Silk Road forums
Discussion => Shipping => Topic started by: uffats2 on December 06, 2012, 09:04 am
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I have made my first order off of SR from a well known
vendor, only a small 1 g of weed.
It arrived in less then a week (international)
But the package was opened and closed back with sticky tape.
All the same, i peeked in and saw the contents are still there.
Closed it back up wrote "return to sender" now its sitting on my desk.
Is my address now burnd after one purches?
Will it be safe to order from differen country?
Thanks.
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How do you know it was opened?
Tape over the envelope doesn't mean anything, some vendors do that.
The fact that you got the weed is a strong sign that it was not opened.
I had a similar case 2 days ago, I messaged the vendor about a strange looking envelope providing photos but it was nothing to worry about.
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I know because I have asked the vendor, he said he seals with the return address that was cut and taped over.
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Are you from the UK? (I'm assuming you are)
And what country was it mailed from?
And just leave the package on the side, totally, denial works, but not if they catch you toking it :P Maybe in a few days you can pretend you forgot about it, swap the smoke with some random green stuff, and 'remember' about it just before your local bin men arrive, then throw in the trash as they chop it up
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That's certainly odd but I wouldn't worry about it too much (at least if you're in the UK or US) just smoke it and think of it as "getting rid of evidence". Your address shouldn't be compromised, I've had customs seize stuff sometimes over the years but 99% of everything still arrives and I've never had a visit from the police or even a phone call, only customs letters/notices of seizure. A gram is such a small amount I don't think police would give much of a toss seeing as they didn't pay me a visit when customs seized a package containing 56 grams, mind you that was a few years ago.
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1g weed is nothing. It would never b worth chasing. If it arrived, you're all good.
You're house won't be getting raided.
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Yeah, don't even worry about it, just smoke the evidence!
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I have made my first order off of SR from a well known
vendor, only a small 1 g of weed.
It arrived in less then a week (international)
But the package was opened and closed back with sticky tape.
All the same, i peeked in and saw the contents are still there.
Closed it back up wrote "return to sender" now its sitting on my desk.
Is my address now burnd after one purches?
Will it be safe to order from differen country?
Thanks.
Being such as small amount if customs had opening it they would not have just sent it on, they would have confiscated it. If it had been a larger amount they may (and that's a big 'may') replace with an inert substance and do a controlled delivery, for 1 gram though that's never going to happen. To be honest it sounds like the vendor packaged it like that in the first place. Was still good that you took precautions though, not sure if the whole 'return to sender' thing really makes a difference if LE do come knocking but it adds to your plausible deniability I guess.
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I have made my first order off of SR from a well known
vendor, only a small 1 g of weed.
It arrived in less then a week (international)
But the package was opened and closed back with sticky tape.
All the same, i peeked in and saw the contents are still there.
Closed it back up wrote "return to sender" now its sitting on my desk.
Is my address now burnd after one purches?
Will it be safe to order from differen country?
Thanks.
Being such as small amount if customs had opening it they would not have just sent it on, they would have confiscated it. If it had been a larger amount they may (and that's a big 'may') replace with an inert substance and do a controlled delivery, for 1 gram though that's never going to happen. To be honest it sounds like the vendor packaged it like that in the first place. Was still good that you took precautions though, not sure if the whole 'return to sender' thing really makes a difference if LE do come knocking but it adds to your plausible deniability I guess.
?? If it was US customs and they knew about or found 1g of weed in a package, in most cases they will most certainly still send the package lol. Your talking about less then 20 USD worth of a substance. The information that Customs and Border Patrol would learn from your actions following their opening of the package is FAR to valuable for them to throw it away by making you suspicious over 20 USD not arriving(meaning wether or not you actually do return the parcel to sender ect.). Information gathering is the key to building cases, customs WANTS you to think that everything still all good which for such a small amount it most certainly is, but one never knows, they could just be waiting for you to make more consecutive purchases or large ones. New age police no longer try to throw criminals into the slammer as they discover them, they BUILD long lasting cases to throw people away for long terms to deter them from picking up where they left off so quickly.
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I have made my first order off of SR from a well known
vendor, only a small 1 g of weed.
It arrived in less then a week (international)
But the package was opened and closed back with sticky tape.
All the same, i peeked in and saw the contents are still there.
Closed it back up wrote "return to sender" now its sitting on my desk.
Is my address now burnd after one purches?
Will it be safe to order from differen country?
