Silk Road forums
Discussion => Security => Topic started by: legit2quit on August 11, 2011, 06:16 pm
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Hey guys,
been using SR for a bit now and wanted to get some bitcoins i put in out, i was wondering if there were other services for tumbling other than bitlaundry, i noticed that their rates went up from .5% to 10%!!!!! with the .02 bitcoins on top of both i mean i coulda lived with a 5% but 10% damn that is just absurd, thanks in advance to anyone who can help as this was a good service gone greedy!!
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BUMP! I have this question as well. It just went up AGAIN to 12.5%. I know of www.bitcoinlaundry.com (operated by the same guy) which only charges .5% but it seems like it only mixes using a single account. Are there no other legit tumblers still out there?
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@legittoquit-I understand what you're saying. I didn't know they raised their rates that much, which seems like it would, properly, drive away all their business.
Why not go to Mt. Gox, sell all your BTC's, then buy back the same amount a couple days later with the cash? Their charges are only about 0.30%, IIRC, and you're in the mix of the biggest bunch of BTC in the known universe, so you'd have to get back different ones. Or maybe it's so late at night that I'm totally missing something, but I don't quite think so. If you do it, let me know. :)
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Why not go to Mt. Gox, sell all your BTC's, then buy back the same amount a couple days later with the cash? Their charges are only about 0.30%, IIRC, and you're in the mix of the biggest bunch of BTC in the known universe, so you'd have to get back different ones. Or maybe it's so late at night that I'm totally missing something, but I don't quite think so. If you do it, let me know. :)
I was thinking about this same thing. The only problem I can see is mt gox logs. I believe they would show the paper trail back to the SR btc. Maybe this could be obfuscated by using the single hop tumbler before selling, multiple gox accounts, and then maybe using (multiple?) LR to combine funds before re-purchasing from gox? This way you tumble up the source and get back clean coins. Or am I over-complicating this with suspicious looking actions when there is a simpler way to avoid this problem?
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doesnt seem like there are any competitors for these guys and maybe they know it, it says its under new management and is down to 5% and .05 btc but still makes me very wary of using the service under new management just says to me that the reputation that was built by the previous owner is now in the hands of someone who i have no idea is legit or not,
@joeblow thanks for the suggestion but what im trying to do is put an anonymous tumble in between mtgox and my wallet, so it goes SR>tumber>bitcoin wallet>mtgox> anonymous debit card and putting the funds straight to my wallet sounds sketch to me from SR although i hear many people do it i just would rather be the latter and stick to what i feel is safe for me
I got some messages from someone named fable on here who seems to have been here for a bit saying he is currently writing his own tumbler program that he is willing to share to the SR community, but its still in the process of being made, hope tumbler decides to reduce the percentage and that people who did use them should stop for a bit to let him know that it needs to drop,
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Hey guys,
I just wanted to tell you something SR told me directly recently. SR DOES in fact tumble your coins. See I was inquiring about people using multiple BTC addresses on SR accnts and using them to tumble their coins...they told me this is fine but it is redundant b/c they already tumble the coins you withdraw. I remember trying to examine the block chain once upon withdraw and this certainly seems to be true. I'm not saying you should send directly into or out of SR to exchange but apparently the coins are tumbled when they are in the SR system.
Still, if you wanted to you could just create a new address for tumbling and "withdraw" from your main account to that address over an over in small amounts. The new address is all that really matters since that is what will be seen in the block chain.
How great is SR???
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@SilkRoad
Along the same lines of tumbling, is there a central SR wallet address that escrow funds go to, like the early days of Silk Road, or is escrow handled through a database?
I ask because if the escrow funds are transferred to an SR wallet (as opposed to being handled strictly by a database) then no matter how much tumbling you do the bitcoins can always be traced back to an SR address, correct?
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I've used https://www.instawallet.org It's an online wallet service accessible via Tor which requires no signup. Transfers are kinda slow but there are no fees (as of now). I don't know if it actually does coin tumbling, but by sending your coins through instawallet and then on to SR you can claim that someone else controlled the instawallet account.
There are other sites set up specifically to launder Bitcoins (http://xqz3u5drneuzhaeo.onion/users/corydolt/) but I'm not convinced how helpful it is to use them.
For a really good summary of how Bitcoin laundering works -- and doesn't work -- read this article:
http://www-cs-faculty.stanford.edu/~eroberts/cs181/projects/2010-11/DigitalCurrencies/2011/06/02/bitcoin-laundering/index.html
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I have it on good word that this pool is sub 100BTC as well. Useless for vendors. Mike Gogulski getting a bit greedy it seems.
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Why wouldn't going from SR to a computer based wallet via tor (wait 24hours) send to another computer based wallet via tor (wait 24 hours) then send to MT gox account number 1 sell bitcoins then xfer money into mt.gox acct number 2 then to liberty reserve or even dwolla? (Also make sure that all bitcoin transactions are broken up, dont send 100 btc but break into 13 different xfers with different address all the way from SR to MT gox.
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I just went to check out BitLaundry again and I'm not sure what is going on with it. The hidden wiki now points to a .onion site (http://znegstqkxqrdflol.onion/) rather than https://bitlaundry.appspot.com/. They both say "Now under new management" but the fees are different. On the .onion page the fee is .5% and on the old link it is 5%. Either the new owner is moving the site to .onion land or something weird/sketchy is going on. Maybe I'm just paranoid, I'm not going to risk using this service right now though. Just thought I'd point this out.
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do you really need tor instawallet? your ip won't be associated with an the url or bitcoins.
multiple instawallets, never using the same address twice. the urls kept on keepass in a drop box folder. small amounts randomly, never any connection.
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I woudln't put your trust in dropbox!
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/projectfailures/convenience-over-privacy-is-dropbox-watching-you/13706