Silk Road Customer Association

[tankfly]

BUYERS/mods/admins/vendors/developers of the SILK ROAD the Silk Road Customer Association REQUIRES a buyers' round table.




***This is a thread dedicated to discussing the formation of an Association that represents the SR customer and ONLY the SR customer.

For the most part SR and this SR discussion forum is run by and for the vendor (round table anyone??) the customer doesn't get a look in. That needs to change.

I reckon this place should start putting the needs of the many before the needs of the few.

If you're interested in having a say about something that's bothering you about SR or anything related to anything at all, post it here.

To be continued...

@ mods if you feel this thread belongs somewhere else (Rumour Mill) then go ahead and move this thread there, personally I feel that this issue is too important to be buried in some backwater sub-forum.

P.S. Opinions, insults, porn, drugs welcome.

[tankfly]

The SRCA Consensual Constitution

1. The Consumer is Sovereign.

Right that's my lot. Off to bed

[Enoch Thompson]

I"m all in.  Great idea since feedback and issues are randomly distributed throughout the board.  Sometime search brings up nothing when I know it's there.

[Dutch-Passion]

I would love to see what happens in the roundtable, maybe they should post a chatlog off it.

[RxKing]

@ OP

Let me start by telling you.that I do more for the customer then any other vendor..and I completely understand what you are saying.. The problem is that MOST people in the forms are not the real buyers...though some are....and your idea is great...but unfortunately...you can see in your thread already...

That the 2 that responded so far did not understand you at all!!!!! They want to know what is being said in the vendor forum!!! And you are trying to say lets start a forum for buyers only....!!!

Let me also say you already have it!!!! All these forums are for you!!!! There would be NO REASON for vendors not too see it....as it would be to read and help make changed for the better. So trust me what you are saying is already there....and for the 2 that replied.....READ WHAT HE MEANT!!!!

[RxKing]

WHY ARE YOU YELLING?

Why are you as usual just trolling and bring NOTHING to the post......except to yell your self. Honestly you need to go do something and stay off SR. You do NOTHING ever but troll.

[Dutch-Passion]

Hey towelie, wanna get high? 

[tankfly]

I"m all in.  Great idea since feedback and issues are randomly distributed throughout the board.  Sometime search brings up nothing when I know it's there.

Thanks Nook
Maybe we could have some kind "feedback and issues" theme to the SRCA.
Incidentally, I have some issues about SR that I would like to bring to everyone's attention (only from my own perspective as a customer) about FE, OPESEC (assurance and validation of vendors' bona fides) and a load of other gripes that I have about this new movement (I'm talking about the darknet revolution).

[tankfly]

I would love to see what happens in the roundtable, maybe they should post a chatlog off it.

Hey DP (love your seeds by the way - big fan of Think Different).
I know that they discuss blacklisting people there for criticising vendors' immoral practices (FE), which is bad mKay, blacklisting an individual customer becausee he/she wants to talk is bad.

[twatWaffle]

I approve the OP. [CONFIRMED] +1

I firmly believe that a customer based, reliable, informed about both feral vendors and rabid customers, forum presence would be useful.

I can't agree with you that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. That is communism. Can't abide that. However, a conscensus can be reached when the many and the few are willing to each make conscessions, vend popocorn, and sell mugs.

[PerfectScans]

ya its a good idea.

Although I do agree with Rx....you kind of have the Whole forum...how much else you want ?

As for VRT access.

When you are willing to work 100+ hours a week, while risking 2-10 or life....

Then you can join

[ASlone2013]

WHY ARE YOU YELLING?

Why are you as usual just trolling and bring NOTHING to the post......except to yell your self. Honestly you need to go do something and stay off SR. You do NOTHING ever but troll.

You're a towel.

 You are DEAD MOTHER FUCKER DIE DAMNIT!

[twatWaffle]

This is a thread dedicated to discussing the formation of an Association that represents the SR customer and ONLY the SR customer.

For the most part SR and this SR discussion forum is run by and for the vendor (round table anyone??) the customer doesn't get a look in. That needs to change.

I don't think the OP meant that customers should be permitted into the vendor's round table.

I think that the intent of this part of the op has been misconstrewed, or strewed with tomatoes.

I took this to mean instead, that we, as the customer base, from which the vendors get their livelihoods, should become a bit more pro-active, less like willing sacrificial victims. Just my .02 btc. I could be wrong.

[tankfly]

@ OP

Let me start by telling you.that I do more for the customer then any other vendor..and I completely understand what you are saying.. The problem is that MOST people in the forms are not the real buyers...though some are....and your idea is great...but unfortunately...you can see in your thread already...

TBH I think in the entire time since I've become conscious of the dread round table I have given it no more than 10 seconds thought. It's just not important to me.

If other consumers want to talk about your practices RXKing whether it be on the round table or elsewhere then this is the place to do it. You do not get to dictate whomever talks or whatever they talk about, neither do I for that matter (I just made one important suggestion), let us consumers say our thang.

That the 2 that responded so far did not understand you at all!!!!! They want to know what is being said in the vendor forum!!! And you are trying to say lets start a forum for buyers only....!!!

don't tell me what I'm trying to say, jesus the head on ye, how you get that thing through the door.

To reiterate, what I'm saying is that consumers are getting a RAW DEAL on SR, we need to talk about it.

Let me also say you already have it!!!! All these forums are for you!!!! There would be NO REASON for vendors not too see it....as it would be to read and help make changed for the better. So trust me what you are saying is already there....and for the 2 that replied.....READ WHAT HE MEANT!!!!

Thank you for bringing me around to the central point of this tread "TRUST".

A certain percentage of vendors have willingly and intentionally SCAMMED us the buyer.

It is commonplace for vendors to blackmail and bully the SRConsumer for expressing controvercial views about Silk Road.

Help me help you help your customers RXKing.

[PerfectScans]

dunno, maybe a world I dont see..

But never thought as customers as sacrificial lambs or somewhat.

However, I like I said, I agree....the forums are too much of...well...stuff

Maybe a customer....."association would be good"

As vendors are just as keen to find good customers who don't scam, blackmail etc as customers are to find good vendors who aint cunts.

[tankfly]

WHY ARE YOU YELLING?

Why are you as usual just trolling and bring NOTHING to the post......except to yell your self. Honestly you need to go do something and stay off SR. You do NOTHING ever but troll.

Let he or she that is without sin cast the first stone.

[tankfly]

You're a towel.

Verily, well played

[PerfectScans]

think the OP answered his own questions...lol..


Unreal lmao

[tankfly]

I approve the OP. [CONFIRMED] +1

Thanks TW

I firmly believe that a customer based, reliable, informed about both feral vendors and rabid customers, forum presence would be useful.

Cheers for that, your thinking is more objective than mine. The "feral vendors" AND the "rabid customers" should be discussed here.

What do you mean by "forum presence"? You mean like another mod? I don't think instating another mod is a good idea because the mods have power, and power attracts the power hungry and greedy, just my two cents.

I can't agree with you that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. That is communism. Can't abide that. However, a conscensus can be reached when the many and the few are willing to each make conscessions, vend popocorn, and sell mugs.

OK, you've got my attention. said the magic word 'conscensus': the word indicates some kind of collective Will, not quite democratic but not entirely despotic either. A balance between sellers' interests and buyers' rights, or am I taking you up wrong.

[tankfly]

ya its a good idea.

Although I do agree with Rx....you kind of have the Whole forum...how much else you want ?

As for VRT access.

When you are willing to work 100+ hours a week, while risking 2-10 or life....

Then you can join

Dude I don't give a shit about some shit-heel circle-jerk, why are vendors banging on about your private chat room? Srsly there are more important things to talk about.

[tankfly]

WHY ARE YOU YELLING?

Why are you as usual just trolling and bring NOTHING to the post......except to yell your self. Honestly you need to go do something and stay off SR. You do NOTHING ever but troll.

You're a towel.

 You are DEAD MOTHER FUCKER DIE DAMNIT!

Lame.

[PerfectScans]

I think it has its merits..

More I think about it...more...can be done here.

Hmmm...

Customer verification process ?

Buyer feedback ?

Buyer Stats...

[PerfectScans]

[/quote]

Dude I don't give a shit about some shit-heel circle-jerk, why are vendors banging on about your private chat room? Srsly there are more important things to talk about.
[/quote]

And you wonder why vendors scam you ?....with an attitude towards vendors like you have....just exactly how do you hope to carve a good working vendor/customer relation ?

Ignoring all my support of your idea, you attack all vendors as circle jerks etc...

Probably why there chance of YOU establishing such an idea are slim to none and slim has gone home. I suggest you carry on trolling with the other muppets and let the adults manage the business of SR.

[tankfly]

Oops.

[tankfly]

Hey towelie, wanna get high? 

In the interests of FULL DISCLOSURE I feel compelled to tell you this:

I only consume one flower, no booze, no mdma, no meth, no H.

One flower is all I want, that's it.

I have a number of other opinions but you know what they say about those.

[twatWaffle]

I approve the OP. [CONFIRMED] +1

Thanks TW

I firmly believe that a customer based, reliable, informed about both feral vendors and rabid customers, forum presence would be useful.

Cheers for that, your thinking is more objective than mine. The "feral vendors" AND the "rabid customers" should be discussed here.

What do you mean by "forum presence"? You mean like another mod? I don't think instating another mod is a good idea because the mods have power, and power attracts the power hungry and greedy, just my two cents.

I have half assed kinda envisioned it like this. If we, as the SRCU form an actual consensual consortium, we could, en masse, have ONE set of colored bars, that represents the SRCU. It could be one  MODERATOR position, that any of us, as members of the consortium, could assume, with access to that "MODERATOR/s" accounts/privileges when necessary.

OK, you've got my attention. said the magic word 'conscensus': the word indicates some kind of collective Will, not quite democratic but not entirely despotic either. A balance between sellers' interests and buyers' rights, or am I taking you up wrong.

You got it right. Anarchy. We are all ultimately responsible for each and every thing we do, and each and every thing we DON'T do.

I am capable of coming to an agreement that doesn't cost me more than I am willing to pay.Converesly, I am always free to walk away. That way, there is no negative with being a member of the assocation. Free market enterprise. At its best. John Galt, I am YOU!

[tankfly]

I think it has its merits..

More I think about it...more...can be done here.

Hmmm...

Customer verification process ?

Buyer feedback ?

Buyer Stats...

Awesomeness.
Thank You.
I'd like to be able to review/edit feedback, the reason for this is that negative feedback on a vendor damages that vendor's chances of making green, with a modify post feature we the buyer can change our bad FB to GOOD FB (stuff like "AWESOME FUCKEN SELLER!!! package arrived late but fully intact, ultra stealth MB, product was sweeeeet ") This way we can start to address rebuilding TRUST IN SR - because I'll tell you something ladies and gents of the dread round table & SRCA TRUST IN SR IS SHOT!!

P. S.  Please forgive my apologetic vent, I'm starting to be a belieber.
P. S. S. Sorry for shouting but am enthused.

[tankfly]

And you wonder why vendors scam you ?....with an attitude towards vendors like you have....just exactly how do you hope to carve a good working vendor/customer relation ?

You're  right I blew it, sorry

Ignoring all my support of your idea, you attack all vendors as circle jerks etc...

OK, in the interests of full feeling disclosure that was a bad thing to say.
It was unjustified, this attack on all of the vendors,
I've got a big mouth,
and sometimes I say offensive stuff,
I'm sorry

Probably why there chance of YOU establishing such an idea are slim to none and slim has gone home. I suggest you carry on trolling with the other muppets and let the adults manage the business of SR.

I'm sorry, I didn't mean any offense, I forgot you were a vendor tbh.
I shoulda comported myself with more decorum

[PerfectScans]

No worries...

I generally accept the chances of getting any kind of sensible debate in the main is zero. You wonder why a VRT exists ? lol

THB, this idea will not happen this year, there is toooooo much else to do, and that is if SR lives another year.

But......I agree and thought is given to this concept. Buyer feedback is something vendors have been arguing for since SR1......

[tankfly]

No worries...

I generally accept the chances of getting any kind of sensible debate in the main is zero. You wonder why a VRT exists ? lol

What's VRT?
[edit] Sorry, I've smoked a little flower and acronym became vehicle registration tax??"
got it back now, the dread round table. Got it.

Quick question, any nice chicks there?

THB, this idea will not happen this year, there is toooooo much else to do, and that is if SR lives another year.

It's already begun,
we have members,
soon we will have a conscensual Constitution.

But......I agree and thought is given to this concept. BUYER/Seller feedback is something vendors and Consumers should be arguing for since forever......

Fixed that for you
The SRCA is about the Consumers' business:

Avast ye,  who's with me??
Gar!!1

[PerfectScans]

VRT = Vendors Round Table...

+1 to you my man....get to it and get it going you have my support.

[Roadie]

Agree! and +1

[RxKing]

@ OP

Let me start by telling you.that I do more for the customer then any other vendor..and I completely understand what you are saying.. The problem is that MOST people in the forms are not the real buyers...though some are....and your idea is great...but unfortunately...you can see in your thread already...

TBH I think in the entire time since I've become conscious of the dread round table I have given it no more than 10 seconds thought. It's just not important to me.

If other consumers want to talk about your practices RXKing whether it be on the round table or elsewhere then this is the place to do it. You do not get to dictate whomever talks or whatever they talk about, neither do I for that matter (I just made one important suggestion), let us consumers say our thang.

That the 2 that responded so far did not understand you at all!!!!! They want to know what is being said in the vendor forum!!! And you are trying to say lets start a forum for buyers only....!!!

don't tell me what I'm trying to say, jesus the head on ye, how you get that thing through the door.

