Silk Road forums
Discussion => Silk Road discussion => Topic started by: hchoman on August 17, 2013, 08:46 pm
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Ok to start I have had 36 total transactions on SR, and all have come to either one of my drops with no problems whatsoever (knock on wood). Well I received #37 in the mail today. It was a letter with some blotters in it, stealth was good and I got what I ordered in a timely fashion. The problem was one of the numbers in the address was wrong! I have a notepad file saved for my address that I just copy and paste into the PGP clipboard to encrypt and have never had a problem before. Luckily I live in a smaller town so the letter was delivered. So I guess I just wondered if this warrants a 4/5 feedback or should I just leave 5/5? I thought all vendors used copy/paste too...any advice would be appreciated? I mean come on we are buying and selling illegal drugs and shipping them through the USPS, mistakes in my book are unacceptable.
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This is a peculiar situation. I don't know so I'll just bump the thread for you.
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I'd say give them a 5/5
but make sure you send them a message explaining what happened.
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I'd say give them a 5/5
but make sure you send them a message explaining what happened.
i agree with that. the most important part is discussing with vendor though.
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agree^^ ....good thing it came thru but def. tell the vendor, hopefully it doesnt happen again
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It's worth mentioning to the vendor in a private message for sure, but I would still give it a 5/5.
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I personally believe 5/5 should mean exactly that.. 5/5. This however, IMO is not to be considered perfection which 5/5 should represent. By a stroke of luck, it did not get in the wrong hands. You shouldn't give 5/5 due to luck in your favor, just as you wouldn't give him a 5/5 if your neighbor ended up actually getting your package. Either way you should still communicate this dissatisfaction and your reasoning behind your decision with the vendor.
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I personally believe 5/5 should mean exactly that.. 5/5. This however, IMO is not to be considered perfection which 5/5 should represent. By a stroke of luck, it did not get in the wrong hands. You shouldn't give 5/5 due to luck in your favor, just as you wouldn't give him a 5/5 if your neighbor ended up actually getting your package. Either way you should still communicate this dissatisfaction and your reasoning behind your decision with the vendor.
Very good point. Additionally, DPR said with the new rating scale, buyers aren't as pressured to leave a 5/5 all the time because it doesn't affect the vendor's feedback how it used to.
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I'd give a 4/5. 5/5 means absolute perfection, if your order was anything less than perfection people need to know!
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Was the address on the package handwritten? It would be weird for a vendor to get it wrong if it's merely copied and pasted into a label making program. Are you sure you didn't type this address in instead of copy and pasting from notepad as you say?
Anyway, 5/5 doesn't equate to perfection. Perfection is relative.
As a buyer, I leave a 5/5 unless I want to burn a bridge. Problem with burning bridges on an anonymous market is that you don't know exactly who you're burning a bridge with. Some vendors are friends, partners, affiliates, secondary or tertiary accounts, groups, cartels, etc. etc.
Advice: Don't leave feedback yet. Talk with the vendor and see what they have to say about it. You never know how they can respond. It could be favorable and they might want to "make it up to you." Always... always talk with a vendor first. If they act like a dick, hey, then it's your call what you leave. But feel it out first. You have a number of options. If they don't respond, you can comment about it in the feedback, yet leave a 5/5. The comment is more important than the points. The impact of the feedback points will eventually lose their "power." But the words in your comment will remain for a while and are a better way to communicate to other buyers.
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Ok to start I have had 36 total transactions on SR, and all have come to either one of my drops with no problems whatsoever (knock on wood). Well I received #37 in the mail today. It was a letter with some blotters in it, stealth was good and I got what I ordered in a timely fashion. The problem was one of the numbers in the address was wrong! I have a notepad file saved for my address that I just copy and paste into the PGP clipboard to encrypt and have never had a problem before. Luckily I live in a smaller town so the letter was delivered. So I guess I just wondered if this warrants a 4/5 feedback or should I just leave 5/5? I thought all vendors used copy/paste too...any advice would be appreciated? I mean come on we are buying and selling illegal drugs and shipping them through the USPS, mistakes in my book are unacceptable.
