Silk Road forums
Discussion => Drug safety => Topic started by: Dopamin on December 29, 2012, 05:11 pm
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Hey,
I used 5-HTP for postloading after MDMA use. I found out that it still lifts my mood - 6 days after my last MDMA use. I take 2x100 mg, one dose in the morning, one in the afternoon. I was at home for 2 days and stopped taking it, and I had slight mood shift towards the bad side... this is how I found out that it helps me, 100mg and an hour later I was in a very pleasant state of mind again.
My questions are:
Will I build tolerance?
Are 2x100mg per day too much?
What are the long-term risks?
Thanks in advance.
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5-HTP is a precursor for Seratonin. It is a naturally occurring chemical found in many foods such as Meet, Dairy, and fruits. I do not believe 5-HTP tolerance or overdose is likely at any reasonable amount because it is just a precursor and does not have any direct psychoactive effects.
Though your body does convert 5-HTP to Seratonin, it does not necessarily do this immediately upon consumption. This is a regular occurring process that should be happening throughout the day assuming that your body has 5-HTP reserves. Taking supplements to insure this process happens should not have any long term side effects. You are likely filling a gap in your diet if you notice the beneficial effects that you describe.
It can be useful to take 5-HTP supplements after rolling I think mostly because people are often not taking care of their nutrition and likely are not consuming 5-HTP by other means to allow for regeneration of the Seratonin that they just expended during the roll..
If you continue experiencing these issues persistently throughout the week after taking MDMA, you may wish to alter your diet to incorporate more foods with 5-HTP.
Here is a good clearnet article for reference on such foods:
http://www.livestrong.com/article/86266-foods-rich-5htp/
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I use it every day (2-3 per day), 8 years now. It was recommended by an alternative healthcare specialist. It helps a lot.
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aahhhhh, what a relieve! My diet must be a bit shitty then ;) 5-HTP is like a wonder drug for my mood.
hey spirit :)
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A few years ago when I was a little younger and a lot more irresponsible I was getting wasted far too much, mainly on Mephedrone or MDMA, 5-HTP supplements made it possible to sustain this for some time, I do not advise this by any means though and there is a slightly sinister side to prolonged 5-HTP use in my experience..
After a while I found it nearly impossible to sleep without taking it, as the sleep I had when taking the supplements was so deep (with crazy dreams sometimes). After some time I began to notice that although I wasn't experiencing comedowns I also wasn't experiencing any kind of natural high in my daily life, in fact it felt just like being on an anti-depressant I felt completely distant even from myself. I had a long break from the drugs but continued my 5-HTP use for some time, it wasn't until a close friend pointed out that I seemed different somehow that I decided to stop taking it finally.
After a few days I felt alive again, like I'd been away for a long time, I felt connected to my emotions and motivations again. I only ever take it rarely now in favour of eating foods with naturally occurring 5-HTP. Also I learned that actually sometimes the comedown is a valuable part of the drug experience and there for a reason, don't get me wrong, I fucking hate the black hole but it always passes.
At first I was taking 100mg a night, then after a few months 200mg which I pretty much stuck to for a long time, I never seemed to build a tolerance exactly but I did find that my sex-drive lowered over time and that often my highs also became dulled down (it's important not to take it too close to a roll, best to leave a day before HTP free). You are fine, but just wanted to tell you my story in case it helps at all!
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Thanks for the story gloomybear.. That is very interesting.
I have read of many other scientific studies where our artificially concentrated pill-forms of naturally occurring chemicals haven't had the same impact as when consumed through food.
I wonder if 5-HTP is another chemical with that behavior.
Is there a particular type/brand of 5-HTP you were using? There could even be a chance that a specific form of it could cause these effects while others wouldnt I suppose.
I personally have never really noticed much from 5-HTP usage. I sometimes use it right after rolling for a few days if my sleep cycles are wacky.
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I eat very healthy, but I think I just have a natural deficiency of serotonin (and probably dopamine as well).
Hey dopamin :)
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No worries hoobydoobydoo :)
I used a few brands over the 2 years or so I was on it, and there was a difference, one was that some brands gave me slight nausea and others didn't. The other was that some made me need to piss more than others too - strange I know, and maybe just perceived and not real.