To reiterate, what I'm saying is that consumers are getting a RAW DEAL on SR, we need to talk about it.

Let me also say you already have it!!!! All these forums are for you!!!! There would be NO REASON for vendors not too see it....as it would be to read and help make changed for the better. So trust me what you are saying is already there....and for the 2 that replied.....READ WHAT HE MEANT!!!!

Thank you for bringing me around to the central point of this tread "TRUST".

A certain percentage of vendors have willingly and intentionally SCAMMED us the buyer.

It is commonplace for vendors to blackmail and bully the SRConsumer for expressing controvercial views about Silk Road.

Help me help you help your customers RXKing.

Hey fuck stick... if you read the first responses to your post...they thought that you actually wanted to know what was said in the vendors only forums....so that is why I said what you said!!!

Also as another poster pointed out...you already have what you are asking for dip shit...its called the forums!!!!!!  I also said I understood what YOU meant and clearly the first two did not...as there responses indicate that they would love to know what is said in the vendor forums..

Also there are more scamming buyers then vendors...second if that is what you are really talking about...is vendors that are scamming then that is a whole other issue. I do not even understand what you mean when you say vendors are bullying buyers...that just makes no sense. Also you do not need to help my buyers..read my feedback. My buyers are just fine. Also realize I am the one that got rid of the biggest scammer on here in BTC gold after many many failed attempts by others in here.

Another thing that you have to understand is that these forums do not represent the buyers at all. NOT EVEN CLOSE. Most in here are trolls, dip shits, brand new members and a few buyers....that is it.

I think you should have actually read what I wrote BEFORE you made this post.

Also ALL of the good vendors on here have the EXACT same situations as you the buyer does...but you do not get it. With your take care of the masses first BS. With out the vendors there is no SR...and also before you say without the buyers .....trust me...for every 1 of me...there are 1 million of you. Also realize that we would love nothing more then for everything to run smooth. And it will. It will just take some time...and you need to be patient. BUT the message you were trying to give in the OP .....you already have. Your in it now.

[RxKing]

In my opinion the VRT is full of drama that you adult children won't share with customers in fear of looking like muppets. If the customers of Silk Road saw all of your stupid bickering (not you PS, although you have a tendency to be similar to RxKing or Brad in your attitude) none of you would have any business. Period.

The roundtable is a soap opera.

YOUR the fucking idiot that causes all of it. You say the stupidest shit all the time...and talk about Drama? That is all you ever try to do with you 30 names! Save your shit.

[RxKing]

And buyers do not give a fuck what we say...they care what we do. They buy from me because I deliver! PERIOD. Every time. Exactly what they ordered. That is why they do business with me. Not because they agree with shit I say or disagree. They could care less. Quit saying stupid shit. Log into your Raul account and hunt down more scammers and do nothing about it. That account is the biggest joke just like you are.

[tankfly]

VRT = Vendors Round Table...

+1 to you my man....get to it and get it going you have my support.

Well here's my dilemma PS, I am only one man, I cannot do it alone.
I'm at a pretty busy time in my life, so I can only dedicate an hour or so on a daily basis.
We need to put a team together, people who can advise consumers about redres on SR.
What say ye fellows GAR.

Agree! and +1

Nice one Roadie welcome to the SRCA

[RxKing]

In my opinion the VRT is full of drama that you adult children won't share with customers in fear of looking like muppets. If the customers of Silk Road saw all of your stupid bickering (not you PS, although you have a tendency to be similar to RxKing or Brad in your attitude) none of you would have any business. Period.

The roundtable is a soap opera.

YOUR the fucking idiot that causes all of it. You say the stupidest shit all the time...and talk about Drama? That is all you ever try to do with you 30 names! Save your shit.

You're the most egotistical bastard on SIlk Road. We're both alpha personalities and I have better grammar, so of course I fuck with you. Honestly I hope you get some sort of help for your anger. There's no shame in catharsis or asking for help. How do I have 30 names in the roundtable?

I have no anger..I just hate all your dumb shit and I call you out on it. And I have no ego...I just do my business and I speak up. You do not do shit. And you have not done shit. FACT. Your big move was your Raul account..that was a bomb. Like most of your shit. You and I are not competitors...you are like the LA Sparks..And I am like the Lakers. I am Jordan. And your are a kid in the play ground reading about me.(also you have no game). All I do is tell it like it is. All you do is have 30 forum accounts and all of them are idiots. Also why didnt you tell the OP how you are the leader of the forums? http://silkroad5v7dywlc.onion/index.php?topic=16916.msg331080#msg331080


ALL you do is troll ....anyone can take 10 seconds and read your post. All you do is troll. talk about yourself or me. Your a joke.

[RxKing]

VRT = Vendors Round Table...

+1 to you my man....get to it and get it going you have my support.

Well here's my dilemma PS, I am only one man, I cannot do it alone.
I'm at a pretty busy time in my life, so I can only dedicate an hour or so on a daily basis.
We need to put a team together, people who can advise consumers about redres on SR.
What say ye fellows GAR.

Agree! and +1

Nice one Roadie welcome to the SRCA

if all you do is have 1 hour on here...spend it reading and not posting. You  would then realize all your concerns have been addresses MANY MANY MANY a time..and they will get handled is time. In the mean time...don't waste it saying stupid shit.

[tankfly]

In my opinion the VRT is full of drama that you adult children won't share with customers in fear of looking like muppets. If the customers of Silk Road saw all of your stupid bickering (not you PS, although you have a tendency to be similar to RxKing or Brad in your attitude) none of you would have any business. Period.

The roundtable is a soap opera.

YOUR the fucking idiot that causes all of it. You say the stupidest shit all the time...and talk about Drama? That is all you ever try to do with you 30 names! Save your shit.

Gentlemen please,

Here's a question?

Can a Vendor be a member of the SRCA?
I vote yes!
Here's why...
Giving the Vendors the option to join SRCA will promote CONSENSUS!! As I see it the interests of the vendor and consumer are at war, the war must end, trust must be restored, only consensus between the seller and the buyer.

So how to build consensus... erm
maybe like...talk it out or something??
Maybe talk it out Here Mkay?

Yeh so like customers that feel dissatisfied with their SR vendor can air their grievances and perhaps get satisfaction here on this thread... for all to see in the 'public' eye.

[pharma]

Bruce I don't recollect you even selling on SR2. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

You come of as a pretentious person. Odd as I do no recollect any significant things you've done on SR2 to enhance things you're more a quick-hitter & pot stirrer.

I do remember you sitting on addresses in some shape or from from SR1 and being disbarred.

Do not go and preach anything, to any one when you've committed an operational security sin.

Please feel free to correct me should I be incorrect.

Better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt. (UNKNOWN)

[tankfly]

And buyers do not give a fuck what we say...they care what we do. They buy from me because I deliver! PERIOD. Every time. Exactly what they ordered. That is why they do business with me. Not because they agree with shit I say or disagree. They could care less. Quit saying stupid shit. Log into your Raul account and hunt down more scammers and do nothing about it. That account is the biggest joke just like you are.

Well we here at the SRCA appreciate your FB, thank you

[RxKing]

And buyers do not give a fuck what we say...they care what we do. They buy from me because I deliver! PERIOD. Every time. Exactly what they ordered. That is why they do business with me. Not because they agree with shit I say or disagree. They could care less. Quit saying stupid shit. Log into your Raul account and hunt down more scammers and do nothing about it. That account is the biggest joke just like you are.

Well we here at the SRCA appreciate your FB, thank you

LOL  +1

[RxKing]

Bruce...everyone knows what a troll loser you are. NO ONE has your back but your other forum names. Most were  hoping you actually had died in that care accident. I just happen to know it was another lame attempt at you trying to get attention.

Nothing you do every works. Nothing you ever say means anything.

Just a TROLL with 30 accounts.

[Pillow]

In a perfect market, a representative of the buyers association should be IN the vendor's roundtable/hidden forum.
And get rid of that Bitstamp -25$ rating please.

[tankfly]

Bruce I don't recollect you even selling on SR2. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

You come of as a pretentious person. Odd as I do no recollect any significant things you've done on SR2 to enhance things you're more a quick-hitter & pot stirrer.

I do remember you sitting on addresses in some shape or from from SR1 and being disbarred.

Do not go and preach anything, to any one when you've committed an operational security sin.

Please feel free to correct me should I be incorrect.

Better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt. (UNKNOWN)

Touché
At the risk of sounding like a fop, I'll press on.

We need an updated rating system for BOTH buyers and sellers.

Buyers: I feel a system of feedback similiar to EBAY can be our best bet to regulate the scammers that are underming trust in SR. You give a star rating out of 5 for each of several headings : and finish the review with writing a little text message.

The headings might be:

STEALTH: SPEED: PRICE: QUALITY:

What do you the consumer think?

[tankfly]

In a perfect market, a representative of the buyers association should be IN the vendor's roundtable/hidden forum.
And get rid of that Bitstamp -25$ rating please.

So how do we do that?
By democratic vote?
Or pseudo-random selection?

I'm not really much of a fan of entrusting power in anybody's hand, including my own.
To circumvent the flaw in your suggestion and prevent gaming of this potential system, I believe the selection of an SRCA envoy should be selected by consensus between both the buyers and the sellers.

[tankfly]

And buyers do not give a fuck what we say...they care what we do. They buy from me because I deliver! PERIOD. Every time. Exactly what they ordered. That is why they do business with me. Not because they agree with shit I say or disagree. They could care less. Quit saying stupid shit. Log into your Raul account and hunt down more scammers and do nothing about it. That account is the biggest joke just like you are.

Well we here at the SRCA appreciate your FB, thank you

LOL  +1

A actually lolled 'cause I knew you were pretty cool guy You're just flaming your flipping balls off right now That's ok, I think this thread is about stepping up on a soapbox in the street and ripping shit up, so you go for it brah

[RxKing]

@tankfly

I hear what your TRYING to say...but right now...we do not even have customer service. 

We are like a car company that just got our first car out and it barely runs....BUT IT DOES. And we are working on just getting it running...and YOU are talking about Tv's in the head rest. Fuck we do not even have head rest yet!

I gave you the best advice when I said spend your time reading and not writing. You will see that every single thing you are talking about has been said 100000 times. mean while back in the real world...they are working on getting the breaks to work every time.

Also this is not Ebay. There are a few people working and NUMBER 1 thing is security. Nothing else matters. And truthfully this market is working GREAT!!! YOU just need to choose the right vendor and not be an idiot. A lot more people are getting their drugs and their money then not...like 98% to 2%.  So in truth realize that everything is going great. But before we even talk about the shit you are bringing up...there needs to be 1000 things done.

[RxKing]

A actually lolled 'cause I knew you were pretty cool guy You're just flaming your flipping balls off right now That's ok, I think this thread is about stepping up on a soapbox in the street and ripping shit up, so you go for it brah

Also all I am doing is telling complete truth right now and trying to help idiots. That's it. Just a normal day in the forums.

[tankfly]

@tankfly

I hear what your TRYING to say...but right now...we do not even have customer service. 

We are like a car company that just got our first car out and it barely runs....BUT IT DOES. And we are working on just getting it running...and YOU are talking about Tv's in the head rest. Fuck we do not even have head rest yet!

I gave you the best advice when I said spend your time reading and not writing. You will see that every single thing you are talking about has been said 100000 times. mean while back in the real world...they are working on getting the breaks to work every time.

Also this is not Ebay. There are a few people working and NUMBER 1 thing is security. Nothing else matters. And truthfully this market is working GREAT!!! YOU just need to choose the right vendor and not be an idiot. A lot more people are getting their drugs and their money then not...like 98% to 2%.  So in truth realize that everything is going great. But before we even talk about the shit you are bringing up...there needs to be 1000 things done.

I'm hearing what you're saying but no, NO, NO!
You're not a belieber, that's ok.
But I believe in The Silk Road, I believe SR is the coalface of a revolution, and I'm not exaggerating there, what the Consumers in partnership with the develpers and vendors are generating here is a self-sustaining GAME CHANGER.

And we will have our say,

AVAST!"!

[Akon]

Hey fuck stick... if you read the first responses to your post...they thought that you actually wanted to know what was said in the vendors only forums....so that is why I said what you said!!!

Also as another poster pointed out...you already have what you are asking for dip shit...its called the forums!!!!!!  I also said I understood what YOU meant and clearly the first two did not...as there responses indicate that they would love to know what is said in the vendor forums..

Also there are more scamming buyers then vendors...second if that is what you are really talking about...is vendors that are scamming then that is a whole other issue. I do not even understand what you mean when you say vendors are bullying buyers...that just makes no sense. Also you do not need to help my buyers..read my feedback. My buyers are just fine. Also realize I am the one that got rid of the biggest scammer on here in BTC gold after many many failed attempts by others in here.

Another thing that you have to understand is that these forums do not represent the buyers at all. NOT EVEN CLOSE. Most in here are trolls, dip shits, brand new members and a few buyers....that is it.

I think you should have actually read what I wrote BEFORE you made this post.

Also ALL of the good vendors on here have the EXACT same situations as you the buyer does...but you do not get it. With your take care of the masses first BS. With out the vendors there is no SR...and also before you say without the buyers .....trust me...for every 1 of me...there are 1 million of you. Also realize that we would love nothing more then for everything to run smooth. And it will. It will just take some time...and you need to be patient. BUT the message you were trying to give in the OP .....you already have. Your in it now.

You talk big game here, fucktard, usually i dont care for drama with a vendor nobody who cant handle anything, but i will make you look stupid in public infront of your "satisfied" buyers.

you remember this http://silkroad5v7dywlc.onion/index.php?topic=13413.0 ?