I'd definitely message them, but also give a 4/5 and explain, very clearly, in the feedback why. I would definitely want to know if someone was fucking up addresses. Maybe it's happened before but other people gave a 5/5 out of some sense of obligation and never mentioned it.
Feedback is to help other buyers make an informed decision and I'd say that's the kind of information people are looking for. If the seller wants to do damage control later, he can address it on his profile.
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4/5 is definitely reasonable. i would be pissed if the vendor was that careless to not get the address right. i go over the address 5-6 times before i encrypt it, vendor should do the same before he sends something out. hell give him a 3/5 bet you he won't carelessly address a letter again.
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I agree with the others...It should warrent a 5/5 because you did recieve your package and you got it in a timely fashion. Its just one of those 'Fuck, that was lucky' situations...Just tell the vendor so he is aware of the issue and enjoy your order :)
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The comment is more important than the points. The impact of the feedback points will eventually lose their "power." But the words in your comment will remain for a while and are a better way to communicate to other buyers.
??? The points are what goes towards the vendor's rating. A lot of people skim over the numbers and don't read the description. They might miss the very important fact that this vendor has incorrectly addressed a package with illegal drugs in it. I understand it is the fault of the potential buyer who did not read the comment for not reading it. However, the vendor still fucked up.
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I would probably go with the 4/5 because that error could result in some bad things going down. Luckily you got the delivery, but what if you used your real name, and it got delivered to a neighbor? My neighbors would just bring me my mail, but not everyone has the same moral fiber, and would open it to see what is inside. That could be a bad time.
I would certainly message the vendor to let them know that I was in fact leaving a 4/5, and the reason why including the scenarios that an error like that could have brought.
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Did you message the vendor? What did he say?
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Ask for a shipping refund after explaining what happened.
If he doesn't give him a 1/5. Burn all your bridges, make war, not love...burn all your doobies, too, then you will have a hella time getting back to the other side of the weed bridge.
All jokes aside, ask him to send you a picture of his dick, erect, restrained only by a thin pair of briefs, under a twitter account, "Carlos Danger" and chalk it up to the game. Also tell him that he has your vote once the refund on shipping is made.
DANGA!......DANGA!
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The comment is more important than the points. The impact of the feedback points will eventually lose their "power." But the words in your comment will remain for a while and are a better way to communicate to other buyers.
??? The points are what goes towards the vendor's rating. A lot of people skim over the numbers and don't read the description. They might miss the very important fact that this vendor has incorrectly addressed a package with illegal drugs in it. I understand it is the fault of the potential buyer who did not read the comment for not reading it. However, the vendor still fucked up.
Indeed the points do go towards a vendor's rating but they are factored/averaged out over time. So while it has immediate impact (which would right piss a vendor off if you didn't contact them first and likely get you blacklisted), it loses its impact. Hence why the comment should be considered more important than the feedback point left.
Hypothetical example;
Vendor 1 - has a 4.5/5 rating but for the past 3 months nothing but 5/5s and positive comments. They had a rough start months ago that got them a few 1/5s from a mix of buyer feedback blackmails, errors, newbs not understanding how the feedback system works.
Vendor 2 - has a 4.9/5 rating but has scattered 4/5s amongst 5/5 with comments ranging from nitpicky newbs, a few anomalous but arguably serious concerns, bad communications, to being shorted some weight or quantity. And these comments having either a 4/5 or 5/5 attached next to them.
Do you see what I mean here? Many would automatically choose vendor #2 simply because of the overall rating number.
You might be better off going with vendor #1(the lower rated vendor) than with vendor #2. Even though vendor #2 had a higher rating than vendor #1.
But how can it be that vendor #2 has a higher rating? Indeed why. Well, he transacts more volume than vendor #1 which has the affect of aging and factoring the 4/5s rendering them moot. But the comments remain un-factored, un-averaged and unchanged in value because they are words and not part of some esoteric blackbox feedback algorithm.
It might be better off for SR to switch to a Positive/Neutral/Negative feedback system. Who really knows how to properly use the 1-5 system? It annoys and confuses buyers (as evidenced by threads asking what feedback number to leave). It annoys vendors when they get less than a 5/5 over trivial things or things that were solvable if only the buyer had contacted the vendor first. Worse still is when feedback is used to blackmail or purposely defame a vendor.
