Silk Road forums
Discussion => Silk Road discussion => Topic started by: top44 on August 16, 2013, 09:31 pm
-
Lets suppose i am LE.
And lets say you (SR users, SR forum members) download the movie from a torrent site, or even worse, watch the movie in an online place hosts movies... using your clearnet browser...
Don't i have the technology to find out the IP addresses that searched for that movie on google TONIGHT, that downloaded the movie from torrent site TONIGHT, or that watched that movie on the online place.. tonight??
It would be a shame for just watching a movie today , to lead each individual to getting spied from government. I do not think this is a good idea...
Suppose the LE finds out that today, X numbers of IP addresses watched that film, or tried to. That is it. These IP are automatically on the black list, and are connected to being an SR user, or on the very least a member on the forum. You are being watched...
I think, this is a bad idea, with all respect.
-
I have had this exact question myself, however there are also probably loads of other random people just randomly watching it as well.
You can't go track down each of those people.
They can however search your browsing history on the clearnet for links.
-
They're spying on you regardless. Even if they went through all that trouble and harnessed the power of the No Such Agency to zero in on everyone who searched and/or watched the movie.. that proves.. nothing!! Watching a movie isn't a crime, even if it's watching it at the same time as Dread Pirate Roberts.
Prosecutor: Your honor, the defendant watched a movie with the Dread Pirate Roberts on Silk Road movie night, throw the book at him
Judge: :o
-
hm, possibly i did not made my thought very clear.
All this could lead to real surveillance IRL and not in the internet, until the point they go for controlled deliveries
-
Thought the same thing myself. Just today I was thinking "I bet I can get a lot of people's IP addresses just by monitoring the torrent sites when they all download this movie".
-
It doesn't even require anywhere near NSA level attacker. Just requires me to go map the swarm of all the torrent sites hosting this file. Hope no vendors download and watch it and comment on it because I can see if any of the IP addresses I grabbed from a torrent swarm correlate with the known shipping location of a vendor. Certainly hope DPR doesn't download it via a torrent either. I do think this is a serious security risk.
-
Same debate broke out about the V for Vendetta night last year. I just looked at TPB and there are about 250 seeders + leechers, so yeah that is a pretty small swarm if a few hundred Silk Roaders start downloading the movie. Ideally you would have done it already or you have a really trusted VPN.
-
Also noise can be filtered even by me since they have watched two movies now. Maybe there are some other not SR people downloading the movie today as well, but how many of them downloaded movie 1 on the first day and move 2 on the second day? If I monitor the torrent swarms I can gather two crowds now and an intersection attack will reveal the people unique to both, who are almost certainly SR members. At this point I can wait to see if anybody comments on it and then if they are vendors I can try to correlate their shipping location with an IP address.
The same threat risks for book ordering too unfortunately, unless you are buying the books with cash at some mom and pop book store. If you grabbing the books off Amazon don't be surprised when the FBI gets a list of everybody who ordered every book on the list of books to read, it creates a high entropy fingerprint when you match that to the timing of the posted threads and can be used to identify SR users. My biggest concern would be it narrowing DPR's crowd significantly, even if they get 100 people they detect as involved in these events they could consider surveillance on all of them if they suspect DPR is one of them.
-
sorry karma action only allowed once every 72 hours, so i have already given my -1 to the first that made fun of my opinion in this thread..
i do care for the safety of my fellow roaders. I am paranoid over clearnet. So your trolling does not make me feel embarrassed or anything
-
So that means that every store that sells the princess bride is being watched by LE ;D
-
Also noise can be filtered even by me since they have watched two movies now. Maybe there are some other not SR people downloading the movie today as well, but how many of them downloaded movie 1 on the first day and move 2 on the second day? If I monitor the torrent swarms I can gather two crowds now and an intersection attack will reveal the people unique to both, who are almost certainly SR members. At this point I can wait to see if anybody comments on it and then if they are vendors I can try to correlate their shipping location with an IP address.
The churn is so high in this community that if that thread wasn't deleted, you'd see that almost none of the people who commented in it are around anymore. To prove my point, find any random thread from November 2012 and look at the posters.
This is assuming most people leave and don't just reinvent themselves with new accounts every few months.
-
Don't be too mad at colorblack, not many people grasp that intelligence leads to evidence and is bad to give the enemy even if it is not evidence in itself.
-
get out off ur boredom 'OP'
-
So that means that every store that sells the princess bride is being watched by LE ;D
When police analyze photographs trying to find where they were taken, they can take the smallest visual clue and turn it into a precise location. If you take a picture of your ten kilos of coke on a certain set of sheets in your bedroom, don't be surprised when FBI specialists determine who made the sheets, the stores they were sold at and the addresses of 100 people who bought them, and then they identify the make of the camera due to lens artifacts and gather a list of people who bought such camera and then do an intersection attack on the list of sheet buyers and camera buyers looking for a unique suspect to pop out.
You can say oh they watch every store that sells this like it is humorous but would you also say oh they find every store that sells these sheets? I can go capture all IP addresses downloading this torrent right now, torrents make IP addresses getting them public knowledge, and I am sure that if I do this I will gather tons of IP addresses of people on SR who are getting it, and then it is just a matter of using that intelligence to gather some evidence.
-
So that means that every store that sells the princess bride is being watched by LE ;D
When police analyze photographs trying to find where they were taken, they can take the smallest visual clue and turn it into a precise location. If you take a picture of your ten kilos of coke on a certain set of sheets in your bedroom, don't be surprised when FBI specialists determine who made the sheets, the stores they were sold at and the addresses of 100 people who bought them, and then they identify the make of the camera due to lens artifacts and gather a list of people who bought such camera and then do an intersection attack on the list of sheet buyers and camera buyers looking for a unique suspect to pop out.