The story behind is basically, a buyer that asked RxKing to cancell the order after we CHANGED his vendor profile, with FE policy, and when the buyer asked for him to cancell he basically went NUTS!!

Btw this response from Rxking was before the package was shipped. Here is a little quote from Rxkings message to the buyer:

Rxking

Where you ask if the order will indeed go out tomorrow.....I mean I CLEARLY STATE MY CUT OFF TIMES FOR OVER NITE SHIPPING" so there was no need for that....then you talking about will I delete your personal info once I am done with it....Insinuating that I would somehow keep it? No wonder you are looking for a new vendor, the last one probably quit you. And so either you are brand new to the site or you are a complete moron..I do not think you are a moron. So that means your new....and if you read the link I sent you from our new "leader" you would see that DPR2 ran off with the money...so the site is not safe and there is a chance that the site will be down on Friday so you could not finalize.

Now since you read what I sent you and if you spent more then 2 seconds on the forums...you will see all the issues...including no support.

Now you happen to place a small order worth little money reactive to other orders but absolutely an amount you would not want to lose I get that. So that is why you came to the #1 vendor on the site with the best feedback and in over 2 years have never had anything but 5/5 and you will not fe?? So you were going to try and scam me.
As there is nothing else that makes sense..also you said it would not be an issue had it been on the listing...it is on my vendor page..as this is something brand new. I never FE.There is not a need to. But there is with the site now. And then you send me bogus examples.of vendors that are not even in business.

Also with my history and feedback and for such a small order and knowing WHY I am asking you not doing it makes NO SENSE other then you were going to try and say it did not come.I mean why else??

You even sent me a fake vendor!!! I know every other Roxie vendor is making people FE because of the issues at hand it would be really stupid not to make them. And your lucky that you even can you have to have a PERFECT RECORD and a long history, something I do. So it looks to me that you were going to pull a scam because there is no reason to not FE,

Only this make you look bad, and yes indeed you have anger issues!! I put you in the same boat as Whitedreams and Coachella, you guys are unstable and fucked up.

If i wouldnt get my Access revoked i would release all the shit you talk about in the VRT, and how you address your customers. You are disgusting!

And before you start to say " you are just another fucker who want to take me down, because i steal your sales" WRONG! We dont sell the same shit!

I just hate people with personality like yours.

[Mightarra]

This is getting a bit derailed now isn't it?

I'd like the idea of some sort of customer assocation, maybe a sub forum or just an improvement in the rumour mill where we can have different sub-forums for the different areas of drugs, I know we have threads for them and such but a whole sub-forum may be better, allow one or two members to be a mod for just individual sections there and it could allow for better feedback and vendor discussion.

I mean, it's hard when new vendors are popping up and others are scamming or bailing on the road to find a reliable vendor who you can trust because at the end of the day all I want to do is to legitimately buy some illegal drugs and them have legitimately arrive at my house with LE and anyone else none the wiser. I'm getting back to a point where I have trustable vendors for different things now but sometimes trying something new or a different strain is as they say the spice of life and I'd like a honest vendor.

Isn't that the dream? Isn't it the reason we're all here 
(Apart from scammers, they can go die)

[tankfly]

Thanks for the helpful links there vendors.
I'm surprised there aren't more buyers answering the call.

So you vendors I guess with all this posting on the SRCA thread that you might be interested in applying for membership of the newly constituted Silk Road Customer Association (SRCA)?
Well guess what membership is FREE

By voicing your own personal feelings on the issue of CONSUMER RIGHTS you can help every other member benefit from your experience of what new implementations will work and what ideas are duds.

Anyway, am definitely going to sleep now, insomnia's a bitch.

Either way membership is optional, not compulsory for either vendor or buyer, but we in the SRCA would always encourage CONSTRUCTIVE CONTRIBUTIONS on CONSUMER CONUNDRUMS.

[Pillow]

If you declare yourself member of the buyer's guild you will be part of a group of buyer's will never accept to give 5/5 for just an arrival, possibly with poor stealth.
The wrong assumption that a 5/5 is the MINIMUM score has to end.
We could also do "feedback strikes". For example for that lower BTC rate in which we all lose 10/20$ every 100 spent.
Vendors who are getting that "wrong BTC rate fee" would be worried to loose their rating if a large part of customers rates them lower? Or could care less?
And we will need a long awaited BUYERS ROUNDTABLE in which most reputable members could talk privately of our common policies and interests.
And let me say this: "you vendors can save our addresses for future reference or threatening? We could share our informations too.
@RX King: you made up your mind pretty clear and I understand your points, why do you have to bash the whole thing?

[tankfly]

This is getting a bit derailed now isn't it?

Hey, welcome to the SRCA... yeh, sorry about that, obviously lot of frayed tempers.

I'd like the idea of some sort of customer assocation, maybe a sub forum or just an improvement in the rumour mill where we can have different sub-forums for the different areas of drugs,

+1
Couldn't have put it better myself, perhaps localise the fora structure to US, EU, Asia, OZ?
The consumer will likely consult these fora in researching a seller they have found on SR, that's how I do it: if I could localise the vendor to domestic, I would be much happier.

The rumour mill is...disorganised fir sure.

I know we have threads for them and such but a whole sub-forum may be better, allow one or two members to be a mod for just individual sections there and it could allow for better feedback and vendor discussion.

OK.

I mean, it's hard when new vendors are popping up and others are scamming or bailing on the road to find a reliable vendor who you can trust because at the end of the day all I want to do is to legitimately buy some illegal drugs and them have legitimately arrive at my house with LE and anyone else none the wiser. I'm getting back to a point where I have trustable vendors for different things now but sometimes trying something new or a different strain is as they say the spice of life and I'd like a honest vendor.

[/b]

+1
Enshirned in our Constitution is the right to self-determination, to do what the hell we like with our own time. To toke what we will, "to bodily integrity" I deny any entity be it Legislative, Executive or JUDICIAL abridgement of that inalienable right.

Isn't that the dream? Isn't it the reason we're all here 
(Apart from scammers, they can go die)

Ah shure listen, havn't we all a little scammer in us somewhere?!
They're us just on a different path.

[RxKing]

@RX King: you made up your mind pretty clear and I understand your points, why do you have to bash the whole thing?

Well because the WHOLE THING is stupid and a waste of time. Right now...all we need is customer and vendor support. We need SR staff to shut off the scammer accounts. That's it. Then let the ship sail for a while. I mean just 4 days ago 90% of the forums were crying that deposits were taking 4 hours. 6 days ago people were complaining about vendors wanting FE. yet the ONLY reason vendors want FE is so that they can get their coin OFF SR. As if they do not require FE then it is possible they send the drugs...and then when it is time for you to fe you wither A. don't for god knows why....but you simply don't....and with no auto finalize...vendors never get paid...there are a lot...I mean a lot...of vendors waiting for 30+ days for a buyer to log in to finalize. So that needs to be fixed.

Also there are AT LEAST 10 vendor accounts that are total scams...and they are just allowed to operate. It is a joke. So that needs to be fixed.

So I know this stuff is being done..and they are working hard behind the scenes...the simple point is that not one thing anyone has said in here is not known by those higher up...and there is already a forum to do all this in. But we need to get the basics first. Also I am all for all the buyers coming together...but like you have already noticed...the truth is...at most..there are 50 buyers in here......out of over 100000.   The truth is 95% are happy and fine...5% complain...often premature. And most that even reply in here are trolls...or vendors like me that are forced to be in here because I have to hit refresh every 2 min on SR....so I just have this tab open and I happen to have time to respond.

So trust me...As I am THE GUY that got BTC gold shut down...I hear everything all of you are saying....I am just saying that this is not the time...and actually this is a waste of time.

[Pillow]

@RX King: you made up your mind pretty clear and I understand your points, why do you have to bash the whole thing?

Well because the WHOLE THING is stupid and a waste of time. Right now...all we need is customer and vendor support. We need SR staff to shut off the scammer accounts. That's it. Then let the ship sail for a while. I mean just 4 days ago 90% of the forums were crying that deposits were taking 4 hours. 6 days ago people were complaining about vendors wanting FE. yet the ONLY reason vendors want FE is so that they can get their coin OFF SR. As if they do not require FE then it is possible they send the drugs...and then when it is time for you to fe you wither A. don't for god knows why....but you simply don't....and with no auto finalize...vendors never get paid...there are a lot...I mean a lot...of vendors waiting for 30+ days for a buyer to log in to finalize. So that needs to be fixed.

Also there are AT LEAST 10 vendor accounts that are total scams...and they are just allowed to operate. It is a joke. So that needs to be fixed.

So I know this stuff is being done..and they are working hard behind the scenes...the simple point is that not one thing anyone has said in here is not known by those higher up...and there is already a forum to do all this in. But we need to get the basics first. Also I am all for all the buyers coming together...but like you have already noticed...the truth is...at most..there are 50 buyers in here......out of over 100000.   The truth is 95% are happy and fine...5% complain...often premature. And most that even reply in here are trolls...or vendors like me that are forced to be in here because I have to hit refresh every 2 min on SR....so I just have this tab open and I happen to have time to respond.

So trust me...As I am THE GUY that got BTC gold shut down...I hear everything all of you are saying....I am just saying that this is not the time...and actually this is a waste of time.

I understand it sounded like a question but, mine was a different to say to "shut up", not to spread your worries for waste of buyer's free time or projects for the 20th time.

[tankfly]

Hey guys 'n' gals, still can't sleep.

I notice there's a poll that I can add to the thread...

Can all members contribute as to how we can utilize this resource to maximise concensus??

@TW welcome to my sig

[RxKing]

I understand it sounded like a question but, mine was a different to say to "shut up", not to spread your worries for waste of buyer's free time or projects for the 20th time.

When there is a question mark at the end...it is a question in a forum. I don't give to fucks if you want to waste your time...

[hobgoblin]

RxKING, one of the best if not the best vendor on here, is 100% correct. The entire forum except 1 small section (the roundtable) belongs to everyone.

Everyone already is a member of your SRCA club. We just call it the Silk Road community.

What do we as buyers do?
1. give tips about various issues.
2. warn about rogue vendors or vendors selling fake meds or poor quality product.
3. warn about scams.
4. lend each other spare coins when we are short for a buy.
5. teach each other about the latest security techniques.
6. talk about which vendors have best shipping, prices, stealth.
7. take the risk and sample new vendors and report to the forum about all aspects of the vendor.

Plus more.

We used to have a thread in the old forum where some buyers would be crowned "reliable reviewers" so new vendors knew who to send free samples to in exchange for a review. Otherwise, new vendors would be giving out free drugs for nothing.

So the question is, what do you think happens in the vendor roundtable? Well that's been explained a lot in the old forum. Vendors talk about vendor issues, features they would like to see, offered each other services like cash out or bulk buys, show new vendors the ropes and of course the big one... the blacklist (buyers who they shouldn't do business with because they try to scam or are just a general PITA).

Vendors aren't scheming evil mastermind plans in the roundtable for obvious reasons. The mods can read every post. Duh. Plus the good vendors, which far outnumber the bad, wouldn't stand for it. If any vendors are colluding, they would plan off site.

So the worry is all the FE going on. Well, vendors are tired of losing bucketloads of coins to escrow issues. They are losing faith. A lot of vendors had accounts on nearly all the sites that failed. It's been a very hard 3-4 months for them. But you have to know, the good vendors treat their buyers well. They have a rep they want to maintain and be able to carry over to any site. In fact, many sites let vendors with good reps have a free account instead of having to pay a bond because they know good vendors bring in sales. Sales = commissions (and lots in escrow in case the site owners want to run away with the escrow).

So you already have a club... it's just much bigger than you realized and already had a name.

[tankfly]

RxKING, one of the best if not the best vendor on here, is 100% correct. The entire forum except 1 small section (the roundtable) belongs to everyone.

Everyone already is a member of your SRCA club. We just call it the Silk Road community.

What do we as buyers do?
1. give tips about various issues.
2. warn about rogue vendors or vendors selling fake meds or poor quality product.
3. warn about scams.
4. lend each other spare coins when we are short for a buy.
5. teach each other about the latest security techniques.
6. talk about which vendors have best shipping, prices, stealth.
7. take the risk and sample new vendors and report to the forum about all aspects of the vendor.

Plus more.

We used to have a thread in the old forum where some buyers would be crowned "reliable reviewers" so new vendors knew who to send free samples to in exchange for a review. Otherwise, new vendors would be giving out free drugs for nothing.

So the question is, what do you think happens in the vendor roundtable? Well that's been explained a lot in the old forum. Vendors talk about vendor issues, features they would like to see, offered each other services like cash out or bulk buys, show new vendors the ropes and of course the big one... the blacklist (buyers who they shouldn't do business with because they try to scam or are just a general PITA).

Vendors aren't scheming evil mastermind plans in the roundtable for obvious reasons. The mods can read every post. Duh. Plus the good vendors, which far outnumber the bad, wouldn't stand for it. If any vendors are colluding, they would plan off site.

So the worry is all the FE going on. Well, vendors are tired of losing bucketloads of coins to escrow issues. They are losing faith. A lot of vendors had accounts on nearly all the sites that failed. It's been a very hard 3-4 months for them. But you have to know, the good vendors treat their buyers well. They have a rep they want to maintain and be able to carry over to any site. In fact, many sites let vendors with good reps have a free account instead of having to pay a bond because they know good vendors bring in sales. Sales = commissions (and lots in escrow in case the site owners want to run away with the escrow).

So you already have a club... it's just much bigger than you realized and already had a name.

Dibs on first responder:

1+
Excellent Post, you've given much my brother, now I need to sleep on your thoughts, and dream...zzz.