Beware of cheap brands online as with everything else, some that I got online made me feel really sick, I bought them because they were about 1/3 of the price of the high street brands. In the UK the best ones I found were Solarray or something like that or ones from a 'health food' store called Holland and Barratt (you have to ask them for them as they are sometimes behind the counter for some reason and they smirk as they reluctantly get them for you - bitches!).
Anyway, like others have said everyone's bodies are slightly different, I just don't like to be hooked on anything and personally this was one of the harder things to give up after prolonged use but it was the personality and slight consciousness change that worried me most..
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I used a few brands over the 2 years or so I was on it, and there was a difference, one was that some brands gave me slight nausea and others didn't. The other was that some made me need to piss more than others too - strange I know, and maybe just perceived and not real.
Beware of cheap brands online as with everything else, some that I got online made me feel really sick, I bought them because they were about 1/3 of the price of the high street brands. In the UK the best ones I found were Solarray or something like that or ones from a 'health food' store called Holland and Barratt (you have to ask them for them as they are sometimes behind the counter for some reason and they smirk as they reluctantly get them for you - bitches!).
Not sure on how it works in the UK but in the US the consumer supplement market is completely unregulated by the FDA outside of bans on specific substances. Several studies in recent years that performed compound analyses on the chemical compositions of supplements often found the manufacturers were incorrectly stating the amounts of the primary marketed ingredient in addition to sometimes adding compounds into the pills which weren't even listed on the labels. It is very likely you were getting different stuff when you bought different brands and this caused real effect rather than just perceived effects.
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After a while I found it nearly impossible to sleep without taking it, as the sleep I had when taking the supplements was so deep (with crazy dreams sometimes).
Melatonin is even more effective at causing crazy, vivid dreams. Sometimes I go straight into dreaming as soon as I fall asleep. I can only take it 1 or 2 nights at a time before that starts happening, and then I have to discontinue use. Melatonin is further down in the serotonin biosynthesis pathway,
http://www.ch.ic.ac.uk/local/projects/s_thipayang/synthesis.gif
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After a while I found it nearly impossible to sleep without taking it, as the sleep I had when taking the supplements was so deep (with crazy dreams sometimes).
Melatonin is even more effective at causing crazy, vivid dreams. Sometimes I go straight into dreaming as soon as I fall asleep. I can only take it 1 or 2 nights at a time before that starts happening, and then I have to discontinue use. Melatonin is further down in the serotonin biosynthesis pathway,
http://www.ch.ic.ac.uk/local/projects/s_thipayang/synthesis.gif
Very interesting diagram, cheers for the link!
Must try Melatonin, I have heard that it can also bring on vivid dreams, do you feel well rested after sleep or exhausted from the dreams?
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for me this uplifting feeling wore off after about 3 weeks of daily use. it did not do anything after that.
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Melatonin, I have heard that it can also bring on vivid dreams, do you feel well rested after sleep or exhausted from the dreams?
If I take it several nights in a row I start to drag during the day. I feel tired and lethargic. That's probably not from the dreams. Maybe from a build up of melatonin that persists in the daytime?
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gloomy, thanks for sharing your experience. I guess I will just stop taking the 5-htp regularly and adjust my diet. I see a point in accepting the black-hole after a roll as part of the game. Chasing the high is something that I definitely do not want in my life, you pay a very big price for that. It's tough to accept that my mood can change to the negative side but fuck it, seems like that is the way it is.
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You're very welcome Dopamin :)
With short/medium term use I'm sure it's fine, and the problems didn't linger too long after stopping eventually except for insomnia (that must have been a good 2 years or so) I just didn't like the way it affected my everyday life (it's like taking it all the time meant that my whole life was geared up just for drug use, which we all go through at times!).
I would see how you go and if you feel bad during a comedown then it's a great remedy and don't hesitate, I now wait and see what I can cope with knowing that if I have a prolonged comedown there is a helping hand available rather than preempting it.
All the best and have a great NYE!
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You are rolling to much.. anything more than 3 times a month for me it too much... i see how some of my friend loose their "power of mind" in a year or two.. not to menction the memory ...