Silk Road forums

Support => Customer support => Topic started by: anonymousasshit on May 07, 2013, 08:49 pm

Title: First Resolution Center visit with Liston
Post by: anonymousasshit on May 07, 2013, 08:49 pm
Ok, I will make this as brief as I can, while still filling you in on the whole situation.

I made quite a few great orders with Liston.  He was always courteous and the first few orders, which were his smaller orders advertised as "samples" arrived really fast.  After my samples, he began marking things in transit and sending them a week to 10 days later, which I can tolerate and understand, due to the volatile BC market at times.  As orders went by, I got an order of K, something other than I regularly get, but not from Liston, but do have experience with, that I considered so bad, that I flushed it after one try.  It seemed to not have much of the ingredient and was possibly cut with others.  This was the order that I talked to him via email and asked him if I could place an order that was advertised as only from the UK unless you got a greater quantity, then you could get it delivered from the US, and he said no problem and did just what he said.  I explained to him that I had had problems with customs and I was afraid to do anything that was not domestic.  He said from now on, he would get all my orders from the US.  Even though this happened, at the time, I still left a 5 of 5 with positive comments because that was not what I usually get from him and I have other sources, and I wanted to keep a good relationship and keep ordering my Xans.

As I said, after quite a few orders and me having total faith in him with the Xanax.  He did me wrong.  I was literally a couple dollars short of my order and I messaged him and asked him if he would be willing to do a custom order for the same listing for me, minus a couple of dollars.  He said the couple of bucks was no issue.  I ordered a quantity of 150 Xans from the listing that was marked US to US.  He clearly instructed me to order the listing of 50, and send him the balance of my BC immediately, which I did and I thought everything was great.  The order, which I am disputing, is much less than the amount of BC that he had me directly send to him.  Anyway, about two weeks later, I got an envelope from the UK that has made it through customs, but rather than the larger padded envelopes, it was in a regular paper envelope.  I really didn't know what it was, as I had never had an order from Liston like this, and I didn't recognize it.  I got home, opened it, and it was a whole piece of white paper, wrapped around what was a bunch of broken crumbs with a lot of powder, some of which was in the envelope.  I didn't understand this and it didn't seem as big as my previous order of 150.  So I took it to a friends house, had him throw it on some digital scales, then took mine and started throwing them on the scales and when I got to about 48 ,they weighed the about the same.  I contacted Liston, explained the situation, and he basically told me he could not and would not help me out in the situation, and said that I had received the 150 and accused me of being dishonest.  Now I am in a dispute in the Resolution Center.  He offered a 10% refund, take it or leave it and I demand a 100% refund.

This is the catch:
I sent him a bulk of my BC directly, so if I were to get a 100% refund, it would actually be closer to a third of the total amount that I sent him for the order, rather than a total refund.  He admitted in the response that he did tell me to order 50 and send him the rest directly.

This is my question:
Will the fact that he had me send him a majority of the BC, and a total 100% refund that I am requesting is actually a small minority of the order total, be considered by the SR admin who decides my case? 

The order was placed a few weeks ago.  The case has been sitting in the Resolution center for a few days now, as I assume all the up and downs on SR due to the dumbass attackers, had the Admins backed up quite a bit. 

Our Stats:

Liston has tons of orders with around a 97 or 98 percent positive rating, many of which of the negatives have the same claim as mine.

Me:  I have 13 purchases, a little over 1.25 K spent, with a zero percent auto-finalization rate and zero percent refund rate.

I know that I will eventually find this out, but I am anxious, and thought this might be a good addition to the board, in case anyone else has a similar problem.

Any help, comments, or advice would be greatly appreciated.  Thank you for your time.
Title: Re: First Resolution Center visit with Liston
Post by: Libertas on May 07, 2013, 09:16 pm
Hi anonymousasshit,

Please read the Escrow section of the Silk Road Buyer's Guide:

http://dkn255hz262ypmii.onion/wiki/index.php?title=Buyer%27s_Guide#Escrow

It states that you are NEVER to pay a vendor directly, and to let Silk Road know if a vendor requests this from you. You say that he has admitted in resolution that he asked you to order 50 and send the rest of the Bitcoin to you directly; doing so is in direct violation of the terms that he agreed to abide by upon becoming a vendor and his seller privileges may be revoked as a result. In such a case I believe the administrator will provide you with the 100% refund that you have requested, though that is by no means a certainty.

Libertas
Title: Re: First Resolution Center visit with Liston
Post by: anonymousasshit on May 07, 2013, 09:31 pm
Thank you so much, I am going to copy and paste this into the Resolution Center, as you seem to know a lot more than me and your opinion should add a lot of weight to my case considering he has so many more sales than I have buys.
Title: Re: First Resolution Center visit with Liston
Post by: Libertas on May 07, 2013, 09:49 pm
Thank you so much, I am going to copy and paste this into the Resolution Center, as you seem to know a lot more than me and your opinion should add a lot of weight to my case considering he has so many more sales than I have buys.

You're very welcome, I hope it all works out. My opinion will not add any weight to the case as administrators make their decisions based solely on the evidence available to them and they are well aware of the rules governing out of escrow transactions. They will be able to check both yours and Liston's account and messaging histories to confirm that he did indeed request that you pay him outside of escrow, and that you did send the payment.

Please do not go around the escrow system in future; it is there for your protection!

Libertas
Title: Re: First Resolution Center visit with Liston
Post by: anonymousasshit on May 07, 2013, 10:15 pm
I appreciate advice.  About an hour before I posted this, I placed an order and FE'd without even being asked to, but in the future I will Always take your advice and USE THE ESCROW system.