[anonymousGuy57]

I do like this idea OP but everthing iv read from RX he makes a damn good point.

He's been vending for a long time and has always been an active forum member, he is truly one of the Good guy vendors Left. (Bless his Hart) lol.. But since this thread has now got so much attention, Looks like it has many interested. I did not read every single page, but what i did read i like.

Nice! and Thumbs ^ To OP

[tankfly]

I do like this idea OP but everthing iv read from RX he makes a damn good point.

He's been vending for a long time and has always been an active forum member, he is truly one of the Good guy vendors Left. (Bless his Hart) lol.. But since this thread has now got so much attention, Looks like it has many interested. I did not read every single page, but what i did read i like.

Nice! and Thumbs ^ To OP

Thanks anon

You're right RX has made some rather convincing points about this. But so have a lot of other posters - including Hobgoblin.

May I reiterate the question: how might we utilize the poll function to find out what SR buyers want. Because ultimately I want this thread to be about the Silk Road Customers' Association.

Any opinions on that?

[twatWaffle]

Things I think I would like to see the SRCA do;

Compiling a compendium of MSDS sheets on the various nefarious and illicit, and not so nefarious, not so illicit substances that are proffered.

Like all the RCs available. I have no fucking clue, honestly, what most of them do, etc.

Compile a compenium of vendors, and have them cross referenced by products vended/costs/etc.

I am seeing a kinda functional vendor/product/price/ ? database....hmmm, anybody feel like making a database, anybody?

That would be the most efficient method of sorting, it seems to me.

 

[tankfly]

Things I think I would like to see the SRCA do;

Compiling a compendium of MSDS sheets on the various nefarious and illicit, and not so nefarious, not so illicit substances that are proffered.

Like all the RCs available. I have no fucking clue, honestly, what most of them do, etc.

Compile a compenium of vendors, and have them cross referenced by products vended/costs/etc.

I am seeing a kinda functional vendor/product/price/ ? database....hmmm, anybody feel like making a database, anybody?

That would be the most efficient method of sorting, it seems to me.

Hmmm a DB.. I'm learning SQL,PHP, Javascript at the moment but I don't think I know enough to create such a query.

I will need help and guidance creating it.

[the fisherman]

i think a few people have been telling this thread that they dont understand the op but i think they would need to read it as i think it was addressing buyers not vendors ! ive seen Rxking on few threads with always the same attitude an that is if i dont like wot you're saying then fuck you ! great attitude i must say you should look up constructive criticisim, as a discussion helps, a slating does nothing for anyone, id never order from anyone with an attitude like this no matter how cheap of good you're stuff is.

on behalf of the customer things id like to see change is buyer feedback, auto finalize and a time limit on new vendors before their allowed to ask for FE and also able to change feeddback as "FE will update" helps nobody.

also would just like to say ive seen few vendors mentioning the new % as a rise of 4% most vendors say they don't really care but i think the buyer's should, as it's us who is obviously going to pay this, i think a good vendor would split the difference an now heap it all onto us which no doubt will be the case :-(

[tankfly]

RxKING, one of the best if not the best vendor on here, is 100% correct. The entire forum except 1 small section (the roundtable) belongs to everyone.

True, but the entire forum is extremely diverse, there are literally thousands of different topics all jumbled up together. For example the title of the forum 'Rumour Mill' is a poor choice of name for a forum that should be about restoring trust in Silk Road. Rumour, as we all know, is not trustworthy ; and yet all customer reviews/knowledge resides there??!!? No, IMO the 'Rumour Mill' should be about BONA FIDE customers' issues and assurance.

Everyone already is a member of your SRCA club. We just call it the Silk Road community.

Yes, but until this thread there was no name for it. The 'Silk Road community' doesn't exclusively represent the customers' interests because it is not a codified entity. The SRCA could be, by establishing consensus on consumer issues.

What do we as buyers do?

The following list is a great codification of buyer best practice ON SRF:

1. give tips about various issues.

+1
kudos to ChemCat for teaching me as a noob on SRF 1.0.

2. warn about rogue vendors or vendors selling fake meds or poor quality product.

+1
This is HUGE, restoring trust in SR, means rebuilding the destruction that scammers have caused.

3. warn about scams.

Verily.

4. lend each other spare coins when we are short for a buy.

+1
Hear hear.

5. teach each other about the latest security techniques.

+1 Kudos to Chemcat for teaching me PGP.

6. talk about which vendors have best shipping, prices, stealth.

+1
Yep, verifiable advice from trusted buyers is essential to rebuild trust.

7. take the risk and sample new vendors and report to the forum about all aspects of the vendor.

+1
I agree wholeheartedly.
Perhaps such buyers should be bound by certain regulations, like never attempting blackmailing a vendor by threatening said vendors with poor feedback. There are a lot of behavioural issues between vendors and buyers that need to be more strictly discussed and regulated.

We used to have a thread in the old forum where some buyers would be crowned "reliable reviewers" so new vendors knew who to send free samples to in exchange for a review. Otherwise, new vendors would be giving out free drugs for nothing.

Do not concur. The opportunity for corrupting such a system is too great.
If the vendor is encouraged to offer 'inducements' to certain buyers in exchange for positive feedback, the system of knowledge becomes infected by cronyism.

I'm saying this now 'cause I feel that this is what's wrong with the current system. Sellers or buyers can extend certain 'influences' over each other which I believe does not serve the buyers' interests.

I believe offering such inducements to buyers weakens trust in their reliability.

So the question is, what do you think happens in the vendor roundtable?

No.
Do not concur.
The dread round table is not of interest to me.

Well that's been explained a lot in the old forum. Vendors talk about vendor issues, features they would like to see, offered each other services like cash out or bulk buys, show new vendors the ropes and of course the big one... the blacklist (buyers who they shouldn't do business with because they try to scam or are just a general PITA).

Yes, I'll admit, as a Silk Road customer the blacklist is of deep concern to me. I've seen people put on that list just 'cause they don't agree with vendors' opinions here on SRF.

Vendors aren't scheming evil mastermind plans in the roundtable for obvious reasons. The mods can read every post. Duh. Plus the good vendors, which far outnumber the bad, wouldn't stand for it. If any vendors are colluding, they would plan off site.

+1
Yeh, it's about rebuilding trust, is that what you're saying?

So the worry is all the FE going on. Well, vendors are tired of losing bucketloads of coins to escrow issues. They are losing faith. A lot of vendors had accounts on nearly all the sites that failed.

You know I believe a majority of buyers here have been burned by the demise of SR1, Sheep, BMR (I was) so although I've heard a lot about how much the vendors lost during the darknet revolution but never once have I heard of any buyers losing their escrow - this disparity needs to be addressed.

But you have to know, the good vendors treat their buyers well.

+1
And it will be those 'good vendors' and good buyers that will restore faith in the Silk Road.

They have a rep they want to maintain and be able to carry over to any site. In fact, many sites let vendors with good reps have a free account instead of having to pay a bond because they know good vendors bring in sales.

+1 Excellent post, what your demonstrating is that the vendor is thinking multi-tier darknet scalability. They are aware of their own brands and their implicit value.

Sales = commissions (and lots in escrow in case the site owners want to run away with the escrow).

So you already have a club... it's just much bigger than you realized and already had a name.

No, don't agree,  I feel the 'club' as you call it doesn't exist. I just gave it a name (SRCA).
The rest is up to the posters on this thread to decide.

[redalloverthenet]

We already have a community here and I try to give out advice and have helped with spare coin and willl always give an honest review of whatever it is I buy.

I love the forums as it breaks up work for me and allows me to be pretty clued up on what the best products are.

Most peope would avoid scams by researching a little more.

[Pillow]

In a perfect market, a representative of the buyers association should be IN the vendor's roundtable/hidden forum.
And get rid of that Bitstamp -25$ rating please.

So how do we do that?
By democratic vote?
Or pseudo-random selection?

I'm not really much of a fan of entrusting power in anybody's hand, including my own.
To circumvent the flaw in your suggestion and prevent gaming of this potential system, I believe the selection of an SRCA envoy should be selected by consensus between both the buyers and the sellers.

You are right, there's always the risk to involve LE or scammers or informants, but a customer's association would be a great add. It will need the help and willing to do it from SR admins for sure, and for sure now they are too busy to think about it.
Maybe things will develop in the new Alfred's forum.

[tankfly]

We already have a community here and I try to give out advice and have helped with spare coin and willl always give an honest review of whatever it is I buy.

Great, could you link it here?
The more I learn about SR the more I believe that honesty and truthiness are paramount.
Unfortunately there is a percentage of SR users that see this revolution as an opportunity to get free drugs in the post. And those users undermine the truthiness of Silk Road's communications system. The feedback system is supposed to protect the seller from scams, LE and all the other slings and arrows that flesh is heir to.

Instead it has become a system to be gamed to garner the maximum net profit for certain members of the Silk Road (by gaming I mean false feedback stats gaming where a member can bump their feedback rating by offering 'inducements' *spits (that is BRIBERY people!!) these members ought to see the error in the ways because falsifying the feedback system undermines the Silk Road.

I love the forums as it breaks up work for me and allows me to be pretty clued up on what the best products are.

You and me both buddy

Most peope would avoid scams by researching a little more.

woulda, shoulda, coulda.
Unfortuntately we know that the truth of it is that most SR members don't even know about these fora, or the revolution, many of whom have been described by senior vendors on this thread as "lambs to the slaughter". These people are the LIFEBLOOD of SR, they need to be protected by SR staff and mods.

That means we need a more streamlined way of protecting Silk Road customers.

[tankfly]

In a perfect market, a representative of the buyers association should be IN the vendor's roundtable/hidden forum.
And get rid of that Bitstamp -25$ rating please.

So how do we do that?
By democratic vote?
Or pseudo-random selection?

I'm not really much of a fan of entrusting power in anybody's hand, including my own.
To circumvent the flaw in your suggestion and prevent gaming of this potential system, I believe the selection of an SRCA envoy should be selected by consensus between both the buyers and the sellers.

You are right, there's always the risk to involve LE or scammers or informants, but a customer's association would be a great add.

OK, I'm going to say something rather contentious now, so bear with me, you'll see my point right soon. A member TW upthread mentioned the word "concensus": (my signature) for true concensus to exist ALL members be they scammer, informer or law enforcer should also get a say.

It will need the help and willing to do it from SR admins for sure, and for sure now they are too busy to think about it.

Cool thanks
Until the mods and admin free up some time I'll just try and formulate the next iteration of the SRCA

Maybe things will develop in the new Alfred's forum.

Cool, where's that, can you link it?

[Pillow]

http://thehubaoydxrommh.onion/index.php

[anonymousGuy57]

We already have a community here and I try to give out advice and have helped with spare coin and willl always give an honest review of whatever it is I buy.

I love the forums as it breaks up work for me and allows me to be pretty clued up on what the best products are.

Most peope would avoid scams by researching a little more.

You could'nt be more correct. I think its gotta be new SR members that dont bother to do their research on the vendors their using and being scammed. I just said in another thread, EVERYONE DO YOUR RESEARCH! Its worth it, It never failed me NEVER in my years on this ship.

[tankfly]

We already have a community here and I try to give out advice and have helped with spare coin and willl always give an honest review of whatever it is I buy.

I love the forums as it breaks up work for me and allows me to be pretty clued up on what the best products are.

Most peope would avoid scams by researching a little more.

You could'nt be more correct. I think its gotta be new SR members that dont bother to do their research on the vendors their using and being scammed. I just said in another thread, EVERYONE DO YOUR RESEARCH! Its worth it, It never failed me NEVER in my years on this ship.

+1 You're absolutely right, research should be top priority for any buyer looking to make a good vendor contact.

I'm still looking for the right vendor (for tea) any buyers got any recommendations?

[enigma710]

Great idea, OP!
+1

[twatWaffle]

Hey Towlie, wanna get high?

[enigma710]

Hey Towlie, wanna get high?

Don't forget to bring a towel.

[Ganjedi]

I love the customers of SR! We rely on you to stay in business and customer satisfaction should be of utmost importance for vendors. If you guys are ever looking for an honest and friendly cannabis and mdma vendor in Ireland (shipping to EU) then please pay me a visit.

Yours,
Ganjedi

[tankfly]

I love the customers of SR! We rely on you to stay in business and customer satisfaction should be of utmost importance for vendors. If you guys are ever looking for an honest and friendly cannabis and mdma vendor in Ireland (shipping to EU) then please pay me a visit.

Yours,
Ganjedi

Awesome Ganj
You're just the kind of vendor I'm looking for, will be skipping over to Silk Road to peruse your listings shortly

Incidentally would you be interested in joining the SRCA? We are a customer oriented group of people dedicated to raising and maintaining TRUST on the Silk Road, whatdya say would you consider being a member?

[tankfly]

Great idea, OP!
+1

Nice one
It would be great if you could tell us how we can address any gripes or trust issues you might have with SR.

[AConicSlink]

Sounds good. What exactly is the function of the association? To 'lobby' and represent the interests of buyers to the higher ups and act as a counterweight to the vendors? Maybe we should have our own roundtable?

[tankfly]

Hey Towlie, wanna get high?

OK

I be thinkin' about what this whole thing should be about...I need some help, I can only air my own opinions from a BIASED buyer's perspective, and that leaves me with a very limited set of criteria.

Like for example...how should we instate this SRCA idea? Like with a Constitution (as in OP) or something else.

You see the problem with associations and comittees and boards and community action is poor design and implementation.
The design at the beginning is crucial.

[tankfly]

Sounds good.
What exactly is the function of the association?

I don't really know yet, I'd appreciate some advice?