Thanks.
Being such as small amount if customs had opening it they would not have just sent it on, they would have confiscated it. If it had been a larger amount they may (and that's a big 'may') replace with an inert substance and do a controlled delivery, for 1 gram though that's never going to happen. To be honest it sounds like the vendor packaged it like that in the first place. Was still good that you took precautions though, not sure if the whole 'return to sender' thing really makes a difference if LE do come knocking but it adds to your plausible deniability I guess.
?? If it was US customs and they knew about or found 1g of weed in a package, in most cases they will most certainly still send the package lol. Your talking about less then 20 USD worth of a substance. The information that Customs and Border Patrol would learn from your actions following their opening of the package is FAR to valuable for them to throw it away by making you suspicious over 20 USD not arriving(meaning wether or not you actually do return the parcel to sender ect.). Information gathering is the key to building cases, customs WANTS you to think that everything still all good which for such a small amount it most certainly is, but one never knows, they could just be waiting for you to make more consecutive purchases or large ones. New age police no longer try to throw criminals into the slammer as they discover them, they BUILD long lasting cases to throw people away for long terms to deter them from picking up where they left off so quickly.
Great post. I think we get too complacent here sometimes.
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Way too complacent, i feel as if people forget how little resources LE have to work with and how the tactics they use have drastically evolved from busting criminals to creating super cases. "Intercepting" the first package is just the cake they want extra icing.
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WOW so now from not worrying, I'm terrified that if I order again they'll build a case against me!
then how do so many transactions go on just fine?
what to do? different address? it's damn hard to find one.
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WOW so now from not worrying, I'm terrified that if I order again they'll build a case against me!
then how do so many transactions go on just fine?
what to do? different address? it's damn hard to find one.
NEVER use an address after a no show, considered it burned and find a new drop. Don't make it easy for LE, lazy people who keep ordering to an address then get busted only have themselves to blame.
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?? If it was US customs and they knew about or found 1g of weed in a package, in most cases they will most certainly still send the package lol. Your talking about less then 20 USD worth of a substance. The information that Customs and Border Patrol would learn from your actions following their opening of the package is FAR to valuable for them to throw it away by making you suspicious over 20 USD not arriving(meaning wether or not you actually do return the parcel to sender ect.). Information gathering is the key to building cases, customs WANTS you to think that everything still all good which for such a small amount it most certainly is, but one never knows, they could just be waiting for you to make more consecutive purchases or large ones. New age police no longer try to throw criminals into the slammer as they discover them, they BUILD long lasting cases to throw people away for long terms to deter them from picking up where they left off so quickly.
While it's possible that a dirty customs agent saw the contents and let it pass through, there is no way a legit agent would allow real narcotics to be delivered. They just can't do that. It's illegal for them to do it and they can be prosecuted for it.
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WOW so now from not worrying, I'm terrified that if I order again they'll build a case against me!
then how do so many transactions go on just fine?
what to do? different address? it's damn hard to find one.
Don't be terrified just be smart. DEFINATLY dont use the same address or name. There for if they were investigating they have nothing, its now being sent to a new location with new name. From what im learning in school, the fact that the parcel was still sent means they did find the drugs yes(or someone stole, unlikely but happens) but the amount was not worth wasting what little resources they have to go after you. I can remember if you mentioned an amount but if it was personal use then your more then likely ok.
Sending an empty package is a common when A.) it was the first time an illegal substance was sent to an address and found and B.) if the amount was miniscule and for personal use. Its there way of saying "Hey we know what the fuks going on, knock it off before we make you"
Again this is just COMMON not 100% it all depends on certain circumstances.
Either way just be cool and smart.
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While it's possible that a dirty customs agent saw the contents and let it pass through, there is no way a legit agent would allow real narcotics to be delivered. They just can't do that. It's illegal for them to do it and they can be prosecuted for it.
I don't know how many addresses most folks on SR have at their disposal. I have this one and that's it, so I can't really afford to take a "better safe than sorry" approach when something ambiguous happens. If I were playing it BSTS, I wouldn't be here.
My understanding is that legit LE can't provide you with controlled substances. For example, LE can't impersonate a vendor and then sell small quantities of (real) contraband to build rep before making some big deals and bigger busts. Could they, OTOH, let a small amount go through that was sent by someone else? That I'm not sure about.