You can say oh they watch every store that sells this like it is humorous but would you also say oh they find every store that sells these sheets? I can go capture all IP addresses downloading this torrent right now, torrents make IP addresses getting them public knowledge, and I am sure that if I do this I will gather tons of IP addresses of people on SR who are getting it, and then it is just a matter of using that intelligence to gather some evidence.
Dude, are you in Risk Management or something? If not, you should consider it if your current career gets old. I'm not trying to be a cock, either.
-
Buy movies from a pawn shop they are like 2 usd a dvd at the pawn shop close to my house. You would also be helping a local businesses, something to think about.
-
Wait, what drug user does not already have this movie as well as the movie "Waking Life" already downloaded or purchased? Two VERY VERY good movies. I hate to think that we could be living in such a surveillance state like the one that is shown in in ASD within 50 years if something doesn't change....
-
Well I've suggested a porno next film. Me you and DPR can masturbate till our hearts content.
-
I use a VPN for absolutely everything when I'm not using TOR (bought anonymously with bitcoin using another VPN). I'd suggest any who gets nervous thinking thoughts like the OP practic this very basic level of anoymity. Also if you are just a buyer on here, you seriously don't have to worry about them trying to track your IP and do a controlled delivery to you. Seriously.....Vendors have good reason to batten all the hatches...buyers you got some slack...we're not quite in a ultra fascist totalitarian technocracy...yet. They still have to spend all their tech resources seeking out CP, organized crime and large scale dealers.
mm
-
Every time someone says 'If you're a buyer you have nothing to worry about' somewhere in the world some unlucky bastard is being arrested and thrown in jail for using, having, or buying drugs. So let's cut the bullshit.
-
I also agree that much of the SR community seems to lack an understanding of intelligence gathering in general. "There is nothing illegal about <blank>" is the argument I hear all the time. Intelligence gathering is about putting PIECES of things together. Didn't you guys ever do those math problems in school where you have to figure out who is sitting next to who on the ferris wheel? Or played the game Clue? Now think about how challenging those problems might have seemed, and consider the fact that modern technology makes solving those problems about a million times easier, and that people are getting paid big money to solve them. Or consider the fact that if you say nothing, you're saying something.
Stop living in your fantasy land of your activity being hidden in the noise. In reality, unless you've got advanced training in intelligence gathering, you are not hidden, you are just lucky that there are a lot of criminals and far fewer resources to deal with them all.
-
Wait, what drug user does not already have this movie as well as the movie "Waking Life" already downloaded or purchased?
And Requiem for a Dream!
I agree with the poster above that an easy way around this would be to find a DVD copy for a couple bucks and pay in cash. Problem solved.
-
Wait, what drug user does not already have this movie as well as the movie "Waking Life" already downloaded or purchased?
And Requiem for a Dream!
I agree with the poster above that an easy way around this would be to find a DVD copy for a couple bucks and pay in cash. Problem solved.
never would be safe enough but gathering to watch it in something like Second Life would be pretty cool
-
A Second Life hidden service. Now that would be an interesting use of Tor. I have no idea if it would be secure.
Is there any open source software that does the same thing as Second Life?
-
i hope that if you care about anonymity enough to be on SR you're not using the pirate bay...
-
go to the park with a public wifi if you are paranoic :P, watch and enjoy it! Joke apart , they don't have proof of who is watching a movie , so be relax
-
+1 for pornhub/xhamster LMFAO *all of SR finishes at the same time*
Ryno
-
Use a VPN service that doesn't keep logs, like Private Internet Access. No worry download happy
-
I feel like this is a bit of a overly paranoid attempt at scaring someone.
Look, lets be honest here: SR has been around for a long time. LE knows its here. If they wanted a convoluted method of "getting into us" through some random long-stranded pathway of turning a torrent IP into a mass arrest of SR, they'd have done so. I'll believe a fabricated moonlanding over that ludicrous.
That aside, there is one thing I do disagree with on the movie post. Come on people. We are smart here, or at least we pretend to be. Don't go posting a pirate bay URL when you know its no longer run by the pirate bay, and even they have been indicted. If you want to get movie torrents, there are plenty of ways to get into trackers that are hidden and non-public, if you just look for them. There are even regular private trackers, like tehconnection, that simply have membership requirements. This is leagues better than telling someone to go to the run-of-the-mill torrent trackers and set themselves up.
Besides, the courts have been dealing with DMCA trolls. The era of mass-john-doe filings is over, thanks to Prenda et. al.
And if you're truly afraid of these things, its very simple: rent it, buy it, borrow it. It's a movie. What exactly are we getting so worked up over for?
If we are talking about the "tracking of active viewers" type thing, we are not the only group who came up with a movie night - and we are not the only people who like Philip K Dick. We are not the only dissidents, we are not the only delinquent degenerates. If you spend 5min googling through public calendars, you'll find plenty of other A Scanner Darkley viewings. What do you propose they intend on doing about that?
That being said, let's look at another avenue: if they want to watch you, they're going to watch you. They aren't going to do it on a movie night. This is the 21st century. We have digital wiretaps and ISP subpoenas that record constantly. Gone are the days of a stake out waiting for that phone call so you can turn on the magnetic tape.
-
Every time someone says 'If you're a buyer you have nothing to worry about' somewhere in the world some unlucky bastard is being arrested and thrown in jail for using, having, or buying drugs. So let's cut the bullshit.
The NSA,FBI,DEA or whatever agency, will not specifically target non-felony drug crimes..The American prisons are already 40%+ over capacity, didn't you read the speech AG Holder made last week?I agree certain Road travelers have a concern but the majority of us are very safe.