To 'lobby' and represent the interests of buyers

THIS is part of it thanks

Maybe we should have our own roundtable?

I don't agree about the roundtable 'cause the dread table is an exclusive entity.
I'm hoping the SRCA will be an inclusive body, inclusive of everybody. Also the round table excercises executive power over individual buyers and I believe that should be subject to certain rules.

[...] represent the interests of buyers to the higher ups and act as a counterweight to the vendors?

YES!!
But more...eventually the revolution will catch flip-side and we will need professional PR people to promote us, can you dig what I'm sayin'?

[tankfly]

What I'm trying to say is we need to eliminate cronyism on the Silk Road.

[Ganjedi]

I love the customers of SR! We rely on you to stay in business and customer satisfaction should be of utmost importance for vendors. If you guys are ever looking for an honest and friendly cannabis and mdma vendor in Ireland (shipping to EU) then please pay me a visit.

Yours,
Ganjedi

Awesome Ganj
You're just the kind of vendor I'm looking for, will be skipping over to Silk Road to peruse your listings shortly

Incidentally would you be interested in joining the SRCA? We are a customer oriented group of people dedicated to raising and maintaining TRUST on the Silk Road, whatdya say would you consider being a member?

No problem I will be a member. I do not know much about what it's like to buy on SR but I know a thing or two about selling obviously and I support your cause!

Customers want honest vendors and vendors need honest customers. I believe like I can trust all members of the SRCA

[tankfly]

I love the customers of SR! We rely on you to stay in business and customer satisfaction should be of utmost importance for vendors. If you guys are ever looking for an honest and friendly cannabis and mdma vendor in Ireland (shipping to EU) then please pay me a visit.

Yours,
Ganjedi

Awesome Ganj
You're just the kind of vendor I'm looking for, will be skipping over to Silk Road to peruse your listings shortly

Incidentally would you be interested in joining the SRCA? We are a customer oriented group of people dedicated to raising and maintaining TRUST on the Silk Road, whatdya say would you consider being a member?

No problem I will be a member.

Awesome.
You are the first official vendor in SRCA

I do not know much about what it's like to buy on SR

That's cool, perhaps part of what SRCA is about is addressing that?
we could design a manifesto that highlights everyone's issues so that the vendors can inform themselves about what concerns us the buyer?

vendor quality control
Finalizing Early
Auto-finalize
Captcha

Scammer vendors/buyers
Law Enforcement
OPSEC




but I know a thing or two about selling obviously and I support your cause!




Customers want honest vendors and vendors need honest customers. I believe like I can trust all members of the SRCA



Great to hear it
If you have any ideas about what the SRCA should be about - don't be a stranger

[The Jigsaw Puzzle]

@ OP

Let me start by telling you.that I do more for the customer then any other vendor..and I completely understand what you are saying.. The problem is that MOST people in the forms are not the real buyers...though some are....and your idea is great...but unfortunately...you can see in your thread already...

TBH I think in the entire time since I've become conscious of the dread round table I have given it no more than 10 seconds thought. It's just not important to me.

If other consumers want to talk about your practices RXKing whether it be on the round table or elsewhere then this is the place to do it. You do not get to dictate whomever talks or whatever they talk about, neither do I for that matter (I just made one important suggestion), let us consumers say our thang.

That the 2 that responded so far did not understand you at all!!!!! They want to know what is being said in the vendor forum!!! And you are trying to say lets start a forum for buyers only....!!!

don't tell me what I'm trying to say, jesus the head on ye, how you get that thing through the door.

To reiterate, what I'm saying is that consumers are getting a RAW DEAL on SR, we need to talk about it.

Let me also say you already have it!!!! All these forums are for you!!!! There would be NO REASON for vendors not too see it....as it would be to read and help make changed for the better. So trust me what you are saying is already there....and for the 2 that replied.....READ WHAT HE MEANT!!!!

Thank you for bringing me around to the central point of this tread "TRUST".

A certain percentage of vendors have willingly and intentionally SCAMMED us the buyer.

It is commonplace for vendors to blackmail and bully the SRConsumer for expressing controvercial views about Silk Road.

Help me help you help your customers RXKing.

I initially thought that your idea had some merit tankfly but I think you need to soften your tone a little. I am just a buyer like you and detest vendors who attempt to pull off a scam and rort buyers. Please, read through some of my posts to see just how passionate I am on the subject. However, RxKing is right when he says that we already have the forum to create a post and air our grievances towards any vendor should we have legitimate complaints relating to a transaction and / or there conduct towards you.
Buyers need to stop blaming everyone else under the sun but themselves and take RESPONSIBILITY for their OWN ACTIONS! I'm so sick of reading through this forum and seeing countless threads and posts from buyers stating how they've been ripped off or scammed by a "trusted vendor" after they FE for them, having done so many times previously without any problems! I mean for fucks sake!!  Are buyers that stupid that they can't comprehend the philosophy behind a scam and how FE is the No.1 reason why so many vendors are able to get away with it!!

It's got nothing to do with consumers getting a "RAW DEAL" from vendors on SR 2.0. SR is just facilitating a path upon which vendors and buyers can conduct business. Vendors are only able to pull off a scam because generally speaking, too many buyers haven't taken the time to educate themselves on how to minimize their risks, operate securely and remain anonymous. There is a hell of a lot to learn if one is to give themself the best opportunity of staying safe. It's not as simple as just downloading Tor and buying Bitcoins as some people may think.
I certainly don't believe it's common place for vendors to blackmail or bully buyers but I do believe that there may be some vendors who will take advantage of an uneducated buyer. Again, it the responsibility of the buyer to ensure they do all they can to prevent that from happening and not rely on others to keep themselves secure.

I like your idea but the devil's in the detail.

[tankfly]

@ OP

Let me start by telling you.that I do more for the customer then any other vendor..and I completely understand what you are saying.. The problem is that MOST people in the forms are not the real buyers...though some are....and your idea is great...but unfortunately...you can see in your thread already...

TBH I think in the entire time since I've become conscious of the dread round table I have given it no more than 10 seconds thought. It's just not important to me.

If other consumers want to talk about your practices RXKing whether it be on the round table or elsewhere then this is the place to do it. You do not get to dictate whomever talks or whatever they talk about, neither do I for that matter (I just made one important suggestion), let us consumers say our thang.

That the 2 that responded so far did not understand you at all!!!!! They want to know what is being said in the vendor forum!!! And you are trying to say lets start a forum for buyers only....!!!

don't tell me what I'm trying to say, jesus the head on ye, how you get that thing through the door.

To reiterate, what I'm saying is that consumers are getting a RAW DEAL on SR, we need to talk about it.

Let me also say you already have it!!!! All these forums are for you!!!! There would be NO REASON for vendors not too see it....as it would be to read and help make changed for the better. So trust me what you are saying is already there....and for the 2 that replied.....READ WHAT HE MEANT!!!!

Thank you for bringing me around to the central point of this tread "TRUST".

A certain percentage of vendors have willingly and intentionally SCAMMED us the buyer.

It is commonplace for vendors to blackmail and bully the SRConsumer for expressing controvercial views about Silk Road.

Help me help you help your customers RXKing.

I initially thought that your idea had some merit tankfly but I think you need to soften your tone a little. I am just a buyer like you and detest vendors who attempt to pull off a scam and rort buyers. Please, read through some of my posts to see just how passionate I am on the subject. However, RxKing is right when he says that we already have the forum to create a post and air our grievances towards any vendor should we have legitimate complaints relating to a transaction and / or there conduct towards you.
Buyers need to stop blaming everyone else under the sun but themselves and take RESPONSIBILITY for their OWN ACTIONS! I'm so sick of reading through this forum and seeing countless threads and posts from buyers stating how they've been ripped off or scammed by a "trusted vendor" after they FE for them, having done so many times previously without any problems! I mean for fucks sake!!  Are buyers that stupid that they can't comprehend the philosophy behind a scam and how FE is the No.1 reason why so many vendors are able to get away with it!!

It's got nothing to do with consumers getting a "RAW DEAL" from vendors on SR 2.0. SR is just facilitating a path upon which vendors and buyers can conduct business. Vendors are only able to pull off a scam because generally speaking, too many buyers haven't taken the time to educate themselves on how to minimize their risks, operate securely and remain anonymous. There is a hell of a lot to learn if one is to give themself the best opportunity of staying safe. It's not as simple as just downloading Tor and buying Bitcoins as some people may think.
I certainly don't believe it's common place for vendors to blackmail or bully buyers but I do believe that there may be some vendors who will take advantage of an uneducated buyer. Again, it the responsibility of the buyer to ensure they do all they can to prevent that from happening and not rely on others to keep themselves secure.

I like your idea but the devil's in the detail.

Thanks, excellent post by the way.
I'm sorry if you think I should quit, but I just can't. I finally believe in something and I'm not going to let it go.
Also I will need to re-read your post a few times before I respond adequately.
So I'll sign off for tonight,
to be continued

[The Jigsaw Puzzle]

@ OP

Let me start by telling you.that I do more for the customer then any other vendor..and I completely understand what you are saying.. The problem is that MOST people in the forms are not the real buyers...though some are....and your idea is great...but unfortunately...you can see in your thread already...

TBH I think in the entire time since I've become conscious of the dread round table I have given it no more than 10 seconds thought. It's just not important to me.

If other consumers want to talk about your practices RXKing whether it be on the round table or elsewhere then this is the place to do it. You do not get to dictate whomever talks or whatever they talk about, neither do I for that matter (I just made one important suggestion), let us consumers say our thang.

That the 2 that responded so far did not understand you at all!!!!! They want to know what is being said in the vendor forum!!! And you are trying to say lets start a forum for buyers only....!!!

don't tell me what I'm trying to say, jesus the head on ye, how you get that thing through the door.

To reiterate, what I'm saying is that consumers are getting a RAW DEAL on SR, we need to talk about it.

Let me also say you already have it!!!! All these forums are for you!!!! There would be NO REASON for vendors not too see it....as it would be to read and help make changed for the better. So trust me what you are saying is already there....and for the 2 that replied.....READ WHAT HE MEANT!!!!

Thank you for bringing me around to the central point of this tread "TRUST".

A certain percentage of vendors have willingly and intentionally SCAMMED us the buyer.

It is commonplace for vendors to blackmail and bully the SRConsumer for expressing controvercial views about Silk Road.

Help me help you help your customers RXKing.

I initially thought that your idea had some merit tankfly but I think you need to soften your tone a little. I am just a buyer like you and detest vendors who attempt to pull off a scam and rort buyers. Please, read through some of my posts to see just how passionate I am on the subject. However, RxKing is right when he says that we already have the forum to create a post and air our grievances towards any vendor should we have legitimate complaints relating to a transaction and / or there conduct towards you.
Buyers need to stop blaming everyone else under the sun but themselves and take RESPONSIBILITY for their OWN ACTIONS! I'm so sick of reading through this forum and seeing countless threads and posts from buyers stating how they've been ripped off or scammed by a "trusted vendor" after they FE for them, having done so many times previously without any problems! I mean for fucks sake!!  Are buyers that stupid that they can't comprehend the philosophy behind a scam and how FE is the No.1 reason why so many vendors are able to get away with it!!

It's got nothing to do with consumers getting a "RAW DEAL" from vendors on SR 2.0. SR is just facilitating a path upon which vendors and buyers can conduct business. Vendors are only able to pull off a scam because generally speaking, too many buyers haven't taken the time to educate themselves on how to minimize their risks, operate securely and remain anonymous. There is a hell of a lot to learn if one is to give themself the best opportunity of staying safe. It's not as simple as just downloading Tor and buying Bitcoins as some people may think.
I certainly don't believe it's common place for vendors to blackmail or bully buyers but I do believe that there may be some vendors who will take advantage of an uneducated buyer. Again, it the responsibility of the buyer to ensure they do all they can to prevent that from happening and not rely on others to keep themselves secure.

I like your idea but the devil's in the detail.

Thanks, excellent post by the way.
I'm sorry if you think I should quit, but I just can't. I finally believe in something and I'm not going to let it go.
Also I will need to re-read your post a few times before I respond adequately.
So I'll sign off for tonight,
to be continued

I certainly don't think you should quit. I never said that. I'm just saying that there could be a place for your association but how it's implemented and what functionality it has are the keys to it's success.

[tankfly]

I initially thought that your idea had some merit tankfly but I think you need to soften your tone a little.

OK, I suppose I can get a bit het-up sometimes

I am just a buyer like you and detest vendors who attempt to pull off a scam and rort buyers. Please, read through some of my posts to see just how passionate I am on the subject.

Cool, could you link some of your posts please?

However, RxKing is right when he says that we already have the forum to create a post and air our grievances towards any vendor should we have legitimate complaints relating to a transaction and / or there conduct towards you.

Of course, but the forums are like a massive chamber full of discordant voices, there is little coherence to it. I feel we need to coordinate the customers' voices into one concise voice governed by the collective voice of the legion of buyers that are the lifeblood of Silk Road.

Buyers need to stop blaming everyone else under the sun but themselves and take RESPONSIBILITY for their OWN ACTIONS!

Sure. Perhaps the customers are venting thus because they feel they have nobody on their side.

I'm so sick of reading through this forum and seeing countless threads and posts from buyers stating how they've been ripped off or scammed by a "trusted vendor" after they FE for them, having done so many times previously without any problems!

A common complaint and arguably one of the BIGGEST issues on the road. On the one side the customer, the other the vendor. Both bear responsibility for the numerous reports of scamming on SR.

I mean for fucks sake!!  Are buyers that stupid that they can't comprehend the philosophy behind a scam and how FE is the No.1 reason why so many vendors are able to get away with it!!

