Hungry Ghost, as the most articulate leftist to critique our ideas so far in this book club, I respect you enough to know that if the wisdom of Pine cannot change your mind, then I don't stand a chance in stepping up to the debate podium. BUT, I would like to hear your thoughts on an article I recently read that really takes the concepts of Marx and other popular socialist authors and pokes holes in them so wide that IMHO really cements free market ideas as superior. The article is an excerpt from Money, Method, and the Market Process by Ludwig von Mises. If Mises cannot cause you to question your beliefs, then I doubt anyone ever will. Link to the article: http://mises.org/daily/2179Forgive me if this isn't entirely relevant to the specific arguments you and pine have been discussing, but as practice for all my future debates, I would appreciate to hear your rebuttal to Mises' critiques of socialism.