Silk Road forums
Discussion => Security => Topic started by: LoveHQ on March 26, 2013, 09:24 am
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Hy dear DPR and SR-Support, -Members,
I read that US-Financial Crimes Enforcement Network steps deeper into the BTC Currency to avoid money laundering, and i know that big amounts went through BTC the last years..
So what i want to know is how they will act bout BTC, and do somebody know which amounts will be suspicious to spend?
I know that the bank-services have to react and contact FCEN if bigger cash amounts went through their system. but how much? and do somebody know a better way to buy BTC anonymously and secure?
Peace People
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It can be assumed they will apply the same limits as with cash, i.e. $10,000 and more.
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Clearnet warning!!
http://www.prisonplanet.com/us-begins-regulating-bitcoin-will-apply-money-laundering-rules-to-virtual-transactions.html
"The WSJ reports that, “the U.S. is applying money-laundering rules to “virtual currencies,” amid growing concern that new forms of cash bought on the Internet are being used to fund illicit activities. The move means that firms that issue or exchange the increasingly popular online cash will now be regulated in a similar manner as traditional money-order providers such as Western Union Co. They would have new bookkeeping requirements and mandatory reporting for transactions of more than $10,000. Moreover, firms that receive legal tender in exchange for online currencies or anyone conducting a transaction on someone else’s behalf would be subject to new scrutiny, said proponents of Internet currencies."
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It can be assumed they will apply the same limits as with cash, i.e. $10,000 and more.
Here in mid-EU also 10.000 € is the limit, but i don´t how or when bank system reacts and get suspicious for money laundering? what is the percentage of the regular cash you earn or handle with?
I mean if you earn about ~30.000 a year with a regular job, how much is the limit you can go over that amount? Like + - 40.000 before they contact FCEN?
thanks for the responses !
Peace n Greets
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So what i want to know is how they will act bout BTC, and do somebody know which amounts will be suspicious to spend?
I know that the bank-services have to react and contact FCEN if bigger cash amounts went through their system. but how much? and do somebody know a better way to buy BTC anonymously and secure?
You can read the report here: http://www.fincen.gov/statutes_regs/guidance/pdf/FIN-2013-G001.pdf
Open the PDF in a VM if you don't trust it.
Also, read through the discussion on the Bitcoin forum: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=154672.msg1639556
Basically, anyone trading more than $1000 worth of BTC a day will be regulated as a money transmitter or money services business (MT/MSB). For suspicious transactions, I think the same rules governing other financial transactions apply here as well. They look for more than just transactions over $10,000. All of those must be reported by law. However, they also look for patterns, but I don't know the details. They probably don't reveal the details on purpose, just as your bank uses secret algorithms to detect fraud and protect your account.
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:) thanks astor for the infos ! you really helped me out !
PEACE
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The FINCEN rules categorize a business who transacts any virtual currency on behalf of a third party as a Money Services Business (MSB) subject to state regulation in 47 states. This FINCEN ruling is applicable to the exchangers and traders like Blue Sky Traders, Bitcopia, Tangible Cryptography. The low fees that were promoted as a benefit of using BTC will now disappear as BTC businesses will have to follow the same regulations as USD cash transfer businesses Western Union, Moneygram, etc. The FINCEN ruling does not affect consumers of BTC, only BTC transfer/exchange business. It basically is saying that just because you transact in a virtual currency, does not exclude you from US regulation of currency transfers. These new regulations for BTC businesses will mean BTC will be more expensive to use in the future as BTC MSB will have to implement expensive AML/KYC regulatory programs, the costs of which will be passed along to the consumer. The recent BTC/USD increase is people buying BTC ahead of the increased costs of regulations that are coming. We see this in many markets, large buyers will buy ahead of impending regulation.
As far as FINCEN checking specific amounts on BTC transfers...this is not how suspicious activity reports work. Everyone knows the $10,000 limit, but what people don't understand is that banks/MSB have a duty to report ANY suspicious activity. If you went into a bank looking like a terrorist and transferred $1 to an account in Pakistan, the bank has the duty to report that. Now the chances that the terrorist will send $1 and the chances the government will care about a $1 transfer are fairly low. But this is used as an illustration of the fact that there is no specific dollar amount for suspicious activity reports. If the bank deems your activity to be suspicious, you will be reported.
Having said all this, I will leave you with one final comment....
I laugh at anyone who gets involved in BTC in order to follow the law.
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This is very easy to sidestep though. Sell your coins for cold hard cash to a private individual for 5% under market. Plow the cash back in to the system through you chosen means. Keep receipts of 'business expenses' to offset your tax liability!
Obviously this only applies to people selling coins.
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It feels so good to get in on the ground floor of a revolution and watch the powers that be attempt to regulate it.
The people will prevail and we have an obligation to each other to keep each other abreast of developments such as this.
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It feels so good to get in on the ground floor of a revolution and watch the powers that be attempt to regulate it.
The people will prevail and we have an obligation to each other to keep each other abreast of developments such as this.
This is how I feel.. I wish I bought more. This reminds of when silver was at $5...
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It feels so good to get in on the ground floor of a revolution and watch the powers that be attempt to regulate it.
The people will prevail and we have an obligation to each other to keep each other abreast of developments such as this.
^^^
Subbing this thread
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subbed.
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It feels so good to get in on the ground floor of a revolution and watch the powers that be attempt to regulate it.
The people will prevail and we have an obligation to each other to keep each other abreast of developments such as this.
It certainly is entertaining to watch and see what ridiculous lengths they go (and will go to) to stop anything that threatens their total control over the people. I can already hear the Fox News & CNN stories now: "Up next, a shocking story on how these bitcoins are used to buy illegal drugs and fund terrorism in Syria."
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Its really awesome how this hole thing works, i still can´t believe what revolution got started some years ago, this is awesome man !
And no continent no state no law enforcement no politic nobody can stop this?!? Pretty awesome, i don´t want to imagine which amount
DPR and his crew have on their account :P , but i think it isn´t any materialistic or financial thing why this all runs, this revolution have a much higher meaning, which i can´t imagine by now.
Somehow could it be that this year will be the beginning of a new world order? Cause somehow i feel like that, its awesome man, DPR you are awesome ! you are a biiiig guru, a revolutioner, a wizard, a master !!!Great work man !
So is there any way law enforcement, especially in europe located states, can force you cause of the coins you transfer?
Thanks People for the enlightening responses :)
Peace
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http://twit.tv/show/security-now/396
Skip to 37 minutes in, this video actually talks about the PDF and goes into more detail. There is an audio version as well if you don't have a fast connection or are going to try to access through TOR.
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http://twit.tv/show/security-now/396
Skip to 37 minutes in, this video actually talks about the PDF and goes into more detail. There is an audio version as well if you don't have a fast connection or are going to try to access through TOR.
THX MAN !! I will slip into it :)
Peace
(sadly english isn´t my native language, but i love to educate :))
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Government just wants their cut, so they're gonna try to keep people from moving money without reporting it for taxes. Worse case people just start buying and selling coin to eachother in an informal exchange, no way in hell their gonna regulate that.