Obviously there are many that come to SR that are not expecting to be ripped-off, they just want to savour the wonder of being able to procure quality substances to your front door.

I'm not the kind of person to call another inexperienced person stupid just 'cause they made an innocent error of judgement, and ascribed too little distrust to a darknet market. But I empathise with the psychology of it - I feel 'there but for the grace of god, go I'.

It's got nothing to do with consumers getting a "RAW DEAL" from vendors on SR 2.0.

Many customers that have been scammed by vendors do feel they have gotten a raw deal.

SR is just facilitating a path upon which vendors and buyers can conduct business.

True, but that path is beset by bandits. Or to put it another way, the system's flaws are being 'gamed' oftentimes by both vendor and buyer.

Vendors are only able to pull off a scam because generally speaking, too many buyers haven't taken the time to educate themselves on how to minimize their risks, operate securely and remain anonymous.

Nail on the head, this flaw, the haste with which newbs dive in to SR without knowing what their doing can be addressed.

There is a hell of a lot to learn if one is to give themself the best opportunity of staying safe. It's not as simple as just downloading Tor and buying Bitcoins as some people may think.

Concur.

I certainly don't believe it's common place for vendors to blackmail or bully buyers but I do believe that there may be some vendors who will take advantage of an uneducated buyer.

Meh, I've come across it, that's one of the reasons I felt compelled to start this thread.
There is definitely a form of subtle coersion pervasive on both the forums and on SR proper where vendors exert pressure on individuals to STFU and do what their told.

For example blacklisting is a common way of threatening SR voices here on this forum. This threat of blacklisting is used by vendors to quell buyer dissent at vendor behaviour.

Again, it the responsibility of the buyer to ensure they do all they can to prevent that from happening and not rely on others to keep themselves secure.

Yes, but many newbs don't have the knowledge or the requisite distrust to transact successfully on SR. Their lack of education DOES NOT justify getting scammed.

I like your idea but the devil's in the detail.

Yes, and the detail's the thing, I get it

[tankfly]

I'm compiling a POLL now, so any last minute contributions about what the SRCA should be about?

[tankfly]

Poll added, vote away gents

[tankfly]

Announcement bump.

[tankfly]

+100

Yeah baby.

[Ganjedi]

I voted for "Lobby for AF". I think this should be in the next SR update.

A buyers' roundtable could be cool but I think this is already satisfied in the Product Offers section.

A customer representative/ multiple representatives could be a good idea if they do many reviews following guidelines such as 1-10 between categories including speed, communication and stealth. This should be answered by determining whether the purchaser got what was advertised (e.g. if shipping is advertised as 5 days and it comes in five days then this is a 10).

Keep up the good work!

[Pillow]

A buyers' roundtable could be cool but I think this is already satisfied in the Product Offers section.



Keep up the good work!

Product Offers is ScamLand lately...
Not exactly a place where (legit and selected) buyers can talk privately and put their efforts together.

[Ganjedi]

This is true. I think if one should exist it should be tightly controlled to deter vendors from setting up fake accounts and posting positive feedback. I think this could be accomplished by only permitting customers who have fulfilled a number of purchases in order to gain access.

[Pillow]

This is true. I think if one should exist it should be tightly controlled to deter vendors from setting up fake accounts and posting positive feedback. I think this could be accomplished by only permitting customers who have fulfilled a number of purchases in order to gain access.

This could be a rule. But what about vendors who buy dozens of 0€ of their items to fake feedback?
This has to change accordingly.

[Ganjedi]

Yes I agree perhaps there needs to be a requirement of minimum spending but then this becomes a project for established users and not beginners who are involved in the majority of scam cases.

[Merde222]

sub
good effort

Until buyers stop putting FE in their feedback then an edit to the feedback is more valuable. Buyer round table? we have the whole forum. Is this just to satisfy the egos of those having access? I spent 10s of coins in here and other market places and I like the cocaine thread more than anything. And open access is great. You make new friends and exchange ideas every day.

[moondog65]

I think some kind of central forum where customers can get reviews of vendors all in one place would be helpfull instead of haveing to scan all the forums let along having to look up every vendor a customer was interested in.

[Hux]

To clarify, the management of SR has made clear access to the vendor roundtable will never be given to non-vendors, nor will a buyer roundtable be created since there will be little point to having one (in the view of the administrators). Although I haven't heard it officially for this matter, I don't think anything where the buyers have influence over the vendors actions (ie limiting FE abilities or sales) will be implemented, but of course you are welcome to challenge it with any suggestions!

[Merde222]

To clarify, the management of SR has made clear access to the vendor roundtable will never be given to non-vendors, nor will a buyer roundtable be created since there will be little point to having one (in the view of the administrators). Although I haven't heard it officially for this matter, I don't think anything where the buyers have influence over the vendors actions (ie limiting FE abilities or sales) will be implemented, but of course you are welcome to challenge it with any suggestions!

We are the ones supporting the vendors. We need to have a bigger say. Not being able to influence any actions isn't good.

[tankfly]

I voted for "Lobby for AF". I think this should be in the next SR update.

A buyers' roundtable could be cool but I think this is already satisfied in the Product Offers section.

A customer representative/ multiple representatives could be a good idea if they do many reviews following guidelines such as 1-10 between categories including speed, communication and stealth. This should be answered by determining whether the purchaser got what was advertised (e.g. if shipping is advertised as 5 days and it comes in five days then this is a 10).

Keep up the good work!

Good idea Ganj, a few sub-headings for reviews is essential: speed, communication, stealth, price, quality.

Also it would be great if the vendor reviews were sorted differently, like by location, product etc.

[tankfly]

A buyers' roundtable could be cool but I think this is already satisfied in the Product Offers section.



Keep up the good work!

Product Offers is ScamLand lately...
Not exactly a place where (legit and selected) buyers can talk privately and put their efforts together.

I don't think Product Offers fulfills the function of a buyers' round table either. What has become evident from the poll is that people want this functionality.

Mostly what I'm picking up is that the buyers' round table should have one key piece of functionality, privacy.

[tankfly]

This is true. I think if one should exist it should be tightly controlled to deter vendors from setting up fake accounts and posting positive feedback. I think this could be accomplished by only permitting customers who have fulfilled a number of purchases in order to gain access.

Not sure I agree.
Perhaps this customer representative could be elected by us?

[tankfly]

sub
good effort

Until buyers stop putting FE in their feedback then an edit to the feedback is more valuable.

True.
What we're really talking about here is SR functionality. At the moment the dev team appear to be designing Silk Road with the seller in mind. The edit function would eliminate many of the scammers because buyers could review their feedback to reflect their experiences.

The feedback function needs a review/edit feature to protect Silk Road customers from the plethora of scammers infesting the place.

Buyer round table? we have the whole forum.

No, that's wrong. The forum offers no privacy for legitimate buyers who wish to discuss what matters to them. We need a private forum.

Is this just to satisfy the egos of those having access?

No it is to satisfy the needs of the Silk Road customer.

I spent 10s of coins in here and other market places and I like the cocaine thread more than anything. And open access is great. You make new friends and exchange ideas every day.

Yes open access is great, to a point, but we the customer need a place where we can talk privately about customer concerns without fear or favour.

[tankfly]

I think some kind of central forum where customers can get reviews of vendors all in one place would be helpfull instead of haveing to scan all the forums let along having to look up every vendor a customer was interested in.

true, it's pretty difficult to find reviews of specific sellers here.

Incidentally if anyone could advise me on HOW to find reviews of sellers, would appreciate it.

[tankfly]

To clarify, the management of SR has made clear access to the vendor roundtable will never be given to non-vendors, nor will a buyer roundtable be created since there will be little point to having one (in the view of the administrators). Although I haven't heard it officially for this matter, I don't think anything where the buyers have influence over the vendors actions (ie limiting FE abilities or sales) will be implemented, but of course you are welcome to challenge it with any suggestions!

Hi Hux,
nice to finally meet you

To clarify, the management of SR has made clear access to the vendor roundtable will never be given to non-vendors,

You misunderstood my OP, I don't want to know what's going on in the round table.

nor will a buyer roundtable be created since there will be little point to having one (in the view of the administrators).

I beg to differ, so does the poll, the VAST majority of voters want a buyers' roundtable and see it as an important point. The administrators should reconsider their poorly thought out position.

Although I haven't heard it officially for this matter, I don't think anything where the buyers have influence over the vendors actions (ie limiting FE abilities or sales) will be implemented

What you are referring to was a suggestion upthread that new vendors should be subject to a certain amount of successfully transacted sales before they can require finalize early. This would limit the scammers on SR and extend buyer protection on SR.

[tankfly]

Hey there fellows: I just encountered a problem with SR.

My balance just went to .01 without me buying anything, anybody no of a fix for this? I figured it would right itself if I tried to make a purchase but no dice, I got a message that my balance was too low for a purchase.

Naturally, I am concerned that my hard earned money seems to have evaporated into Silk Road.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

[Merde222]

Hey there fellows: I just encountered a problem with SR.

My balance just went to .01 without me buying anything, anybody no of a fix for this? I figured it would right itself if I tried to make a purchase but no dice, I got a message that my balance was too low for a purchase.

Naturally, I am concerned that my hard earned money seems to have evaporated into Silk Road.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

Crazy random shit like that happens. Gotta contact support and good luck with that.

1 Q: why leave coin in the SR EVER?! Haven't you learned anything from sheep, TM etc..?

Hope it's not something shady

[AndromedaVendor]

The vendor roundtable is not some secret club so we can all circlejerk and make fun of buyers.

It's a section where vendors communicate with each other (Often) for the betterment of the customer. Shipping policies, protocols, ect.

There is no reason to let the buyer look here.

There is no reason to have a buyer only subforum either. What the heck is the point of that? Just to make the rest of you feel special with your own club? If anything, vendors should be given access to that so they can see how to better serve their customers.

This is a business, not a 3rd grade classroom where everybody has to feel fair.

You pay money you get stuff. You don't cause trouble and it's all good.
Don't Finalize for a month, beg for samples, and try to scam people and you get placed on the buyer blacklist.
It's not that hard.


For the record, the Vendor forum is pretty boring. You're HONESTLY not missing anything important.

[Merde222]

The vendor roundtable is not some secret club so we can all circlejerk and make fun of buyers.

It's a section where vendors communicate with each other (Often) for the betterment of the customer. Shipping policies, protocols, ect.

There is no reason to let the buyer look here.

There is no reason to have a buyer only subforum either. What the heck is the point of that? Just to make the rest of you feel special with your own club? If anything, vendors should be given access to that so they can see how to better serve their customers.

This is a business, not a 3rd grade classroom where everybody has to feel fair.

You pay money you get stuff. You don't cause trouble and it's all good.
Don't Finalize for a month, beg for samples, and try to scam people and you get placed on the buyer blacklist.
It's not that hard.


For the record, the Vendor forum is pretty boring. You're HONESTLY not missing anything important.

Ok. You should've carefully read what's in this thread before you went on with your rant. No buyers want access to the "vendor" round table.

Buyers round table? I don't like the idea but it's open for discussion.

However, it's fair to have some sort of lobbying power as buyers. We fund the whole operation. We appreciate your services but the customer is always right and most compensation values customer satisfaction in almost all professions. bonuses etc.. are mainly based on customer feedback. Here we can't even EDIT  the feedback!! How hard is it to add such a feature.

Never mind that. How about adding: "Do not disclose methods of stealth AND this feedback can't be edited above the feedback?

[tankfly]

Hey there fellows: I just encountered a problem with SR.

My balance just went to .01 without me buying anything, anybody no of a fix for this? I figured it would right itself if I tried to make a purchase but no dice, I got a message that my balance was too low for a purchase.

Naturally, I am concerned that my hard earned money seems to have evaporated into Silk Road.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

Crazy random shit like that happens. Gotta contact support and good luck with that.

1 Q: why leave coin in the SR EVER?! Haven't you learned anything from sheep, TM etc..?

Usually there remains a small balance after every purchase, same happens for everyone, after several purchases this balance is sometimes enough to buy a little something for the weekend.

Sheep rogered me good, lost a lot of money there, I suppose I let my guard down with Silk Road: fuck it I'm tired of every twist and turn in my life being dominated by distrust...it wears me down. I suppose I left a balance in my SR account 'cause I wanted to trust the place. It sucks that I got suckered again.

[tankfly]

The vendor roundtable is not some secret club so we can all circlejerk and make fun of buyers.

Cool, whatev, I'm not interested in it.

It's a section where vendors communicate with each other (Often) for the betterment of the customer. Shipping policies, protocols, ect.

There is no reason to let the buyer look here.

Amen.

There is no reason to have a buyer only subforum either.

The evidence contradicts your opinion. It has been espoused many times on this thread that the customer wants such a private forum.

What the heck is the point of that? Just to make the rest of you feel special with your own club? If anything, vendors should be given access to that so they can see how to better serve their customers.

lol.
The customer is the lifeblood of Silk Road.
We want a private forum, where the SR customer can discuss with other customers matters that concern us and only us.

For the record, the Vendor forum is pretty boring. You're HONESTLY not missing anything important.

For the record, I don't give a fig what goes on at the dread table: other than the arbitrary blacklisting of customers here who espouse dissent with certain vendor behaviours.

[tankfly]

The vendor roundtable is not some secret club so we can all circlejerk and make fun of buyers.

It's a section where vendors communicate with each other (Often) for the betterment of the customer. Shipping policies, protocols, ect.

There is no reason to let the buyer look here.

There is no reason to have a buyer only subforum either. What the heck is the point of that? Just to make the rest of you feel special with your own club? If anything, vendors should be given access to that so they can see how to better serve their customers.