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If the numbers were close then 5/5. If it was 345 jump street and it was addressed to 52943 jump street 4/5.
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NEVER give a vendor less than a 5/5 unless they have proven to be unsatisfactory and cheat you with no resolve, ALSO if you do not recieve your product and it clearly states in their rules they do not offer refunds or reships to your area to order at your own risk NEVER rate less than 5/5.
But as far as this goes anything under 5/5 is seen as a terrible thing as it's been the stigma for so long. Give him a 5/5 and tell him he messed up on your address. ( heck maybe you did...) Either way its just a small mistake thankfully your postman is good as his/her job!
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it is a good point, However I would say that a 5/5 should be given. The vendor made a mistake , but consider why.
perhaps it is because h/she does not want to save your address in ANY way, So they manually write the addresses into a label machine or printer, They had 1 typo on one letter out of 20 orders. it would be hard to spot.
I think this was an honest mistake, and one that you should message them about, to remind them politely but leave them a 5/5.
Have you ever read one of those things where all the letters are jumbled up, But the last 2 are correct and your brain still registers the word that is meant to be written ? I can easily see how the mistake was made.
5/5 in my opinion.
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People are saying you should message the vendor first to resolve the issue. (You should definitely message the vendor.) But the issue cannot be resolved because it's already happened. You guys sound like you want him to get something from the vendor. Out of courtesy, I would alwayays so on the vendor pags contact the vendor before leaving less than 5/5, especially if it se. So yes, contact the vendor before leaving negative feedback. But what is the vendor going to do to change what already happened? Nothing. So maybe he'll give you 20% off your next order or refund your shipping or whatever but this would be basically buying your 5/5 rating.
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Yes I have a message into the vendor and am awaiting a response. And if it matters a 7 printed instead of a 1, not hand-written.
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Just logged back into SR to check my inbox, nothing...then check the vendor page and he/they are in stealth mode now and are apparently taking a small break for personal reasons. So I guess it could be hurry up and wait. But may I just say how overwhelmed I am at all the responses...this place rocks!
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Just logged back into SR to check my inbox, nothing...then check the vendor page and he/they are in stealth mode now and are apparently taking a small break for personal reasons. So I guess it could be hurry up and wait. But may I just say how overwhelmed I am at all the responses...this place rocks!
sounds like a big red flag to me because a 7 instead of a 1 means someone was reading a hand-written address. Meaning somewhere between his computer and whichever computer printed out your label, your address was written down. Maybe it was thrown away, maybe it was carelessly tossed aside. Maybe there's a whole sheet of paper filled with addresses and someone is typing them in. Either way, it seems like there's a lapse.
Oh and there is only a small chance that this is the case, but apparently there's a glitch in xerox machines where if you store the information on the machine and have it print the document that way, it can substitute characters because it 'mis-read.' So it could be the machine. But that wouldn't explain why it wasn't double checked before being sent.
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Or the vendor could have numerical dyslexia. Mixing up 1's, 7's, 9's.
Is there such a thing? LOL.
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Personally it would depend on the vendor for me. If this was the first time I'd ordered and it was screwed up I'd be more inclined to leave the 4/5 but generally I'm pretty gracious with my feedback so I'd probably still leave a 5/5. I would certainly message the vendor to see what was up and leave it in the feedback that the address was messed up so other potential customers can take that into consideration when ordering.
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OK...so here is the reply I received today from vendor, "There have been a few really wierd addresses sent to me, I'm almost tempted to not accept them, for example shipping to a mall, instead of a numerical address. Sorry if I deviated, but if I did I did it because I thought it looked more normal.
Glad you got it though and sorry, I don't mean to cause ANY problems to anyone due to my shipping.''
OMG and WTF????
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He changed the number in some address because it made the address "look more normal"?? WTF?!
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+1 to the vendor on creativity to get his packs through. Just switch up some numbers, 1's are unlucky.. gimme more 7's!
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Vendor name so i know not to fuck with this guy? ha
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OK...so here is the reply I received today from vendor, "There have been a few really wierd addresses sent to me, I'm almost tempted to not accept them, for example shipping to a mall, instead of a numerical address. Sorry if I deviated, but if I did I did it because I thought it looked more normal.