If you do continue to use the address for SR purposes, stick to personal use amounts ONLY. Don't give them the bigger fish, if this was the bait. I mean, if they show and you have The Talk (I don't know, officer, I guess someone has it out for me) you can deny everything previous - they let the proof go, after all - and consider the address burnt, then. But do not do not do not go ordering a half kilo of mj or the like. So maybe consider this address "limited burnt" if you will, unless you, too, have a bunch of alternate addresses at the ready.
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?? If it was US customs and they knew about or found 1g of weed in a package, in most cases they will most certainly still send the package lol. Your talking about less then 20 USD worth of a substance. The information that Customs and Border Patrol would learn from your actions following their opening of the package is FAR to valuable for them to throw it away by making you suspicious over 20 USD not arriving(meaning wether or not you actually do return the parcel to sender ect.). Information gathering is the key to building cases, customs WANTS you to think that everything still all good which for such a small amount it most certainly is, but one never knows, they could just be waiting for you to make more consecutive purchases or large ones. New age police no longer try to throw criminals into the slammer as they discover them, they BUILD long lasting cases to throw people away for long terms to deter them from picking up where they left off so quickly.
While it's possible that a dirty customs agent saw the contents and let it pass through, there is no way a legit agent would allow real narcotics to be delivered. They just can't do that. It's illegal for them to do it and they can be prosecuted for it.
Im not trying to butt heads with you but your giving people false information. Please only give information like such if you actually KNOW what your talking about and not just going by what T.V. or grade school taught you.
"The technique of controlled delivery is used when a consignment of illicit drugs is detected and allowed to go forward under the control and surveillance of law enforcement officers in order to secure evidence against the organizers of such illicit drug traffic."
(Taken right out the book)
I can list EXAMPLES FOR DAYYYYSSSSS but here is one,
Federal agents are on the hunt for more than 1,700 pounds of marijuana that disappeared during a controlled drug delivery from Memphis to Kentucky.
Members of the Interstate Interdiction Unit pulled over a tractor trailer on Feb. 10 that contained 1,700 pounds of marijuana, according to a Memphis Police Department travel memo obtained under Tennessee's public records law.
Drug Enforcement Administration officials asked that the load be delivered to its destination in Louisville while officers trailed the shipment. MPD officers and two Shelby County sheriff's deputies accompanied the load, according to the memo.
Things went awry in the Bluegrass State.
According to law enforcement officials with knowledge of the delivery, officials watched the tractor trailer travel to its intended destination. Soon after, several vehicles pulled up, left and then came back. They stayed several hours and then left. When officials later checked the tractor trailer, the drugs were gone.
"DEA is conducting an investigation into drug trafficking, and I can't comment any further than that," said Keith Brown, resident agent-in-charge of the Memphis DEA office.
This is just a funny example, but its a simple as calling your lawyer and asking, he will tell you what they can and cannot do and they most definatly CAN(especially just 1g lol) still send you a shipment of drugs IF it is in the greatest benefit of the building information for a case, Especially security information for police safety when the actual raid goes down. ^^ This is able to happen because LE weren't the ones initially sending the package just like we were discussing about its not customs sending the package, they ALLOW it to go forward.
Again i am not trying to but heads but giving false information to a already scared person is wrong.
I've sat in on many trials where DEA and Customs Agents did exactly what we are discussing.
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While it's possible that a dirty customs agent saw the contents and let it pass through, there is no way a legit agent would allow real narcotics to be delivered. They just can't do that. It's illegal for them to do it and they can be prosecuted for it.
I don't know how many addresses most folks on SR have at their disposal. I have this one and that's it, so I can't really afford to take a "better safe than sorry" approach when something ambiguous happens. If I were playing it BSTS, I wouldn't be here.
My understanding is that legit LE can't provide you with controlled substances. For example, LE can't impersonate a vendor and then sell small quantities of (real) contraband to build rep before making some big deals and bigger busts. Could they, OTOH, let a small amount go through that was sent by someone else? That I'm not sure about.
If you do continue to use the address for SR purposes, stick to personal use amounts ONLY. Don't give them the bigger fish, if this was the bait. I mean, if they show and you have The Talk (I don't know, officer, I guess someone has it out for me) you can deny everything previous - they let the proof go, after all - and consider the address burnt, then. But do not do not do not go ordering a half kilo of mj or the like. So maybe consider this address "limited burnt" if you will, unless you, too, have a bunch of alternate addresses at the ready.
You are somewhat right and somewhat wrong on the statement about LE being able to make vendor accounts ESPECIALLY HERE ON SILK ROAD.
