Silk Road forums
Discussion => Security => Topic started by: colorblack on March 22, 2013, 07:35 pm
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How annoying. So, I go to a BOA to make a Bitfloor deposit. You know the drill - Bitfloor gives you a precise deposit amount/account #, and you must deposit exact amount AS CASH and then your bitcoins are in your wallet in 20 minutes. I make a deposit slip and instruct the teller to widthraw X amount form my account, and deposit X amount exactly into this deposit slip as cash. Do not transfer, just widthdraw and deposit. Easy enough? She starts making a transfer and says "can you press accept for the transfer". So I say no, I do NOT want an electronic transfer. I want to take out, then deposit into another account. She starts arguing saying it's the same thing what's the difference. (First of all, it's not the same thing, and even it is, I do not want my account connected to the deposit. Thats the whole point of an anonymous cash deposit!!). She keeps arguing saying it's the same thing. Finally I convince her it's NOT what I want and to please just do as I instruct. Christ!!
Then she starts getting chatty and saying "do you know these people?" "are you sureeee?" "What is this like internet gambling or something?" "is this some internet pyrarmid scam?".
I was getting highly annoyed. What fucking business is it of yours bitch?! I can deposit cash into any account.. I don't have to explain anything to YOU.
Basically she was just being a nosy, fat, chatty bitch. Anyone else ever deal with such nonsense with bank tellers?
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I personally deposit through moneygram at walmart, they seem to be much less nosy on caring about anything at all. But what I suggest to avoid your situation is simply using the ATM outside of your bank(should be free since you have an account there), and then just depositing the cash that way. Still doesn't seem like the most anonymous method, but would certainly avoid the problem you were having. Just calm down and act politely, it raises much less suspicion as well. I have gotten asked what I was doing before, and I simply told them I was an investor moving my funds, seemed to satisfy them nicely.
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Good idea. But can you deposit via ATIM outside precise amounts (as in cash + coins)? Always only deposited cash into my own account. Didn't know you could deposit into someone elses outside with just an account #.
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Some people just don't know when to keep their mouth shut, I had the same sort of nosy question from a bank teller one visit, "What are you doing with bitcoins", was her question. o_O
I told her it was for investment ;)
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Wow! "What are you doing with bitcoins?" That is so outrageous. The answer is "none of your fucking business bitch!".
I wonder since WE get these nosy questions depositing.. I wonder what kinda questions and looks people @ Bitfloor/Bitinstant/BlueSky etc get when they go to withdraw/handle money at the bank
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Good idea. But can you deposit via ATIM outside precise amounts (as in cash + coins)? Always only deposited cash into my own account. Didn't know you could deposit into someone elses outside with just an account #.
You can't. You have to have one of the out-of-state deposit slips (assuming you don't live in NY), so you have to go inside. If they ask, I always just say I'm paying a bill. Only had one lady ask out of 30+ transactions, though. Mostly they don't give a fuck and they're just trying to finish their shift and get home like the rest of us.
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The trick is to be annoying first so they just want to send you out the door ;D
Your dealing with bank tellers, seriously, KEEP IT SIMPLE and SEPARATE!
I have everything nice and clear on paper with the correct money, hand it over like I'm paying any other bill and start droning on about some crap I heard on the telly... and then they are handing me my paper and I'm out the door and don't look back.
:-* :-*
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I suggest taking cash out @ the ATM in advance to avoid this
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^right. Makes the most sense. Because it perplexes them why you'd want to withdraw & deposit as cash as opposed to a straight account-to-account transfer. ATM outside for the cash is the way to go.
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Legit just got pissed at her from reading that.
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There is s policy called 'know your customer'. It has strict rules about opening a account. They'll ask you what your job is, how often your paid, very nosy questions. Google it if you are more interested.
I 100% agree with the OP. No way would I just move money from account to BitFloor, you know that it will be tagged. Obviously it's legal to buy BTC, but the government knows they lose track once it goes into cash or BTC. They record your cash withdrawals, I don't feel they need to know my BTC record too.
I wouldn't be surprised if this anonymous money moving isn't going to end soon. I hope I'm wrong.
The first two times (I've used BitFloor and BOA 3 times) I was a little nervous, and I said I wanted to make a cash deposit to my stockbroker (because BitFloor also is a stockbroker) It was only a couple hundred dollars. A couple of days ago, I went in and wanted to deposit $1000. I didn't mention a stockbroker. Near the end, the guy asks 'Can I get a phone number to put on this transaction?' I hesitated big time, and finally gave him a fake number.
Just give them some fake shit. From now on, I'm going to mention stockbroker.
On the other hand, I know that my BTC will be there when I log on to the internet. That's much better than worrying about a Money Pack or (especially) Western Union.
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That's why I just get my bitcoins off the internet lol
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Maybe I'm just overly paranoid... but I'm thinking it may be bad to always make a withdrawal right before a deposit for btc, made at the same bank.
Like lets say LE is hunting someone; somehow this unknown person's btc are traced back to the exchange, then data from the exchange correlates to same person always making a withdrawal, always right before the deposit, from that same bank. I know this is reaching... but you never know these days.
I know LE has used timing correlations before in indictments. That hacker that stole the Stratford data/emails; if you read his indictment/rolling stone piece, the government talks about how the chat-room user(s) they were after always matched up to when the suspect was home/away from home. They go over examples of this guy leaving his house, coming home, and how it always coincides with sought after screen-names.