Glad you got it though and sorry, I don't mean to cause ANY problems to anyone due to my shipping.''
OMG and WTF????
The plot thickens...
He probably doesn't remember you specifically.
He's also probably checking addresses against USPS's database of correct addresses. Some vendors do this because some buyers do give weird drops and the vendor doesn't want the package being returned because the return address, real or not, is not a place they want the package sent back to.
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vendors getting addresses wrong is fukkin shocking - 3/5 max - he compromised your safety
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So here's the deal, while awaiting a response from vendor I read everyone's opinion a few times and had come to this conclusion: I believe in SR and what it stands for so I figured that I would just leave 5/5 with neutral comments figuring the response would be a blanket apology and we move on (and part ways). But when I read the message I was just floored, he had potentially compromised my security on various levels. I get the whole vendors don't want packages returned, but either ship to the address you are given or cancel the order should be the only two options.
I still have not finalized my order and there is 11 days left until it auto-finalizes. Probably will make a decision within the next day or so. The transaction in question was for 1 tab each of LSZ and AL-LAD so it's not like I'm tying up a bunch of money for the vendor, I just want to make sure I handle this the appropriate way.
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OK...so here is the reply I received today from vendor, "There have been a few really wierd addresses sent to me, I'm almost tempted to not accept them, for example shipping to a mall, instead of a numerical address. Sorry if I deviated, but if I did I did it because I thought it looked more normal.
Glad you got it though and sorry, I don't mean to cause ANY problems to anyone due to my shipping.''
OMG and WTF????
WTF. Some of these sellers really are getting too high on their own supply.
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If you haven't already been specific, I would send him another message saying something like "The address I gave you was number 12. You sent the package to number 72. This is not good at all. Further to that, it makes me suspect that you are hand-writing addresses down either for yourself or for somebody else. Thanks for the product but you really need to understand the importance of taking care of your customer's information and safety."
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You should still finalize now, IMO, since you received the product and so the funds should be released to him.
You can leave feedback whenever you are ready.
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My biggest pet peeve of SR is when I take an hour typing a response, click send and end at login page. Guess I should know better at this point. Hopefully I can explain again.
I will come right out and say that I am the vendor in question.
Only after reading this thread have I come to understand HOW I messed up the address. And I think I am able to account for the HOW, but I actually am going to agree with those who said I don't deserve a 5/5.
Since I started using TAILS, I have been unable to print directly from it. I have spent quite a few hours trying to see if it is possible, but I don't believe the drivers for my printer are available in linux.
The only way I know how, is to handwrite the address on a piece of paper. I shut down tails and my computer. I disable my network card, reboot in windows, type address onto my labels document. I then package and stamp my packages. I literally burn the piece of paper before going to drop. After returning I mark items in transit.
Therefore it is theoretically possible and even likely that I read my own handwriting wrong, a 7 and a 1 in this instance. There is really no excuse for this type of mistake and that is why I will agree a 5/5 may be out of order.
That said, allow me to explain my previous statement when I msgd hch back. I said "There have been a few really wierd addresses sent to me, I'm almost tempted to not accept them, for example shipping to a mall, instead of a numerical address. Sorry if I deviated, but if I did I did it because I thought it looked more normal. Glad you got it though and sorry, I don't mean to cause ANY problems to anyone due to my shipping."
When hch msged me, he told me I made an error but never told me how. Since I don't save any info, I assumed that his order was one of the extremely rare times that people send me a strange address/strange format of address. I consider this a normal format:
Name of person/business
Street address, apt # (if there is one)
City, ST, zipcode
I am a relatively new vendor, and as such, I like to give noobie buyers some accomodation. I do everything in my power to make sure that we are able to conduct a safe transaction (noobs and non noobs). It is not at all uncommon for me to message/instruct customers in proper address formatting, PGP encryption, proper shipping selection etc.