This MAY be constituted as entrapment but then again lets take another look and America's legal version of entrapment.
In criminal law, entrapment is conduct by a law enforcement agent inducing a person to commit an offense that the person would otherwise have been unlikely to commit.[1] In many jurisdictions, entrapment is a possible defense against criminal liability. However, there is no entrapment where a person is ready and willing to break the law and the government agents merely provide what appears to be a favorable opportunity for the person to commit the crime. For example, it is not entrapment for a government agent to pretend to be someone else and to offer, either directly or through an informant or other decoy, to engage in an unlawful transaction with the person (see sting operation). So, a person would not be a victim of entrapment if the person was ready, willing and able to commit the crime charged in the indictment whenever opportunity was afforded, and that government officers or their agents did no more than offer an opportunity.
On the other hand, if the evidence leaves a reasonable doubt whether the person had any intent to commit the crime had it not been for inducement or persuasion on the part of some government officer or agent, then the person is not guilty. For example, if a defendant had purchased illegal drugs from an undercover officer, he may be found not guilty if it is determined that the officer initiated the transaction or aggressively pressed the accused to complete it.
Entrapment holds if all three conditions are fulfilled:
The idea for committing the crime came from the government agents and not from the person accused of the crime.
Government agents then persuaded or talked the person into committing the crime. Simply giving someone the opportunity to commit a crime is not the same as persuading them to commit that crime.
The person was not ready and willing to commit the crime before interaction with the government agents.
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You are somewhat right and somewhat wrong on the statement about LE being able to make vendor accounts ESPECIALLY HERE ON SILK ROAD.
This MAY be constituted as entrapment but then again lets take another look and America's legal version of entrapment.
The issue is NOT entrapment. First off, the limits and legitimacy of entrapment varies wildly by jurisdiction. Second, a good case could be made that by browsing and ordering off SR, a vendor is not inducing sales to the extent that law-abiding citizens are tempted beyond what the criminal law is intended to punish. Third, vendors don't have to deliver actual contraband. The sale of baking soda, advertised as cocaine, is still intent to purchase/sell cocaine.
What we are talking about here is the ability of LE to observe contraband in transit and NEITHER confiscate it nor arrange for a controlled delivery where it can be assured (barring fuckups) that the contraband will be recovered and not used to the detriment of God and the USA. That is the question.
I DO have concerns about LE posing as vendors (see question elsewhere) but the moment I get verifiable, real contraband from a vendor, I am 100% certain that they are not LE. That is not how LE are permitted to play the game, at least where I am.
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You are somewhat right and somewhat wrong on the statement about LE being able to make vendor accounts ESPECIALLY HERE ON SILK ROAD.
This MAY be constituted as entrapment but then again lets take another look and America's legal version of entrapment.
The issue is NOT entrapment. First off, the limits and legitimacy of entrapment varies wildly by jurisdiction. Second, a good case could be made that by browsing and ordering off SR, a vendor is not inducing sales to the extent that law-abiding citizens are tempted beyond what the criminal law is intended to punish. Third, vendors don't have to deliver actual contraband. The sale of baking soda, advertised as cocaine, is still intent to purchase/sell cocaine.
What we are talking about here is the ability of LE to observe contraband in transit and NEITHER confiscate it nor arrange for a controlled delivery where it can be assured (barring fuckups) that the contraband will be recovered and not used to the detriment of God and the USA. That is the question.
I DO have concerns about LE posing as vendors (see question elsewhere) but the moment I get verifiable, real contraband from a vendor, I am 100% certain that they are not LE. That is not how LE are permitted to play the game, at least where I am.
We are both on the same page? My response was to your statement about not knowing if LE can make vendor accounts and here in U.S.A they can, like the definition i posted states, its not necissarily the LE selling you the contraband. Here is a section of my copy and paste again, "For example, it is not entrapment for a government agent to pretend to be someone else and to offer, either directly or through an informant or other decoy, to engage in an unlawful transaction with the person (see sting operation)" The key word here being informant or decoy. It is against the law for the officer himself to sell someone REAL contraband it is an entirely different story if they use Narcs. "Narcs are allowed to buy, sell and do drugs of every kind"(right out the book) Ask your lawyer if you think what I am saying is false, the fact is im majoring in CJ and am not simply making up what I am talking about.
