Quote from: Tropicbabez1 on August 17, 2012, 12:03 pmi understand that and point taken. but i assure you, that only happend with AA, because id just missed his listing by a few hours , so after messaging him saying that ill happily wait until next time they restock, he replied immediately and told me if i quickly send details and funds thatd he would give me gear from his perso stash 2 help me out. so my order could be squeezed in and shipped out at the end of that day.i didnt join SR to rip off the geniuses who set it up and run it.looking around and hearing from vendors and buyers, ive noticed there is also always gonna be inevitable transactions outside listings between customers and vendors , especially those who have long standing relationships. transactions that in fact can assist that vendor in maintaning their business/stock turnaround/profit, which in turn feeds back into this marvelous SR organization via commision and by drawing in more customers through generous service. as u can see, im only starting up as a buyer, so i take your point and urge others to stick to transactions through listings.Id rather be kicking up a fuss about the fucking scumbag arrogant wannabe heavyweight vendors who ask people to FE with no intention of providing the goods. blatant,' gimme your money, there will be nothing sent, thank you, come again....'.or those who abuse the 50% refund system by mining newbies for their cash.I get you, and far-be-it from me to be the morality police around here or anything, but technically a custom listing should've been set up for the sample rather than an out of escrow transaction. It's only fair.Not entirely sure where you've been looking (perhaps at older threads when OOE was permitted), but transactions out of escrow between vendors and buyers are incredibly rare, mainly due to the fact that if a vendor conducts him/herself in that manner, their selling privileges will be revoked immediately and they'll have to start from scratch with a new vending account with 0 feedback.A long standing relationship between a vendor and buyer doesn't need OOE, as the buyer can simply finalise early after a short time period has elapsed. These systems have all been put in place to protect the buyer after scams etc., they're not just to protect SR's cut of transactions. A vendor who needs OOE to run their business isn't managing their money correctly. SR provides a "cash advance" system, for a small fee, for vendor's who need to restock etc. based on expected payments from recent transactions.I'd advise you (and all newer members) to read the, the Buyer's Guide (http://silkroadvb5piz3r.onion/index.php/silkroad/buyers_guide), the Seller's Guide (http://silkroadvb5piz3r.onion/index.php/silkroad/sellers_guide) AND the wiki (http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/wiki/index.php/Main_Page) in order to familiarise yourselves with the systems in place, and to learn why OOE isn't necessary.If you're a relatively new buyer here then first of all: Welcome! I hope you have a fruitful time here on the Road. :)But being new, you won't have had as much experience with scams and rogue vendors as some of us - the forums are littered with threads where you can read up on these, especially from before OOE transactions were outlawed.As for the "fucking scumbag arrogant wannabe heavyweight vendors who ask people to FE with no intention of providing the goods", FE is not a necessity. If your vendor requires it, you're free to use a different vendor that doesn't. Vendors with less than 35 transactions and who have been on the site for less than a month are actually forbidden from asking for early finalisation, so the system that's been put in place for buyer protection shouldn't be tossed aside, and if it weren't, most of those types of scams could be avoided.FE is not recommended for anybody, regardless of relationship with the vendor.As a testament to how well the system works, I've made 38 transactions so far in the past 10 months, with a value of $8065 - I have 0 refunds, and have yet to fall victim to a scam. You have to pick and choose your vendors based on their reviews in the forums, feedback, communication, and basic gut feeling.It's up to the buyer whether or not they want to finalise early. If they want to do so, against all advice and reason, they're free to once the vendor reaches the necessary level to ask for it. BUT it's the buyer's own fault if they lose money in doing so.Regarding the "50% refund system", you agree to the terms set out by your vendor before you purchase the item from them; this includes agreeing to their refund policy. The SR resolution system is also in place to force a resolution should a satisfactory agreement not be forthcoming.However, FE and OOE transactions are outside the scope of the resolution system, which again is in place to protect the buyer from the scenario mentioned above.(Sorry if this all sounds a bit "aggro", I'm just too tired to put it more eloquently. And now, sleeeeeeep!)- grahamgreene