Still, I have recieved very strange shipping addresses, an example is:
EAST COAST MALL
NW
22
Unit 1 Suite B
New Jersey, New Jersey
66666
So when I recieve an address like this, 9/10 times I msg the customer and say "Are you SURE you would like me to ship to this address. 5/10 times they say "Yes I know it looks wierd, it works every time, send it"
2/10 times they say "oops, I actually meant so and so, or oops, the zip code is wrong" 1/10 times I get no response and I either cancel the order saying why. The other 1/10 times there have been a few instances where format is strange, but shipping info seems correct so I "deviate ever so slightly" to make it appear more normal. I assumed this is what happend so thats why I said what I did.
Please believe me when I say that MY and YOUR security is my top priority. If I ever did deviate (which I've done maybe twice ever, and both of those orders were recieved) It is because I don't want the P.O. to look at your letter twice. I want it to look as NORMAL as possible.
At this time, there is 1 out of 98 packages that have not shown up. I consider that 1 a horrible blotch on my record. I STILL think that it is going to come however.
Also regarding the statement I made "Glad you got it though and sorry, I don't mean to cause ANY problems to anyone due to my shipping."
Please know that I know what it is like to be a buyer (I was a buyer long before I was a vendor), and I would be absolutely pissed if I go to jail because of someone else's sloppiness. Now that I am a vendor I don't want anyone to go to jail for that same reason. Anyone who has ordered from me has seen the lengths I go to to make it stealthy as possible.
I have a heart and I don't want that on my conscience. I'm pretty sure I said more stuff that makes sense but after writing this response twice I am exhausted.
The only thing I can offer at this point is my DEEPEST apologies, as well as thanks for bringing it to my attention. While it doesn't feell good, and I don't enjoy being in the spotlight over a mistake, I think this will make me a better vendor in the future. I 100% understand if you or anyone else doesn't want to use me as a supplier because of this mistake.
<3 EAG
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OK...so here is the reply I received today from vendor, "There have been a few really wierd addresses sent to me, I'm almost tempted to not accept them, for example shipping to a mall, instead of a numerical address. Sorry if I deviated, but if I did I did it because I thought it looked more normal.
Glad you got it though and sorry, I don't mean to cause ANY problems to anyone due to my shipping.''
OMG and WTF????
WTF. Some of these sellers really are getting too high on their own supply.
I don't even bring marijuana in my own home because I don't want a THC molecule to fall on that piece of blotter. I basically quit smoking so I can be more on point, so your comment offends me a little bit.
You should read some of the messages I get from buyers, you would think they are in a k-hole due to they cant spell, incomplete thoughts, incomplete addressses, differing addresses, fake names, questions that have nothing to do with my products, btc, sr in general.
Someone once attempted to scam me on a priority order. They said I sent them bunk shit. I said ok send me your address again I'll do 100% refund or full reship. They said they would ONLY accept reship or leave 1/5 fb. I DO check addresses/zipcodes and I find out that the zipcode they sent me 2nd time does not exist. As they had never finalized I still had the previous tracking slip (which by the way does not contain ALL the info of an address, but it does provide the zip). I msged him back saying are you ABSOLUTELY sure this is the correct address. They reply yes.
I resent the package using the original zip. It ONLY got delivered correctly, because I deviated. I was waiting for them to try and resolve so I could expose them and they smartened up and finalized, surprisingly left me a 5/5.
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.. I basically quit smoking so I can be more on point, so your comment offends me a little bit.
Apologies for offending you - however you can see how your initial reply looked a bit bizarre, which is why I suggested he send you a message pointing out specifically what the mistake was. Somebody said earlier that you might not remember him / the address in question :-)
It reminded me of another thread where somebody was talking about a vendor giving completely nonsensical replies to their messages, so the "getting high on own supply" thing wasn't just with this thread in mind.
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Np I'm over it and regret my quick response to you,
I got touchy, writing hour long letters twice is draining.
I actually don't mind my changing of my lifestyle to do this. It never hurts to be clearer thinking and more organized.
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Np I'm over it and regret my quick response to you,
I got touchy, writing hour long letters twice is draining.
I actually don't mind my changing of my lifestyle to do this. It never hurts to be clearer thinking and more organized.