UC's(Under covers) can do a lot if they needed to but actually selling an illegal substances is not one of them. Now, if you are talking about CI's, that's a different story. UC's are sworn officers pretending to be someone else to investigate a case. CI's are not technically employees, but someone working with the department to supply information, and they are not bound by the rules that we are.
"What we are talking about here is the ability of LE to observe contraband in transit and NEITHER confiscate it nor arrange for a controlled delivery where it can be assured (barring fuckups) that the contraband will be recovered and not used to the detriment of God and the USA. That is the question. "
I know this is the question and I have answered it, they most certainly CAN, confiscation and controlled deliveries are by no means the only and especially not the FIRST action taken. In major cases to them, it is common practice to ALLOW the package to continue on and then to observe the target address after the package has been delivered, the purpose of this is to gain intelligence, mostly for safety and security of the officers to perform the raid in the near future.( Such as, determining exit locations of the property, habits and behavior of the target, wether or not the package is handed off to another person or not)
This exact situation just happened to a friend of mine not even a month ago for catching multiple LBs of marijuana threw the mail. RIGHT IN THE POLICE REPORT IT STATES. 3 month long investigation "House has been known for receiving multiple pounds of marijuana in the recent months" " Officer ******** ***** on the day of November **, 20** did observe the delivery of what was in excess of 7 pounds of marijuana, to the address of --------------------. At 3:0*pm (some hour later) A blonde male driving so and so vehicle was observed pulling up to the residence, approaching the stoop and took possession of the target package."
The officers then followed him for 8 minutes and conducted the traffic stop.
They had been watching him for months, who he sold too how he picked up the package and the most likely locations he was stashing money/drugs. From these observations police were able to determine that the SAFEST time to finally make the bust was between the time he picked the package up and before he got to his next destination. All this was because he would have the packages sent to unknowing friends houses were he would wait for the mailman to drop it off then quickly grab it before the home owners knew, if they did find out, there were friends so could be easily brought into the drug ring or bribed.
CUSTOMS IS 100% ALLOWED TO ALLOW<<<<<<(NOT ENGAGE IN) THE CONTINUANCE OF A PACKAGE CONTAINING CONTRABAND TO REACH ITS TARGETED DESTINATION IF IT IS FOR THE SOLE PURPOSE OF GATHERING INFORMATION FOR A POSSIBLE CASE AND THE UTMOST SAFETY OF THE OFFICERS INVOLVED. A controlled delivery does not ONLY mean that right when the package is delivered they take you down at that exact time.
Im not saying by any means that this is what they do all the time as it is a huge waste of resources but it is able to be done.
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I read you now. There had been some discussion in the forums of compromised vendors, but can't find it now, where there was a suggestion that if a vendor experiences ANY downtime they should be treated as new and untested. But like a lot of best practices I'm not sure they actually get implemented here on the Road. I was thinking of UCs as vendors, but of course, it makes more sense to compromise a real vendor and have even more flex in terms of what they can do.
That's very interesting about monitoring large mj shipments. Though losing a major drop (your earlier excerpt) is pretty damn funny.
Sobering, though, in that you can never be completely sure post-delivery that you're in the clear.
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I read you now. There had been some discussion in the forums of compromised vendors, but can't find it now, where there was a suggestion that if a vendor experiences ANY downtime they should be treated as new and untested. But like a lot of best practices I'm not sure they actually get implemented here on the Road. I was thinking of UCs as vendors, but of course, it makes more sense to compromise a real vendor and have even more flex in terms of what they can do.
That's very interesting about monitoring large mj shipments. Though losing a major drop (your earlier excerpt) is pretty damn funny.
Sobering, though, in that you can never be completely sure post-delivery that you're in the clear.
Your absolutely correct, i think i know the post you speak of, althought it is possible I myself don't consider it non-feasible, only for one reason, it is extremely wasteful and illogical to continuously bust the users and abusers of major drug king pins through a almost-completely anonymous platform. Busting the users will only get them a username on SR that they can easily already just look the listing up, this gets them no closer to any bigger case but you can be damn certain that cops are constantly ordering off this website hoping to catch prints and leads but either way if vendors are ontop of there game then keep taking that LE money baby lol just constantly switch priority boxes never use the same one in a week.
Either way with how smart you seem i doubt you'll ever run into trouble.
Long live the road this site is the only way drugs should be legalized in my opinion, this anonymous mailing approach is so insanely logical for government to think otherwise is simply only egotistical ignorance and arrogance.