I want to clarify something that I said in my initial post, he didn't come out and say, I asked him to send money outside of escrow.  He does say that the order was for 150 and that he sent 150, but the dispute is over an order of 50.  Here are the details at the top of the Resolution Center:

Transaction details

    item: 50 Xanax 2mg bar's by Liston
    quantity: 1
    buyer: [retracted]
    seller: liston
    date shipped: April 17, 2013, *:33 am UTC
    due in: past due May 2, 2013, *:55 pm UTC

If the SR Admin reads our emails, he will see that Liston asked me to order 50, then send the balance of my BC account for the order of 150.  This is also supported by my transaction history, where you see an and order then a transfer:

send to    liston(97)    ฿-2.57    ฿0.00    April 17, 2013, *:18 am UTC
purchase    transaction #*********    ฿-2.05    ฿2.57    April 17, 2013, *:15 am UTC

I left out the exact times and trans # because I don't want to violate any rules by giving the specifics of my order, in case that could be used against SR or any of us.

I used your advice and added to the Resolution Center that the Admin should read our emails and that he violated the rules for sellers.

You have been an immense help and I suggest you go law school, if you haven't already.  You have a keen eye for the details and read and understand all the rules very thoroughly.   

By the way, can the SR Admin see my transaction details?  I have asked him to look at our emails, and my transaction records, because I assumed that was something the Admins could see.

NOTE
He marked it as shipped in the same hour, just 15 minutes after I sent him the transfer, which is common for him.   Might I add, this was a few hours after midnight in the Eastern Time Zone.

UPDATE
I added the following to the Resolution Center dispute between Liston and myself:

Admin,

After reading the rules and getting some advice, I consider the total amount of the order to be 4.62 Bitcoins. Liston clearly violated the terms he agreed to when becoming a vendor and thus, the total amount of the order which would constitute a 100% refund is 4.62 Bitcoins. I respectfully ask that you award me this amount, as the emails, transaction history, and the contents of this dispute here in the Resolutions Center prove that is the case.

send to liston(97) ฿-2.57 ฿0.00 April 17, 2013, 3:18 am UTC
purchase transaction #135c6500f7 ฿-2.05 ฿2.57 April 17, 2013, 3:15 am UTC


I am keeping my fingers crossed that Liston will see this, read the rules and realize his mistake and just send me back my BC.  I think I have already lost dollars, but I would like to get my total BC amount for the order back.

Once again, I am greatly appreciative of you and your lightening fast response to my concern in this matter.


EDIT: "buyer name" retracted at poster's request.
Title: Re: First Resolution Center visit with Liston
Post by: Libertas on May 07, 2013, 11:45 pm
I appreciate advice.  About an hour before I posted this, I placed an order and FE'd without even being asked to, but in the future I will Always take your advice and USE THE ESCROW system.

I want to clarify something that I said in my initial post, he didn't come out and say, I asked him to send money outside of escrow.  He does say that the order was for 150 and that he sent 150, but the dispute is over an order of 50.  Here are the details at the top of the Resolution Center:

Transaction details

    item: 50 Xanax 2mg bar's by Liston
    quantity: 1
    buyer: [retracted]
    seller: liston
    date shipped: April 17, 2013, *:33 am UTC
    due in: past due May 2, 2013, *:55 pm UTC

If the SR Admin reads our emails, he will see that Liston asked me to order 50, then send the balance of my BC account for the order of 150.  This is also supported by my transaction history, where you see an and order then a transfer:

send to    liston(97)    ฿-2.57    ฿0.00    April 17, 2013, *:18 am UTC
purchase    transaction #*********    ฿-2.05    ฿2.57    April 17, 2013, *:15 am UTC

I left out the exact times and trans # because I don't want to violate any rules by giving the specifics of my order, in case that could be used against SR or any of us.

I used your advice and added to the Resolution Center that the Admin should read our emails and that he violated the rules for sellers.

You have been an immense help and I suggest you go law school, if you haven't already.  You have a keen eye for the details and read and understand all the rules very thoroughly.   

By the way, can the SR Admin see my transaction details?  I have asked him to look at our emails, and my transaction records, because I assumed that was something the Admins could see.

NOTE
He marked it as shipped in the same hour, just 15 minutes after I sent him the transfer, which is common for him.   Might I add, this was a few hours after midnight in the Eastern Time Zone.

UPDATE
I added the following to the Resolution Center dispute between Liston and myself:

Admin,

After reading the rules and getting some advice, I consider the total amount of the order to be 4.62 Bitcoins. Liston clearly violated the terms he agreed to when becoming a vendor and thus, the total amount of the order which would constitute a 100% refund is 4.62 Bitcoins. I respectfully ask that you award me this amount, as the emails, transaction history, and the contents of this dispute here in the Resolutions Center prove that is the case.

send to liston(97) ฿-2.57 ฿0.00 April 17, 2013, 3:18 am UTC
purchase transaction #135c6500f7 ฿-2.05 ฿2.57 April 17, 2013, 3:15 am UTC


I am keeping my fingers crossed that Liston will see this, read the rules and realize his mistake and just send me back my BC.  I think I have already lost dollars, but I would like to get my total BC amount for the order back.

Once again, I am greatly appreciative of you and your lightening fast response to my concern in this matter.

The administrator will only consider the amount of Bitcoin that was held in escrow as contributing to the total amount of the order because that is the order that you made through the Silk Road order system. This is why staying in escrow is so important;once you send funds outside escrow there is literally nothing that can be done - they are gone.

A 100% refund will only constitute of the amount that was held in escrow but I hope you get a satisfactory result.

Locking this thread as resolved.

Libertas