I understand - thanks :) I'm trying to think how you could get around your Tails / printer problem. I think you need a second computer, or a different printer, or maybe tails isn't necessary? I dunno. Certainly start writing your 1s differently anyway, LOL :)
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I'd say give them a 5/5
but make sure you send them a message explaining what happened.
Yup.. Outcome was good, but let the vendor know
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So for the conclusion...the vendor and I have exchanged several messages and have come to a mutual agreement. I believe in SR and can only imagine some of the crazy shit vendors have to deal with. Since I did receive my goods and through very sincere communications I truly believe the vendor did nothing maliciously so I have left him a 5/5. Hopefully we can all learn from this and not let history repeat itself. I may also add that this guy could've been a dick and just blew me off but he didn't and I really appreciated having the chance to work things out. Long live SR!!!
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Really glad to hear of the positive conclusion to this, and also good to hear from the vendor in person, who it turns out is not a wacky nonsensical crackpot at all (sorry), and has a perfectly decent explanation.
I actually had a similar thing happen today, and it's weird, it's not really their fault, but, I don't know whether I should tell them just so they know to look out for it next time, or not - I don't want to come across negative to somebody who has been very professional all the way through, and there's also a language barrier.
Here's what happened. My address was, e.g:
Jason Jeffries
24 Stockholm Street
Jeffington
JH2 2PH
United Kingdom
Now, this parcel was coming from a foreign country, still within the EU, but it was coming from Austria (lets say).
When it arrived, because of how the seller had folded the paper, and due to him using a "window envelope", and probably after the letter had been handled and shaken a bit by the postal system, well, the "United Kingdom" bit was below the window. When I received it I didn't think it was an international letter because of the missing country in the address, but then I looked at the stamp and postmark.
This makes me worry that the postal people in Austria could have opened the letter to reveal the full address so that they would know which country it was intended for. They would then have discovered the contents of course, and have the full address it was intended for including the country.
So, when the seller posted the letter, it might have been fine (or maybe not), but certainly when I received it, the folding of the paper had excluded the country from view.
Anyway I got it in two days, so i guess the Austrian postal service just recognizes English cities and postcodes or something, but it still crossed my mind, and I wondered if I should tell the seller about my concerns. I probably won't though, especially given the language barrier. He might think I'm moaning when I'm just trying to be helpful. What do you think?
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Really glad to hear of the positive conclusion to this, and also good to hear from the vendor in person, who it turns out is not a wacky nonsensical crackpot at all (sorry), and has a perfectly decent explanation.
I actually had a similar thing happen today, and it's weird, it's not really their fault, but, I don't know whether I should tell them just so they know to look out for it next time, or not - I don't want to come across negative to somebody who has been very professional all the way through, and there's also a language barrier.
Here's what happened. My address was, e.g:
Jason Jeffries
24 Stockholm Street
Jeffington
JH2 2PH
United Kingdom
Now, this parcel was coming from a foreign country, still within the EU, but it was coming from Austria (lets say).
When it arrived, because of how the seller had folded the paper, and due to him using a "window envelope", and probably after the letter had been handled and shaken a bit by the postal system, well, the "United Kingdom" bit was below the window. When I received it I didn't think it was an international letter because of the missing country in the address, but then I looked at the stamp and postmark.
This makes me worry that the postal people in Austria could have opened the letter to reveal the full address so that they would know which country it was intended for. They would then have discovered the contents of course, and have the full address it was intended for including the country.
So, when the seller posted the letter, it might have been fine (or maybe not), but certainly when I received it, the folding of the paper had excluded the country from view.
Anyway I got it in two days, so i guess the Austrian postal service just recognizes English cities and postcodes or something, but it still crossed my mind, and I wondered if I should tell the seller about my concerns. I probably won't though, especially given the language barrier. He might think I'm moaning when I'm just trying to be helpful. What do you think?
Dear God, tell him! You could be saving lives here! I could go to jail over something like this. The vendor needs to know immediately. Why are you so scared of this vendor? He made a mistake and you'd be helping him fix it.If he gets mad or whatever, he is clearly not a sensible person.
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I also think you should tell him ASAP!. It also seems like using a "window envelope" is a really bad idea. There are so many other inexpensive and better options.
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OK guys I will do, thank. I hope he understands what I am saying to him.