This is a business, not a 3rd grade classroom where everybody has to feel fair.

You pay money you get stuff. You don't cause trouble and it's all good.
Don't Finalize for a month, beg for samples, and try to scam people and you get placed on the buyer blacklist.
It's not that hard.


For the record, the Vendor forum is pretty boring. You're HONESTLY not missing anything important.

However, it's fair to have some sort of lobbying power as buyers. We fund the whole operation.

Yep. "We fund the whole operation". Without us there would be no Silk Road (I know the devs/vendors are an essential component of this triumvirate, but so are we the buyer.

We appreciate your services but the customer is always right and most compensation values customer satisfaction in almost all professions.

Yes, can you honestly say that you have encountered that "customer is always right" attitude here, or Silk Road; 'cause I certainly have not.

Don't get me wrong there are a select few vendors who really do value us in word and deed (for me these people are gold dust), they have distinct value to me, but there is a strong cohort of sellers, who treat us and our needs with contempt.

bonuses etc.. are mainly based on customer feedback. Here we can't even EDIT  the feedback!! How hard is it to add such a feature.

As a developer myself, I can tell you it wouldn't be difficult to implement. The plain and depressing truth of it seems to be that they just don't give a **** about us or what we want. They just want our money.

Never mind that. How about adding: "Do not disclose methods of stealth AND this feedback can't be edited above the feedback?

Meh, not sure about mentioning stealth method is a no no, certain sellers are in favour of it being included in feedback; and I know from personal experience that it helps me choose new vendors (and avoid vendors who implement poor stealth). That said, there is a case to be made against method of stealth being mentioned in feedback ie. it could aid LE in detecting shipments.

Perhaps a 5/5 system might be better. Reserving 5/5 only for the select few who implement ultra-stealth (Mylar, vac-pac, padded envelopes, printed address labels, extra padding). I've only ever encountered that level of stealth once (Trava take a bow) but it was very reassuring.

[Merde222]

Do not disclose stealth methods is already there in the website. the whole point is that they should add feedback can't be edited to it.

[tankfly]

Do not disclose stealth methods is already there in the website. the whole point is that they should add feedback can't be edited to it.

?
Don't really know what you're getting at Merde.

[Merde222]

Do not disclose stealth methods is already there in the website. the whole point is that they should add feedback can't be edited to it.

?
Don't really know what you're getting at Merde.

Oh so you're npt saying that this phrase about stealth doesn't exist. You're just challenging the concept. Ok, is it a bad idea to notify users that the feedback can't be edited? Is it that hard to do?

Did u get ur money back btw?

[tankfly]

Do not disclose stealth methods is already there in the website. the whole point is that they should add feedback can't be edited to it.

?
Don't really know what you're getting at Merde.

Oh so you're npt saying that this phrase about stealth doesn't exist. You're just challenging the concept. Ok, is it a bad idea to notify users that the feedback can't be edited? Is it that hard to do?

Did u get ur money back btw?

Unfortunately no my btc appears to be gone.
Yeah, it wouldn't take much to add a notification that feedback can't be edited.
Just like it wouldn't take much to add an edit/modify feedback for buyers.
Then again, it's obvious there are some staffing shortfalls on SR, and priority will be given to developing security functionality. So I'm willing to cut the devs some slack and sit tight for a while.

[Pillow]

The vendor roundtable is not some secret club so we can all circlejerk and make fun of buyers.

It's a section where vendors communicate with each other (Often) for the betterment of the customer. Shipping policies, protocols, ect.

There is no reason to let the buyer look here.

There is no reason to have a buyer only subforum either. What the heck is the point of that? Just to make the rest of you feel special with your own club? If anything, vendors should be given access to that so they can see how to better serve their customers.

This is a business, not a 3rd grade classroom where everybody has to feel fair.

You pay money you get stuff. You don't cause trouble and it's all good.
Don't Finalize for a month, beg for samples, and try to scam people and you get placed on the buyer blacklist.
It's not that hard.


For the record, the Vendor forum is pretty boring. You're HONESTLY not missing anything important.

Ok. You should've carefully read what's in this thread before you went on with your rant. No buyers want access to the "vendor" round table.

Buyers round table? I don't like the idea but it's open for discussion.

However, it's fair to have some sort of lobbying power as buyers. We fund the whole operation. We appreciate your services but the customer is always right and most compensation values customer satisfaction in almost all professions. bonuses etc.. are mainly based on customer feedback. Here we can't even EDIT  the feedback!! How hard is it to add such a feature.

Never mind that. How about adding: "Do not disclose methods of stealth AND this feedback can't be edited above the feedback?

Well said Merde222.
@Andromeda: if we are not 3rd grade, let's also cut all the crap like "we are a community etc.".
Because if we cannot discuss common interests, how can we be such a community?
And if you don't care about such interests, why don't you post elsewhere?
Do you only care about buyers money, right?
ME AS WELL, I want my money worth, not bitstamp -20 fucking dollars as exchange rate, I want scammers gone from bestsellers and I want to lobby for buyers.

All these scammers on main page is no good. This should be a main concern: if it's not, it means the attacks the site gets, or the fix needed are so huge that the whole place is insecure. 85% of vendors on "bestselling" are scams. This is like hacking SR2 from the inside, having it loosing credibility, every new customer can get burned!
After all the troubles and quarrels "SR2 vs Tormarket", if I was a Tormarket affiliate I would be creating scam-vendors! And that's exactly what's happening!
To make SR2 look like a "full of shit", unreliable market.
Merde!

[tankfly]

The vendor roundtable is not some secret club so we can all circlejerk and make fun of buyers.

It's a section where vendors communicate with each other (Often) for the betterment of the customer. Shipping policies, protocols, ect.

There is no reason to let the buyer look here.

There is no reason to have a buyer only subforum either. What the heck is the point of that? Just to make the rest of you feel special with your own club? If anything, vendors should be given access to that so they can see how to better serve their customers.

This is a business, not a 3rd grade classroom where everybody has to feel fair.

You pay money you get stuff. You don't cause trouble and it's all good.
Don't Finalize for a month, beg for samples, and try to scam people and you get placed on the buyer blacklist.
It's not that hard.


For the record, the Vendor forum is pretty boring. You're HONESTLY not missing anything important.

Ok. You should've carefully read what's in this thread before you went on with your rant. No buyers want access to the "vendor" round table.

Buyers round table? I don't like the idea but it's open for discussion.

However, it's fair to have some sort of lobbying power as buyers. We fund the whole operation. We appreciate your services but the customer is always right and most compensation values customer satisfaction in almost all professions. bonuses etc.. are mainly based on customer feedback. Here we can't even EDIT  the feedback!! How hard is it to add such a feature.

Never mind that. How about adding: "Do not disclose methods of stealth AND this feedback can't be edited above the feedback?

Well said Merde222.
@Andromeda: if we are not 3rd grade, let's also cut all the crap like "we are a community etc.".
Because if we cannot discuss common interest, how can we be such a community?
And if you don't care about such inbterests, why don't you post elsewhere?
Do you only care about buyers money right?
ME AS WELL, I want my money worth, not bitstamp -20 fucking dollars, I want scammers gone from bestsellers and I want to lobby for buyers.

All these scammers on main page is no good. This should be a main concern. it's like if they are hacking SR2 from the inside, every new customer gets burned!

Finally, some burn from a vet - hey Pill, you have my utmost support, we need to incinerate the scammer infestation on Silk Road. Nobody else gives a ****.

[tankfly]

Hey Pill, have you ever considered representing the SRCA yourself?

[tankfly]

Also what about a 5/5 rating structure for shipping stealth. That way you don't expose vendor methods to LE but you maintain a good appraisal of the vendor's stealth level for customers.

What I received this morn was a textbook 5/5, Mylar, robust vac-pac, padded envelope, extra padding, printed address label - just flawless (trava, my go to guy).

[machmao]

Staff are very busy their main priority is what they are already doing. They don't have time to stop the many FE scammers, what they should do is put big notification on marketplace say lots of FE scammers be careful never FE.

This association should put together a list of completely trusted vendors.

[Pillow]

Hey Pill, have you ever considered representing the SRCA yourself?

Thanks, it would be cool!

But please edit your sig (conscensus and such )

A list of trusted vendor is cool, Pandora has the item price after each feedback.
How about seeing Narco'93 or TeamDenmark padded feedback like this?
'5/5 awesome' etc and then, looking right, an infinite list of
'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
That's how they pad their feedback.
Drop the price to 0 and then buy with fake accounts.
They have LOTS of free time.

[Merde222]

Merde indeed Pillow

Who would choose a username "Merde" ?

Answer: Somebody really pissed at SR1 seizure and suddenly discovering there are other markets so he called himself Merde on sheep and bmr.

That sounded narcissistic but nice closure to this vendor's roast by pillow.

Ah; c'est la vie..

[tankfly]

Hey Pill, have you ever considered representing the SRCA yourself?

Thanks, it would be cool!

But please edit your sig (conscensus and such )

lol, conscensus is key

A list of trusted vendor is cool,

Yep, agree. So far I've encountered a few trustworthy vendors. Unfortunately noobs don't know how to verifiy for themselves whether the vendor is legit.

Pandora has the item price after each feedback.

SR has a few ways to spot feedback padding, the 'item' column will have a link to the sale item.

Sometimes, sellers will pad their account profiles by encouraging customers to enter a 'raffle', thanfully a few clicks will usually reveal a few legit previous customers.

How about seeing Narco'93 or TeamDenmark padded feedback like this?
'5/5 awesome' etc and then, looking right, an infinite list of
'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
 'item price 0€'
That's how they pad their feedback.
Drop the price to 0 and then buy with fake accounts.
They have LOTS of free time.

It's kind of pointless really, it's obvious the seller is trying to dupe the consumer.

[twatWaffle]

Man, I just get all wet n squishy when it dawns on me what it is we are engaged in. This is a movement that will go down in the annals, not butt cracks, of our species' advancement.

This age is just as important as say, the Iron age, the Bronze age, the we couldn't give two shits age because WE ARE DINOSAURS ROOOAAR!

As the average buyer becomes empowered, so they in turn empower the people they touch.

Fuck the average buyer, steal their coins by fuckery, and that average customer may just wreak havoc in traffic, at the grocers, at work, all because they got fleeced by a predator.

Stop the predation of good customers. Vendors have a "vested" interest in keeping the herd of customers content.

As a semi rational, semi functional, adult consumer, I get to decide each and every moment I am cognizant, the kind of affect I wish to have on the people I touch, up close n personal or far far far away.

A happy waffler of twats is conducive to the smooth operation of the home front, the professional front, the waterfront....an unhappy, fucked by an anonymous vendor, has far and long reaching consequences for the humans and animals in my immediate vicinity.

Lets keep the customer herds happy, and keep the bitcoins flowing.

[tankfly]

Ladies and Gents of the Silk Road,
never relent in your quest for freedom of expresssion or consumption.
The SR galley has been raided and our btc purloined.
Alas.

[tankfly]

The forums is swelling at the seams:

Most Online Today: 437. Most Online Ever: 437 (Today at 07:47:33 pm)

I'm getting a serious sense of deja-vu...

[tankfly]

Another fine mess

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA512


I am sweating as I write this.

Christmas brought grave news. I cannot adequately express how deeply honored I was by your unconditional support of my staff.

I do not expect the same reaction to today's revelations. This movement is built on integrity, and I feel obligated to be forthright with you.

I held myself to a high standard as your leader, yet now I must utter words all too familiar to this scarred community:

We have been hacked.

Nobody is in danger, no information has been leaked, and server access was never obtained by the attacker.

Our initial investigations indicate that a vendor exploited a recently discovered vulnerability in the Bitcoin protocol known as "transaction malleability" to repeatedly withdraw coins from our system until it was completely empty.

Despite our hardening and pentesting procedures, this attack vector was outside of penetration testing scope due to being rooted in the Bitcoin protocol itself.

This attack hit us at the worst possible time. We were planning on re-launching the new auto-finalize and Dispute Center this past weekend, and our projections of order finalization volume indicated that we would need the community's full balance in hot storage.

In retrospect this was incredibly foolish, and I take full responsibility for this decision.

I have failed you as a leader, and am completely devastated by today's discoveries. I should have taken MtGox and Bitstamp's lead and disabled withdrawals as soon as the malleability issue was reported. I was slow to respond and too skeptical of the possible issue at hand. It is a crushing blow. I cannot find the words to express how deeply I want this movement to be safe from the very threats I just watched materialize during my watch.

I've included transaction logs at the bottom of this message. Review the vendor's dishonest actions and use whatever means you deem necessary to bring this person to justice. More details will emerge as we continue to investigate.

Given the right flavor of influence from our community, we can only hope that he will decide to return the coins with integrity as opposed to hiding like a coward.

It takes the integrity of all of us to push this movement forward. Whoever you are, you still have a chance to act in the interest of helping this community. Keep a percentage, return the rest. Don't walk away with your fellow freedom fighters' coins. DPR2 returned the cold storage. I didn't run with the gold. But two people alone cannot move us forward. It takes an entire community committing to integrity - and though this crushing blow will not stop us, it sure is a testament to how greedy some bastards truly are.

Being a part of this movement might be the most defining thing you do with your entire life.

Don't trade that for greed, comrades.

I will fight here by your side, even the greedy bastards amongst us.

This community has suffered great financial loss over and over again, and I am devastated that it has happened again under my watch.

Hindsight is already suggesting dozens of ways this could have been prevented, but we must march onward.

The only way to reverse a community's greed is through generosity. Our true character is revealed during trying times.