Go to ~page 29 (specifically pg 31 item #40) under Jeremy Hammond for previously mentioned screen-name correlation like evidence:
http://gizmodo.com/5890886/read-the-full-lulzsec-indictments-right-here
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Just go by a BofA in a neighboring town next time, and go through the drive through. When you do the deposit, ask politely for some blank out-of-state deposit slips (unless you live in NY). I didn't even ask, and the teller gave me a stack of 50 and a lollipop. Now, my deposits take even less time. I *always* use the drive-through, and I use different bitfloor accounts. I also switch among 3 BofA's. Not that any of those security measures are really necessary; it's just something I do to be cautious.
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Well let's face it. LE and the feds know what I'm guessing 90% of Bitfloor (and similar operations)'s deposits are for. They know, we know, and Bitfloor knows these bitcoins are for purchasing drugs. There's no beating around the bush about that. The issue is they can't prove it due to the anonymous nature of this entire shindig. If you withdrew $152.57, and then deposited $152.57 into their account 10 seconds later.. it's quite obvious it was you who deposited that money. Even if you withdrew a little more then your Bitfloor deposit each time.. with the proper analysis and time correlation they could probably say with 75% probability you made that deposit. I don't think that's really a problem though, because it's not worth the time to try to "launder your own deposit" you know? At the end of the day even the $152.57 simultaneous withdrawl/deposit isn't a crime. You're buying bitcoins. Nothing illegal about that. It's what you do with those bitcoins that violate laws.. but again, can't be proven.
Now, true, you don't want direct transfer to Bitcoin companies tied to your account because that's just an unncessary hassle you might have to deal when (NOTICE I SAY "WHEN", NOT "IF") the feds shut said bitcoin trading company down. It's not an IF. It's a bet-your-ass WHEN. I am willing to bet you all these bitcoin traders are being watched and surveilled at every level from who comes and goes into their offices to the tax returns of the company and whatnot. If you think the DEA/IRS/FBI/ don't have a raging hardon for this entire thing you're living in lala land. One by one they will all have some trouble at some point and you don't want a knock or a call to "chat for a few minutes".. hence, keep your name/credentials away from the bitfloor companies at all costs.
My philosophy is - be discreet (but not super paranoid and take 2 days concealing your own withdrawl only to deposit it anonymously as cash into a bitcoin trading account), be efficient, and enjoy this party while it lasts.. because it won't last forever.
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I'd never withdraw money from my account and in the same transaction with the same teller, deposit it. You're essentially liking your account with your name to those bitcoins. Withdraw from the ATM outside or a seperate bank, and then deposit. Just seems safer.
The teller probably was just trying to be speedy, and thought you didn't know that you could just transfer. I dont think getting agitated at them is the best way, just talk about investing or poker or computer games and they will get bored of listening to you.
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A lot of crazy in this topic.
If you're not buying HUGE amounts of BTC for illegal purposes and they're all ready looking at you then there's nothing to fear. They don't have the time, resources, interest, or even ability to do what some of you seem to think. And this is just getting BTC we're talking about, tying them to buying drugs or anything is another leap.
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I simply told them I was an investor moving my funds, seemed to satisfy them nicely.
...and people say there is no honour among thieves!
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Well let's face it. LE and the feds know what I'm guessing 90% of Bitfloor (and similar operations)'s deposits are for. They know, we know, and Bitfloor knows these bitcoins are for purchasing drugs. There's no beating around the bush about that. The issue is they can't prove it due to the anonymous nature of this entire shindig.
Exactly. To fool yourself into believing otherwise is what they want you to do. Plausible deniability. Also, never answer the door if its the police. Make them break your door down.
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i did a few deposits with bitinstant through Bank of America about a year ago and noticed the same thing. no matter which branch i went to (and i went to a few) they were really nosy, asking me questions that i felt were invasive of my privacy and inappropriate. fortunately i'm really fast on my feet and extremely convincing when it comes to lying (not a skill to be proud of...) so they would drop it quick, but after 3 visits to BofA I decided to never deal with them again.
For reference, I told them I was buying currency. then they asked "why don't you buy the currency from us?" and so i said "its internet currency." when she gave me a funny look i asked if she had ever heard of WoW gold. The strategy here was to make them initially think i was being sketchy but then reveal that the thing they were picking up on was actually embarrassment. They were probably so embarrassed for me that I was buying $500 of WoW gold that they just shut up and did the transaction. Still though. fuck those fat nosy bitches. I hate bank of america.
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I've not had any trouble with nosy tellers and I've used a different teller for each transaction. I can understand her questioning; taking your money out of the account to make the same sort of transfer in order to keep yourself anonymous is sketch and will surely raise eyebrows.
I have my cash ready by time I get to the teller. I tell them I'd like to pay an out of state bill by cash deposit (because they don't have that form lying on the desk and make me wait to ask for it). I then just fill it out, scribble for my signature, and hand them the cash.
They've never asked questions nor been nosy in any respect. The most one of them has asked me was "Is this a company?" to which I responded "Yes". There's nothing at all sketch about the transaction.
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There's no reason to even ask "is this a company?". That question itself is none of their fucking business. It's an account, end of story. I'm not TAKING anything from the Bank, I'm GIVING $ to the Bank. That's all you need to know bitch!
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FWIW i also did a few deposits at Citibank last year and they were much more straight-to-business. no questions no prodding, they just type the shit up and give you your receipt.