episode of mythbusters showed that a bankpas had to be held above the hdd and not to close or on the magnet itself.
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If I was to wipe my hard drive with Darik's Boot And Nuke would I need my windows vista disk to install it after it's done wiping everything?
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Of course. You will need the disk to re-install your P.C's operating system.