If this financial hardship places you at risk of physical harm, contact me directly and I will do my best to help you with my remaining personal funds.

- ----------------

Now what.

- ----------------

Never again store your escrow bitcoins on a server.

Silk Road will never again be a centralized escrow storage.

This week has shown the collateral damage we can cause by being a huge target and failing in just one unforeseen area.

I am now fully convinced that no hosted escrow service is safe.

If I cannot trust myself to keep a hosted escrow solution safe, I cannot trust anyone.

Multi-signature transactions are the only way this community will be protected long-term.

I am aggressively tasking our devs on building out multi-sig support for commonly-used bitcoin clients. Expect a generous bounty if you have the skill to implement this.

- -----------------

Until then.

- -----------------

1. We will never again allow ourselves to be a single point of failure. We will never again host your Escrow wallets.

2. Vendor registration is closed while we regroup.

3. All listings on Silk Road are now No-Escrow (Finalize-Early) for 1-2 months while we implement multi-signature transactions and lobby for mainstream Bitcoin client multi-sig support.

4. All unshipped orders have been cancelled.

5. Vendors may link to other marketplaces on a trail basis until we launch multi-sig, then we will re-evaluate based on community input. We do not want to be a centralized point of failure, but we also do not want to lead our buyers into dangerous waters.

6. From this point forward DO NOT trust markets with centralized escrow. Use multi-signature transactions whenever possible, with trusted third parties as escrow providers.

Everything will be offline for 24-48 hours to minimize variables as we continue to investigate. The evidence we have below will be expanded based on our findings.

- ------------------

No marketplace is perfect. Expect any centralized market to fail at some point. This is precisely why we must unite in the decision to decentralize.

We are relieved that our security procedures protected user identities, and that no servers were compromised. This was not a worst-case scenario: nobody will be getting arrested from this. Financial loss is terrible, but will not put all of us behind bars.

The details we have on the hacker are below. Stop at nothing to bring this person to your own definition of justice.

Humbled and furious,

Defcon

- ------------------

# Attacker Intel as of 2014-02-13 18:00:00 UTC

We normally do not doxx anyone, and hold user information sacred. But this is an extreme situation affecting our entire community, and all three users who have exploited this vulnerability are very much at risk until they approach us directly to assist with any information.

Do not reveal any details of the attack. This will jeopardize your reward. Contact us directly.

If anyone has purchased or sold to these usernames, expect generous bounties for any information you can contribute which leads to identification.

# Attacker 1: (Responsible for 95% of theft)
Suspected French, responsible for vast majority of the thefts. Used the following six vendor accounts to order from each other, to find and exploit the vulnerability aggressively.

## Usernames used:
narco93
ketama
riccola
germancoke
napolicoke
smokinglife

Transactions listed at bottom of this file. Finding Attacker 1 is top priority.

This is terrible news. A personal blow and a financial one.

[tankfly]

Hola crapola 

Most Online Today: 599. Most Online Ever: 599 (Today at 08:58:20 pm)

Welcome Silk Road customers, fret ye not, all is not lost.

[dark_prophet]

0% will quit drugs, priceless

[Pillow]

From the HUB:
"Next, we have had information that the site was "HACKED" by a specific "VENDOR". Remember Ebook101, the vendor who "hacked" sheep marketplace? Such a statement is an obvious diversion away from the fact that the site has stolen the coins. Enjoy chasing phantoms."
http://thehubaoydxrommh.onion/index.php?topic=612.0

[tankfly]

From the HUB:
"Next, we have had information that the site was "HACKED" by a specific "VENDOR". Remember Ebook101, the vendor who "hacked" sheep marketplace? Such a statement is an obvious diversion away from the fact that the site has stolen the coins. Enjoy chasing phantoms."
http://thehubaoydxrommh.onion/index.php?topic=612.0

What you think Pill, is it true?

[tankfly]

0% will quit drugs, priceless

LOL

[tankfly]

A list of my personal fav vendors:

Ganjedi

trava - http://silkroad5v7dywlc.onion/index.php?topic=25171.0

cornettos -

[jibbils]

A list of my personal fav vendors:

Ganjedi

trava - http://silkroad5v7dywlc.onion/index.php?topic=25171.0

cornettos -

Cornettos is the one! He's still trading on agora but i email him direct: cornetto@lelantos.org

getting a handful of Cali buds soon!

my response to the poll: not using these marketplaces anymore. at least not for a long time.

[Pillow]

From the HUB:
"Next, we have had information that the site was "HACKED" by a specific "VENDOR". Remember Ebook101, the vendor who "hacked" sheep marketplace? Such a statement is an obvious diversion away from the fact that the site has stolen the coins. Enjoy chasing phantoms."
http://thehubaoydxrommh.onion/index.php?topic=612.0

What you think Pill, is it true?

I think defcon is bullshitting us since the beginning.
1 hour opsec before logging in to sr?
I'm surprised he didn't mention any Batcave.

[tankfly]

Hey all,
figured I'd fire this thread up again as I've encountered a few issues as a customer of Silk Road that I'd like to discuss.

1. Volatile wallet balance bug: I've noticed that my wallet balance is fluctuating wildly. Usually the balance will decrease to zero, or a minus number.

2. Customer purchase feedback for transactions has been disabled: this means that SR customers cannot report back on their transaction experience. This is a grave diminution in customer security that needs to be addressed.

[Pillow]

Shop elsewhere my friend, this place smells fishy at least since Valentine day.

[tankfly]

Shop elsewhere my friend, this place smells fishy at least since Valentine day.

I havn't given up yet, maybe it's a case of 'the divil y'know'.

[tankfly]

Another issue has occured to me:

A great deal of SR vendors have received recourse following the robbery. But have any customers received recompense for their emptied wallets?

I, for one, have not.

[Pillow]

On your account page, there's a "escrow money" or something like that, with a question mark after the amount, redirecting to the forums.
Maybe you've already seen it.
They will give back that amount I guess.

[tankfly]

I just concluded my first transaction on SR since the 'heist'.
Btc transfer took an hour!
Will report back after delivery
I wanna believe

[tankfly]

On your account page, there's a "escrow money" or something like that, with a question mark after the amount, redirecting to the forums.
Maybe you've already seen it.
They will give back that amount I guess.

yeh, the pending balance, saw that. Unfortunately my btc balance wasn't restored. I'm cool with waiting for the time being.

[gemma]

This has certainly got me thinking. Firstly a point about the wider dark market community - now more  than ever we should all unite. We already have the perfect community to call home, the hub forum. But that's for another day.

Moving on to the idea of a Silk Road Customer Association. I think this is a very good idea. As customers we represent a majority of members and if on the same wavelength we do command a certain power. Without the customers, what is the market? Now my vision is one of complete co-operation with staff and vendors to ensure complete and utter disclosure from top to bottom.

We have to move away from division of groups and realise that only on the same page can we truly expect to flourish. There are strange times for this market, but from these strange times we may be able to build something that changes the sector for the better.

Clear, simple methods for asking questions, posting feedback and for raising concerns. A system whereby customers may be able to raise awareness to issues that, if caught early on mean they can't develop into something bigger.

As we look into it you could create a sub-forum. Elect representatives for customers and vendors who work to canvas opinion of their respective groups before taking it to staff - thus saving staff time having to sort  through repetitive posts.

It's an idealism but I really thing if people want it enough, we could be involved with something special.

[tankfly]

This has certainly got me thinking. Firstly a point about the wider dark market community - now more  than ever we should all unite. We already have the perfect community to call home, the hub forum. But that's for another day.

Moving on to the idea of a Silk Road Customer Association. I think this is a very good idea. As customers we represent a majority of members and if on the same wavelength we do command a certain power. Without the customers, what is the market? Now my vision is one of complete co-operation with staff and vendors to ensure complete and utter disclosure from top to bottom.

We have to move away from division of groups and realise that only on the same page can we truly expect to flourish. There are strange times for this market, but from these strange times we may be able to build something that changes the sector for the better.

Clear, simple methods for asking questions, posting feedback and for raising concerns. A system whereby customers may be able to raise awareness to issues that, if caught early on mean they can't develop into something bigger.

As we look into it you could create a sub-forum. Elect representatives for customers and vendors who work to canvas opinion of their respective groups before taking it to staff - thus saving staff time having to sort  through repetitive posts.

It's an idealism but I really thing if people want it enough, we could be involved with something special.

Great post Gemma. You sum up how I feel. We need to cohere into something effective. Something that can help resolve the rising tide of scammers that are currently infesting SR.
Your idealism is infectious

[nobodyenduser]

Sounds great but this is captalism not democracy.

Yes in most cases the consumer has the power. Except when the product is drugs.

People don't boycott a drug dealer. Prices go up, we still buy, market loses everyones money, we still buy. The electric bill is overdue and there is no food on the table, we still buy.

[tankfly]

Sounds great but this is captalism not democracy.

Yes in most cases the consumer has the power. Except when the product is drugs.

People don't boycott a drug dealer. Prices go up, we still buy, market loses everyones money, we still buy. The electric bill is overdue and there is no food on the table, we still buy.

That is it.
We buy.
Like a swarm of bees, except without the shared knowledge or group cohesion. The customer is pac-man trapped in a maze.
SR is a million mazes-each generating money,
A million powerless pac-mans herded around like sheep to be fleeced.
There's gotta be a better way.

[underground]

I am off to Evolution, the site works like a dream. Professional coders and best of all FE is FORBIDDEN without permission.

http://k5zq47j6wd3wdvjq.onion/

[tankfly]

I am off to Evolution, the site works like a dream. Professional coders and best of all FE is FORBIDDEN without permission.

http://k5zq47j6wd3wdvjq.onion/

Trust, or lack thereof, is the moral hazard inherent in Silk Road.
I was just scammed by a reputable vendor, it sucks, but I've been with Silk Road from the beginning, so no harm sticking around and excercising extra caution going forward.

Also still waiting for my stolen btc to reappear in my account, nothing so far.
The dude abides.

[SensiJackSilver]

As far as I'm concerned this is a loss.

The nature of drugs makes the weak willed corrupt... and a chain is only as legit as its weakest link.

Think they need to put a disclaimer on the home page saying "GET RIPPED OFF AT YOUR OWN RISK".

If there's one thing I can say with 100% certainty, it is that silk road will NEVER be scam free and it's only going to get worse from here.

You might ask... "why do you still use it then?"

...I can accept that this is not a perfect system (as most expect it to be), I will get ripped off sometimes but 90% of the time I can tell who to stay away from.

[VANQUISH4777]

Use the forbidden A-word market. It is the best place on the net. Far and away. Silk Road is dead. You will be stolen from again.

[pK]

As much as we agree with virtues of market transparency and freedom of information, I can't help but feel this cause is slightly flawed in a logical sense. I'll try to sum them up quickly, and hopefully somebody can counter my thoughts or adjustments to the mission statement can be made.

BUYERS/mods/admins/vendors/developers of the SILK ROAD the Silk Road Customer Association REQUIRES a buyers' round table.

What would be in a buyers round table? Likely reviews of vendors, products, information devoted to safety. What exactly would be the difference between the buyers round table, and the information provided on the stickies for multiple topics, and the rumor mill in which vendors are reviewed and scams illuminated.

***This is a thread dedicated to discussing the formation of an Association that represents the SR customer and ONLY the SR customer.

The problem with representing ONLY the customer, is that distinction cannot be made clearly. Any vendor may also be a customer, or may create a customer account with less than a minute of work and then have full access to the buyer roundtable. When you represent the customer, you represent everybody because everybody is or can become a customer with absolute ease. Whereas being a verified vendor requires time, money and sales.

For the most part SR and this SR discussion forum is run by and for the vendor (round table anyone??) the customer doesn't get a look in. That needs to change.

The Silk Road discussion forum is a free for all, anybody can post and anybody can start threads. The information on the discussion forum tends to be of large significance to the entire community.
The vendor round table exists because it needs to exist, and it's private because it needs to be private. When there is elements of risk involved, information becomes important. The risk breakdown is pretty simple: Customer -> Vendor -> Moderator.

The customers have some information including reviews, multiple open speech discussion threads and marketplace feedback to prevent getting burnt and losing some wealth.
The vendors have customer blacklists and safety information to prevent getting burnt and losing large amounts of wealth and freedom.
The moderators have... some form of communication network which is extremely private and selective, so they can prevent getting burnt and losing their lives.

You won't find a vendor requesting access to the moderator communication network.

// Questions
How would a buyers round table benefit anybody more than the current system?
How would the association actually represent the customer, without represent everybody, given everybody is or can be a customer?
What benefit would it possibly serve to give customers access to round tables and information outside of what they need to keep themselves safe?

// Safety
I feel like your under the impression that you're kept in the dark, whilst evil shadowy figures plot against you. But when you take large risks, as a vendor or a mod, every single person you do business with is a dark shadowy figure and every piece of information they know that they don't exclusively need to know is something that they might try to use against you. A quick read up on InfoSec & OpSec should make it pretty clear why sharing insider information is not a good idea.

// Comment
That said, we wholeheartedly understand that customers are the lifeblood of Silk Road. Good business creates repeat business, and every customer that is scammed by a bent vendor actually takes money out of my pocket as well as yours, because if that customer leaves and is never to return then I've just lost business. If they tell their friends that Silk Road is a waste of time, and is nothing but scammers, then I've just lost business. Legitimate vendors do not like losing business. If this association wishes to represent the customers of Silk Road its focus should be in the distribution and creation of helpful information; Endorsement of honest vendor review threads, safety guides on dealing with technology like Bitcoin and even going as far as to creating or maintaining helpful isolated community sides like The Hub would aid the customer more than breaches in insider information.